Auto Reload on Charging Apps

[emichnov]

I've noticed many charging apps require "auto reload", where they charge your credit card for more than you need to charge. As far as i know, not a single gas station in the US does this - they all simply charge your card for whatever you used. Fair and square. Why the difference? It is particularly egregious when you are in an unfamilar place and only have an odd ball charger to use. You create the account, charge, then have a balance left you have no chance in hell at ever using.

Not only is this annoying, but i think it is a another barrier to entry for new EV users. So easy to pay for a refill on the gas side, and so difficult on the ev side.

Am i the only one who feels this way?

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[GatorGrowl]

I suspect it has to do with credit card fees. The fee on a cash payment is up to half that of a retail transaction. You also experience fewer transactions, which lowers your per transaction fees.
This is why places like Starbucks and Wal-mart give you a bonus for loading money on a gift card and using that to pay.
With that said, I agree with you that I dislike the practice and avoid those networks whenever possible.

 

[emichnov]

I suspect it has to do with credit card fees. The fee on a cash payment is up to half that of a retail transaction.

I'm sure you are correct, but if so, I wonder why wouldn't it be the same for a gas station?

 

[GatorGrowl]

I'm sure you are correct, but if so, I wonder why wouldn't it be the same for a gas station?

It is - gas stations would prefer you use their cards. Circle K, Mobil, and Shell, for example, offer a $0.10 per gallon discount for using their payment system in place of a credit card.

My experience with prepaid networks is limited to OUC/ChargeUp - which is only found in Orlando, FL. They charge far less (0.30) per kWh than the other networks (avg 0.48). I assume they are using prepay as a way to keep their costs down.

 

[kodiakng]

Am i the only one who feels this way?

i get quite annoyed with this practice too, especially when it isn't disclosed at the time. the float of the balance is essentially a "loan" to the company and really adds up when you multiply by the number of users.

EA is the only EV charging app i have that does this though - EVgo, ChargePoint, EVCS, FordPass, and Tesla all charge for the session when dispensed. which others are you seeing this with?

 

[music_cities]

I'm especially annoyed at Shell Recharge, it said the $10 credit didn't go through, so I tried again. It said it didn't go through the second time. So, I entered a different credit card and tried again. This time, it didn't say it didn't go through, but it also didn't say it went through. I decided to try charging to see if the third transaction went through.

Guess what? All three transactions went through. I had a $30 credit. I used $10.92 of it, so now I have $19.08 that I have to use somehow.

To add insult, I only chose this charger in Chilliwack BC because I knew we would be arriving near noon and this one had a good restaurant next to it. But, by the time I had started the charge I couldn't remember the restaurant, I got confused at which direction to walk, and ended up having substandard sandwiches at Tim Hortons.

Fortunately Shell Recharge credits can be used at Flo chargers, so I should be able to use them up.

 

[emichnov]

which others are you seeing this with?

Good question. I first ran into this on a trip into Canada where i was at an isolated place and had to use the "Electric Circuit" app. They took from my card more than i needed for a charge. Really annoying.

Second time i ran into this was in Utica NY at what was then a Shell charger (I think). The app took out $20 every time you tried to charge. I didn't know it at the time, but there was an issue with Mach-e's charging at Shell chargers. I tried to charge 3 times, but it would try to start but fail to charge. So they charged me $60 yet I never got a single kW of charge. Geez, thanks, guys. Customer service refunded my money, but it was totally unnecessary had they done the ethical thing and simply charged me for usage. I will avoid Shell at all cost in the future, and encourage others to do they same until they change their ways.

Another time I ran into this is just today, when I set up the EA app for the first time as my charging bundle balance will run out soon. I see they will charge a fix amount before you charge. While I expect to charge at EA stations a lot over time, so likely won't be a waste, it is still annoying.

 

[kodiakng]

Good question. I first ran into this on a trip into Canada where i was at an isolated place and had to use the "Electric Circuit" app. They took from my card more than i needed for a charge. Really annoying.

Second time i ran into this was in Utica NY at what was then a Shell charger (I think). The app took out $20 every time you tried to charge. I didn't know it at the time, but there was an issue with Mach-e's charging at Shell chargers. I tried to charge 3 times, but it would try to start but fail to charge. So they charged me $60 yet I never got a single kW of charge. Geez, thanks, guys. Customer service refunded my money, but it was totally unnecessary had they done the ethical thing and simply charged me for usage. I will avoid Shell at all cost in the future, and encourage others to do they same until they change their ways.

Another time I ran into this is just today, when I set up the EA app for the first time as my charging bundle balance will run out soon. I see they will charge a fix amount before you charge. While I expect to charge at EA stations a lot over time, so likely won't be a waste, it is still annoying.

ok, now i'm curious if what you're describing is a "pre-authorization charge", aka "pre-auth hold" on a credit/debit card that is then corrected when the final total charge is known. when you first start a session with a credit/debit card the merchant will usually charge some round number as a pre-auth to make sure you have funds available. it then gets corrected before the pre-auth times out.

this happens at gas stations that require you to put in a credit card prior to pumping; hotels, restaurants, etc too.

as you note, multiple pre-auths can happen when you have a failed charging session and retry over and over again. obviously, these add up and are annoying and i'd also be concerned the company wouldn't clear out the charge correctly after i'm gone without ever getting served power.

the "auto-reload" i was thinking of is what happens at EA when you have an account with a registered card that then maintains some balance on your account after each charge is finalized.

just trying to clarify the distinction. if i didn't use my EA app to do the charge i'd be able to pay as i go for each session as i do elsewhere.

 

[emichnov]

Good distinction. It is quite possible my experience with Shell were "pre-authorization charges". My impression was all of them were charges that would have actually gone through. But there was no way I was going to wait to find out., so I called Customer support that same day.

The EA and "Electric Circuit" app are definitely actual charges.

 

[kdonnel]

Why the difference?

When gas stations were first created no industry had thought about also operating as a bank in addition to the service they were providing.

Present day companies love the idea of also operating as a bank.

Starbucks mentioned on an earnings call in Q1 2023 that people loaded $3.3 billion to gift cards in the US that quarter. That is $3.3 billion that I believe is earning interest until used. That is $3.3 billion that can't be spent anywhere but Starbucks.

Then there is breakage. Eventually the unused gift card balances can be converted into income. It is free money at that point because they did not have to provide a service. Starbucks makes close to $200 million a year in breakage.

The EV charging companies want to work the same way. If they can normalize the idea that forcing customers to load an in app gift card is fine, they can earn money on the money sitting there until used and hopefully turn it into breakage income. They will also have locked in money from the consumer that can't be spent anywhere else.

Gas stations would love to go back in time and implement a similar system.

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