EVSE 48A (Hardwired) vs 40A (Plug In)

[dmturner]

I ordered the Ford Connected Charge Station 48-amp and like many it’s currently on stop-sale backorder (my local dealer said out until April).

I’ve been driving my new Mach E w ext battery (10 miles each way) to a pubic charge station, when my battery level gets low (30%). Not optimal and certainly not how I envisioned my initial EV experience would have started.

My dilemma is I don’t want to pay for an electrician to come out and install a 240V NEMA 14-50 wall outlet only to change the configuration later $$ when the Ford Connected Station is shipped out. Plus if I pay for an electrician to install the EVSE, why not get the better kW/h option.

So now I’m weighing out my options on what to do.
A) do I cancel the Ford Connected Charge Station and re-order another 3rd party EVSE
B) or wait it out until the unit ships

Then I read on the Mach E forum where some users make great points; do you really need a faster charge where you travel that far that warrants the 48A/h option. Another post read, it’s better to have the 240V/40A 9.6 kW/h NEMA 14-50 wall outlet option for if the EVSE unit goes bad. You can simply swap it out with the Ford Mobile Charger.

Here are my EVSE options I am considering:

Ford Connected Charge Station $799.00 (currently Stop Sale published 2/19 until sometime in April)
up to 240V, 48A charge rate, when paired with a 60A circuit
hard-wired
20 ft Cable with SAE J1772 standard plug
UL-Listed, eligible for utility rebates and other incentives

Pros/Cons:
Use the FordPass App to remotely lock and unlock the charge station
Hard wired box is not optimal if the unit goes bad or if there’s a newer better model
cord length is 20 ft, whereas enel X has the best distance of 25 ft
Pricier than the other EVSEs

ChargePoint Home Flex $699 (the only top rated 48A charger in stock at the moment)
up to 240V, 50A charge rate, when paired with a 65A circuit
Can be hardwired or NEMA 14-50 Plug configured
- On a 50 amp breaker with the NEMA 14-50 Plug option, this configuration will provide up to 40 amps (9.6kW)
- In order to get 48 amps 11kW+, you need to hardwire to a 70 amp breaker or special order a 65A breaker (50A * 1.25 = 62.5, any breaker over 62.5)
23-foot charging cable SAE J1772 standard plug
UL-Listed, eligible for utility rebates and other incentives

Pros/Cons:
Availability Now vs Later
Non vendor specific

enel X JuiceBox 48 $659 (not available until late march/early April I’m told)
up to 240V, 48A / 11.5 kW
25-foot charging cable SAE J1772 standard plug
UL Listed, eligible for utility rebates and other incentives

Alternative option is the enel X JuiceBox 40 (Hardwired $629, Plug In $619 both available)
up to 240V, 40A, 9.6 kW charge rate
25-foot charging cable SAE J1772 standard plug
UL Listed, eligible for utility rebates and other incentives

Pros/Cons:
Non vendor specific
cord length is 25 ft

Charge Times:
Ford Connected Charge Station, ChargePoint Home Flex or JuiceBox 48 - 240V X 48A/h = 11.52 kW/h = 10.1 hours to fully charge a 300-mile extended-range Mach-E battery
ChargePoint or JuiceBox 40 using 240V/40A 9.6 kW/h NEMA 14-50 wall outlet needs 12 hours to fully charge a 300-mile extended-range Mach-E battery
Ford Mobile Charger using 240V/30A 7.2 kW/h NEMA 14-50 wall outlet needs 15 hours to fully charge a 300-mile extended-range Mach-E battery
Not even considering the 120-volt plug (emergency use only option) 95 – 100 hours

Public Locations:
150 kW/h - The estimated time required to DC fast-charge a Mustang Mach-E from 10 percent to 80 percent charge is approx. 45 minutes for the extended-range battery
50 kW/h - The estimated time required to DC fast-charge a Mustang Mach-E from 10 percent to 80 percent charge is approx. 85 minutes for the extended-range battery
22 kW/h - The estimated time required to DC fast-charge a Mustang Mach-E from 10 percent to 80 percent charge is approx. 7 hours for the extended-range battery

* Once a battery charge reached 80%, charge time is significantly reduced. The battery will accept a higher rate of charge when it is more “empty”. Cold weather, driving behaviors, vehicle maintenance, and battery age and state of health will have an influence

Looking for guidance on what to do, again Im new to EV. ~Newbie

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[SnBGC]

I recommend the Charge Point Home Flex. It appears to be well built. Check with your utility company because sometimes they offer rebates or instant discounts when purchased from their website. I bought mine for $450 directly from my utility provider.

 

[JamieGeek]

Only you can decide what you want to do.

A thought: How often will you come home to a depleted battery (say <10%) and need to leave again in the early morning with it fully charged?

If the answer is: Not often, never, or rarely then you don't need any 48amp charger and just go with any charger that will plug into the 14-50 plug.

In addition to that: You don't really need a "smart" charger either as a lot of that functionality is in the car (charge times specifically).

 

[Trede]

In addition to that: You don't really need a "smart" charger either as a lot of that functionality is in the car (charge times specifically).

This. All the bells and whistles in the fancy chargers add more things that can break. Your car has to "know" most of that crap anyway to charge safely (and communicate its limitations to DCFC, etc etc). I have one of the base Clipper Creek chargers and I love it. Built like a tank, literally no frills. Just provides power when the vehicles wants it, and opens the relay when it doesn't.

 

[louibluey]

+1 for chargepoint flex (what I use), but a lot of EV owners like juice box products too.

I think you have a minor error, chargepoint flex installs hardwired with a 60A breaker for 48A service (20% rule). Just be sure your electrician knows the 50A round up rule does not apply for a continuous load, and you cannot use regular #6 Romex. The answer is #6 THHN either separate wires in a conduit, or the metal clad #6 THHN which looks like the old BX cables (spiral aluminum cladding).

(oh, I see, you were looking at the 50A case with a 65A breaker. No point, MME can only accept 48A, even if it could accept 50A, the extra expense is definitely not worth it)

Also, going to larger ampacity wire, say #4 or #2 is not a good option, because the chargepoint flex quick connects only accept up to #6 AWG wire. So, say you run #2 to the charge station, you would need a short adapter from #2 to #6, which adapters, if done well are expensive.

There is some good discussion here too, ID.4 buyers have been asking the same questions.

Reading above, too, this is kind of like the one pedal driving vs. D discussion (not so much here, MME drivers seem to like OPD). Neither is wrong. If you like simple, no frills go for something like Clipper Creek (built like a tank, my first CC LCS-20 (16A) from my first Gen Chevy Volt is still running on the front of my garage). If you like gadgets and apps, go for the chargepoint or the juice box. It is just personal preference.

 

[shutterbug]

So now I’m weighing out my options on what to do.
A) do I cancel the Ford Connected Charge Station and re-order another 3rd party EVSE
B) or wait it out until the unit ships

Go with option A. And save yourself some money.

* Once a battery charge reached 80%, charge time is significantly reduced. The battery will accept a higher rate of charge when it is more “empty”.

This does not apply to AC chargers. Only DC.

 

[CHeil402]

Grizzl-e plug in all the way! Only $399 (plus you can get a 30% tax credit on any of them) for a good no frills EVSE.

Plug option allows you to easily swap chargers if something breaks without an electrician/messing with wiring... And as you pointed out, it would be uncommon where you actually need those extra 8 A.

If you want to future proof it, have the electrician run wiring sized for 60 A but just install it to a plug if that works for now.

 

[woody]

Battery conditioning uses minimal amounts of energy compared to charging. But I keep my EVs plugged in in colder weather( I have my EVs in a garage, so not critical). My theory is not to use the EV battery for this.
The conditioning is not continual. It is periodic as needed. And you have to listen hard and close ( unless you are a 5 year old male with that excellent hearing [those were the days!]) to even hear it.
Unfortunately not everyone has a garage, but if you do have one, you should consider making a place for your MME in it during the cold and hot of it.
Range (currently) will always be affect by temperature. Cold weather affects range (negatively) more. Electrons prefer to be comfortable. Recall your science lessons about temperature and molecule movement. Warmer, not hot, weather will see longer ranges. My Bolt has ranges of 270+ in summer and around 238 in winter.
Where oh where did all the super conductivity scientists go?
Clipper Creek:
HCS-80, 64 Amp, Level 2 EVSE, 240V, with 25 ft cable
The HCS-80 is one of the latest high quality, high power, low priced charging stations from ClipperC..

$969.00
hardwire ( more for future proofing - truck, VW van, more/longer daily usage than everyday normal, etc.)
or
HCS-50P Plug-in, 40A, L2 EVSE, 240V, NEMA 14-50
ClipperCreek now offers the HCS-50P, a plug-in 40 Amp electric vehicle charging station with th..

$659.00

hardwire a bit faster, but the HCS-50P works great.
The charger in the MME should charge faster (than my Bolt with a smaller charger, and the Bolt does fine). Remembering the charger is in the car, the EVSE is just what it says Electric Vehicle SUPPLY EQUIPMENT
(from previous post)

 

[dmturner]

Only you can decide what you want to do.

A thought: How often will you come home to a depleted battery (say <10%) and need to leave again in the early morning with it fully charged?

If the answer is: Not often, never, or rarely then you don't need any 48amp charger and just go with any charger that will plug into the 14-50 plug.

In addition to that: You don't really need a "smart" charger either as a lot of that functionality is in the car (charge times specifically).

When things pick back up (post COVID-19 work from home) I can see that happening.

 

[mr_raider]

Do you.need the difference between 40a and 48a?

Is your L2 charging really time limited?

 

[louibluey]

Do you.need the difference between 40a and 48a?

Is your L2 charging really time limited?

There is some merit to that question, a 50A wall outlet gives you a lot of options, and can be used to 40A. Only for an example, you can buy a chargepoint flex with plug, and set it to 40A max.

Also, if your charge station (the EVSE) fails, you can just unplug it, and maybe plug in a temporary replacement, say while waiting for a warranty replacement unit.

 

[dmturner]

Battery conditioning uses minimal amounts of energy compared to charging. But I keep my EVs plugged in in colder weather( I have my EVs in a garage, so not critical). My theory is not to use the EV battery for this.
The conditioning is not continual. It is periodic as needed. And you have to listen hard and close ( unless you are a 5 year old male with that excellent hearing [those were the days!]) to even hear it.
Unfortunately not everyone has a garage, but if you do have one, you should consider making a place for your MME in it during the cold and hot of it.
Range (currently) will always be affect by temperature. Cold weather affects range (negatively) more. Electrons prefer to be comfortable. Recall your science lessons about temperature and molecule movement. Warmer, not hot, weather will see longer ranges. My Bolt has ranges of 270+ in summer and around 238 in winter.
Where oh where did all the super conductivity scientists go?
Clipper Creek:
HCS-80, 64 Amp, Level 2 EVSE, 240V, with 25 ft cable
The HCS-80 is one of the latest high quality, high power, low priced charging stations from ClipperC..

$969.00
hardwire ( more for future proofing - truck, VW van, more/longer daily usage than everyday normal, etc.)
or
HCS-50P Plug-in, 40A, L2 EVSE, 240V, NEMA 14-50
ClipperCreek now offers the HCS-50P, a plug-in 40 Amp electric vehicle charging station with th..

$659.00

hardwire a bit faster, but the HCS-50P works great.
The charger in the MME should charge faster (than my Bolt with a smaller charger, and the Bolt does fine). Remembering the charger is in the car, the EVSE is just what it says Electric Vehicle SUPPLY EQUIPMENT
(from previous post)

I must have missed ClipperCreek in my research. Thanks for sharing.

 

[woody]

Do you.need the difference between 40a and 48a?

Is your L2 charging really time limited?

The hardwire EVSEs are not very necessary for the MMe. A 40amp 14-50 works great. The hardwire is just future plan ahead, vehicles with larger chargers (>11kW) which you might use for longer trips on a regular basis, etc. The cost will most likely be more down the road.

 

[eltonlin]

I debated the same - go hardwired or plug in. Decided on Chargpoint plug in. The 8 additional Amps when home charging are really not necessary. The charge point app is more than sufficient, and has an extra bonus of also being able to look at charging stats via their website.

Given the not so great ford pass app experiences, I think staying away from an all-in-one app would save you some headache. Plus, you're better off managing charging schedules from the car.

 

[hag911]

Grizzl-e plug in all the way! Only $399 (plus you can get a 30% tax credit on any of them) for a good no frills EVSE.

Plug option allows you to easily swap chargers if something breaks without an electrician/messing with wiring... And as you pointed out, it would be uncommon where you actually need those extra 8 A.

If you want to future proof it, have the electrician run wiring sized for 60 A but just install it to a plug if that works for now.

Yes on Grizzl-e. The extra 8 amps might get you an additional 2 miles per charging hour.
With the 40 amp Grizzl-e I have been getting about 30 miles per hour charging here in SE Mass. That's outside and the nights are still getting down into the 20's.
Total cost about $850 for the unit, parts, and labor. Plus a $50 gift card to a local bbq joint. It only took us about an hour to install. And yes the installer is a licensed electrician. He just happens to work me.

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