The EV Naysayers

[Jimrpa]

"The use of child labor in cobalt mines in the Democratic Republic of the Congo, where nearly 60% of the world's cobalt is currently produced, is certainly a major issue that deserves the attention of consumers, corporations, and governments. However, some media outlets and social media users have distorted the issue into a rallying cry against the use of electric cars and clean energy."

Not to derail the conversation, but a lot of the problem with “child mining labor” in Africa and elsewhere doesn’t happen in the mines. What happens is that, outside the mines, there are large piles of waste from the mining process. Unscrupulous people get children to dig through the waste, with their hands, looking for small amounts of minerals missed by the mining process.

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[Mirak]

Seriously peeps, don’t engage.

 

[RandyMache]

Not to derail the conversation, but a lot of the problem with “child mining labor” in Africa and elsewhere doesn’t happen in the mines. What happens is that, outside the mines, there are large piles of waste from the mining process. Unscrupulous people get children to dig through the waste, with their hands, looking for small amounts of minerals missed by the mining process.

I'm sure that's true........

 

[azerik]

 

[nvabill]

Broccoli is good for you too.

Most people don’t like being forced to eat it though.

Adults tend to like to make their own decisions, especially when it comes to their money.

Remember when they tried to make large sodas illegal? ?

Exercise is also good for you! ?

 

[ctenidae]

Why try to force insufficient battery tech, or be upset that most Americans don’t want it, when none of the current objections will be issues with the next jump in battery tech?

The mandates are supposed to push battery development, and the subsidies are supposed to help pay for it. I agree with you, no one should be upset most American drivers don't want/can't use an EV. We should be happy that some do, and more are.

 

[ctenidae]

Decisions become a little more complicated when there is a price tag involved.

Decisions should be easier when you put dollar signs on it. Only 2 decimal places, at least.
The decision tree gets simplified early in the process - Can I afford this? No? Gargantuan soda, then.

 

[ctenidae]

Broccoli is good for you too.

Most people don’t like being forced to eat it though.

Adults tend to like to make their own decisions, especially when it comes to their money.

Remember when they tried to make large sodas illegal? ?

But we can be suckered into putting cauliflower in pizza dough.

I think banning mega sodas was a dumb idea. It should count against your healthcare access instead, so your decisions directly affect you.

Burning fossil fuels affects everyone around you, so that question is a little broader than whether you've got broccoli stuck in your teeth. At some point it's helpful to expand our thinking about individual freedoms beyond ourselves and see what impact our choices have on others.

At that point, if someone wants to roll coal on a Tesla at least they're making an informed, intentional decision, and can/should be held accountable by society at large through the methods available to it.

 

[Mach1E]

But we can be suckered into putting cauliflower in pizza dough.

I think banning mega sodas was a dumb idea. It should count against your healthcare access instead, so your decisions directly affect you.

Burning fossil fuels affects everyone around you, so that question is a little broader than whether you've got broccoli stuck in your teeth. At some point it's helpful to expand our thinking about individual freedoms beyond ourselves and see what impact our choices have on others.

At that point, if someone wants to roll coal on a Tesla at least they're making an informed, intentional decision, and can/should be held accountable by society at large through the methods available to it.

Gas guzzler and gas taxes.

They figured the “sin Taxes” out decades ago.

Encouraging “good behavior” seems to work with financial incentives and disincentives. Helps pay the bills too.

 

[DugthePug Dad]

I don’t think forcing EVs on Anyone is a good thing.

Americans should be able to choose what vehicles they want, period!

Both parties and their cronies suck!

 

[B177y]

Let the market figure it out on it's own.

If an EV and the charging infrastructure are a superior product, people will gravitate towards it naturally.

If ICE and the infrastructure provides the superior product, people will naturally gravitate towards it.

Forcing people in either direction backfires as there are always unintended consequences and lots of "tentacles" that affect the intended outcome.

 

[johnmark]

Let the market figure it out on it's own. If an EV and the charging infrastructure are a superior product, people will gravitate towards it naturally. If ICE and the infrastructure provides the superior product, people will naturally gravitate towards it. Forcing people in either direction backfires as there are always unintended consequences and lots of "tentacles" that affect the intended outcome. The "market" seems to want us all dead. Not sure it's the most trusted decider of anything. Obligatory Hamilton quote: "can we get back to politics?"

 

[VindictivePantz]

The no-ICE mandates in CA and other states will probably have to be extended, but constraints can force invention and innovation. Example - Fuel efficiency has improved through what looks like a combination of regulation and market forces:

Highlights of the Automotive Trends Report | US EPA

While EVs look like they have removed a decent amount of "oil" per day, it's eBikes and others that are having a bigger impact.

Though, by 2035, EVs may not be a thing.

I'm still holding out hope for Mr. Fusion.

 

[jay1122]

Instead of a hard ban, just jack up the price of gas. Get some extra tax income for the government too. CA has expensive gas. Their EVs are selling like hot cakes.

 

[mkhuffman]

Instead of a hard ban, just jack up the price of gas. Get some extra tax income for the government too. CA has expensive gas. Their EVs are selling like hot cakes.

Yeah, let's just penalize the poor because they can't afford a $62k MME. If they can't afford to pay for gas, I guess they can just take government hand-outs and sit at home and watch TV. Or they can walk to work in in the rain. Who cares about them anyway, right?

Do you care at all about how these policies impact real people who have real bills and real families?

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