Dealer wanted to charge me $1400 for updates!

[MME_Adventurist]

Sheehy Ford, Gaitherburg, MD to be exact. They say because the updates aren't recalls. Does Tesla charge for updates like this? I wish I had know this before I bought the car. I'll likely not get another Ford. Not a good experience at all.

Glad I didn't order my Mach E from them!

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[Ghost Ryder]

I'm in the "If it ain't broke, don't fix it crowd." All I want from my car is for it to be reliable, and work as intended. That goes for the app also. How many times have we heard updates breaking PAAKs?

As far as dealers charging to update non warranty related items, I feel that someone has to pay for the time. Whether its FORD or the owner, that's up for debate, but its unfair to expect the dealer to absorb the cost.

If you want Ford to pay for it, are you willing to accept a slightly higher MSRP as FORD will just pass along the cost. The consumer will end up paying one way or another, its just when and how much.

 

[TonyaE]

OTA updates are free with Ford too, but we're not talking about OTA. Is there another car manufacturer that will pay dealers to manually install any and all updates to every module of the car for life, regardless of warranty status? I don't think so.

Some people just want the knowledge that every module in their car is always running the latest version of code, even if there are no noticeable changes. I'm one of those people, so I totally get it. That's why I bought an FDRS license and perform all updates as soon as they're released. If it's not worth it to others, that's fine. But don't expect to get all the latest updates unless they're pushed out OTA or are part of a service campaign that will pay the dealers to install them.

Does the car tell you when an update is available? How did he know he could get these updates?

 

[MillieChliette]

Glad I didn't order my Mach E from them!

Sheehy is the best dealer in the area. No games, no ADM on orders, always happy to help. This OP is trying to slander them for not wanting to do completely unnecessary work for free. Ridiculous.

And I hope you got a signed purchase order from whatever dealer you DID order from because everyone else nearby was charging 5k-10k ADM when I ordered mine in July. And it's only gotten worse.

 

[RickMachE]

Haven't read the entire thread, but OP's car appears to be a Q4 produced vehicle, therefore not eligible for any complimentary updates at this point. Therefore, dealer is doing exactly what they should do.

 

[generaltso]

Does the car tell you when an update is available? How did he know he could get these updates?

Somebody with FDRS checked for him (it may have been me). The general public would never know these updates exist until they’re pushed out OTA.

 

[TonyaE]

Somebody with FDRS checked for him (it may have been me). The general public would never know these updates exist until they’re pushed out OTA.

Perfect, I will not be looking for trouble. Waiting for OTA is great for me. Thanks for explaining.

 

[newmme]

When do we get OTA for more than fixes? Ford said things like dog mode, etc were being considered. What about sentry mode, Netflix, car wash mode, horsepower increases, camp mode, etc. When do we actually get cool new stuff? That is the best part of OTA.

 

[HuntingPudel]

Somebody with FDRS checked for him (it may have been me). The general public would never know these updates exist until they’re pushed out OTA.

I don’t know this, which is why I am asking. Does Brand T have something like FDRS that an end-user can purchase in order to run his VIN and discover what software is downrev? If they don’t, we do not know how long it is between the time a software module is released and it becomes available as an OTA package.

That said, FOMOCO has brought on several key people in order to try to get the OTA process smoothed out. This is all stuff that can be fixed and Ford is in process of fixing.

 

[generaltso]

I don’t know this, which is why I am asking. Does Brand T have something like FDRS that an end-user can purchase in order to run his VIN and discover what software is downrev?

I don't know, but since not all Teslas even have an easily accessible OBDII port, I doubt it.

 

[louibluey]

I have wrestled with this issue since being unable to find a local dealer who would do the 12V SSM update for my FE with the early 12V problem (different case, but that is what got me started thinking about MME updates).

When I finally did find a kind service dealer, not only did they do the 12V related module updates, but as I requested, they updated everything. It took them under an hour to do the 12V SSM, then they let it update overnight, and fought some update problems through the next day. I really felt bad for imposing on them that way, and offered to pay something for the extra work, but they would not hear of it. I felt good that I had filled the unexpected loaner car before I returned it to them.

OTOH, I had to counsel them on connecting a 12V charger (there was none connected, when we discussed letting it run overnight, they had somehow stacked the updates which were running successively). Also, they lost one of my cherished clips which I keep having to replace (not a big deal).

So, that was when, following @generaltso's post on the Mongoose, I canceled my VM3 back order, and got a Mongoose, bought a PL6100, bought a Windows Thinkpad, and went for DIY FDRS, hook, line, and sinker.

I think I see both sides of the argument more clearly now. Take note also, that a lot of the people cautioning, that a MME owner does not need all updates if there is no problem, are us DIY FDRS people.

MME is not like a phone or a computer with one to a few systems to update. MME has many computers, and each gets updated, in several different ways. There is some rough similarity too, clearly Windows and Mac updates solve many problems that only apply to some users, such as some users with some add on hardware.

Like or not (I am conflicted), Ford's policy is that many of the module updates are only to solve some very specific problems, which most of us will never see. Heck, it could even be for a specific version of the module that any given owner does not have. OTOH, for those horrendous problems that only some small percentage will see, I see the update as a possible inoculation, where I don't want to play LOTTO to see if it happens to me.

That said, I share the view of the OP, I would like my MME to be completely up to date, for what updates are slated for my VIN, and for OCD like minded individuals like me (apparently there are more than a few), Ford gives us that opportunity by allowing DIY FDRS. I doubt that many automotive manufacturers are willing to suffer the extra grief a DIY community comes with, pretty close to ham radio club or a high school internship at a local corporation. Hat's off to Ford for putting up with us, and we contribute some too.

OTA is clearly not at 100% fast and accurate delivery yet, probably someday it will be. I guess OTA is the closest thing to a Windows or Mac update there will ever be short term. Clearly Ford would like to have OTA work without needing dealer intervention, it probably will at some point.

Until then, DIY FDRS is the only practical way to get all updates, need them or not for those of us with that unexplainable primal urge to do all MME updates, to know that our MME is completely up to date. Of course DIY FDRS users might get some cool stuff a few weeks/months before some OTA people, but short of the recent BlueCruise wave, no way to tell what might come later. Or, you might screw up your MME too (fortunately, no unrecoverable DIY FDRS stories yet that I know of).

Considering the way dealers are screwing up MME SW Updates nationwide, they may have done you a favor, by pricing it so high an owner would not want it (assuming no mandatory / authorized updates, and just wanting to be up to date).

 

[jlauro]

As far as dealers charging to update non warranty related items, I feel that someone has to pay for the time. Whether its FORD or the owner, that's up for debate, but its unfair to expect the dealer to absorb the cost.

If the dealer is charged you ADM, then I think it's fair for them to absorb the cost.

 

[HuntingPudel]

I have wrestled with this issue since being unable to find a local dealer who would do the 12V SSM update for my FE with the early 12V problem (different case, but that is what got me started thinking about MME updates).

When I finally did find a kind service dealer, not only did they do the 12V related module updates, but as I requested, they updated everything. It took them under an hour to do the 12V SSM, then they let it update overnight, and fought some update problems through the next day. I really felt bad for imposing on them that way, and offered to pay something for the extra work, but they would not hear of it. I felt good that I had filled the unexpected loaner car before I returned it to them.

OTOH, I had to counsel them on connecting a 12V charger (there was none connected, when we discussed letting it run overnight, they had somehow stacked the updates which were running successively). Also, they lost one of my cherished clips which I keep having to replace (not a big deal).

So, that was when, following @generaltso's post on the Mongoose, I canceled my VM3 back order, and got a Mongoose, bought a PL6100, bought a Windows Thinkpad, and went for DIY FDRS, hook, line, and sinker.

I think I see both sides of the argument more clearly now. Take note also, that a lot of the people cautioning, that a MME owner does not need all updates if there is no problem, are us DIY FDRS people.

MME is not like a phone or a computer with one to a few systems to update. MME has many computers, and each gets updated, in several different ways. There is some rough similarity too, clearly Windows and Mac updates solve many problems that only apply to some users, such as some users with some add on hardware.

Like or not (I am conflicted), Ford's policy is that many of the module updates are only to solve some very specific problems, which most of us will never see. Heck, it could even be for a specific version of the module that any given owner does not have. OTOH, for those horrendous problems that only some small percentage will see, I see the update as a possible inoculation, where I don't want to play LOTTO to see if it happens to me.

That said, I share the view of the OP, I would like my MME to be completely up to date, for what updates are slated for my VIN, and for OCD like minded individuals like me (apparently there are more than a few), Ford gives us that opportunity by allowing DIY FDRS. I doubt that many automotive manufacturers are willing to suffer the extra grief a DIY community comes with, pretty close to ham radio club or a high school internship at a local corporation. Hat's off to Ford for putting up with us, and we contribute some too.

OTA is clearly not at 100% fast and accurate delivery yet, probably someday it will be. I guess OTA is the closest thing to a Windows or Mac update there will ever be short term. Clearly Ford would like to have OTA work without needing dealer intervention, it probably will at some point.

Until then, DIY FDRS is the only practical way to get all updates, need them or not for those of us with that unexplainable primal urge to do all MME updates, to know that our MME is completely up to date. Of course DIY FDRS users might get some cool stuff a few weeks/months before some OTA people, but short of the recent BlueCruise wave, no way to tell what might come later. Or, you might screw up your MME too (fortunately, no unrecoverable DIY FDRS stories yet that I know of).

Considering the way dealers are screwing up MME SW Updates nationwide, they may have done you a favor, by pricing it so high an owner would not want it (assuming no mandatory / authorized updates, and just wanting to be up to date).

And some of us wait a week or three for guys on the bleeding edge like you, @generaltso, and @DevSecOps to play with the updates. We learn the pitfalls from you guys so our FDRS updates go more smoothly (even though I've been sponging off of @scoopman 's subscription I've been waiting).

 

[DevSecOps]

And some of us wait a week or three for guys on the bleeding edge like you, @generaltso, and @DevSecOps to play with the updates. We learn the pitfalls from you guys so our FDRS updates go more smoothly (even though I've been sponging off of @scoopman 's subscription I've been waiting).

Easiest solution ... stay off the forums and you'll never know there's an update available. Then when it arrives via OTA it'll be a surprise!

I only come here anymore when someone tags me (points finger at @HuntingPudel).

 

[HuntingPudel]

Easiest solution ... stay off the forums and you'll never know there's an update available. Then when it arrives via OTA it'll be a surprise!

I only come here anymore when someone tags me (points finger at @HuntingPudel).

Poke-poke-poke. LOL

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