Mach-E EPA Ratings Revealed in Window Sticker!

[Nak]

It's possible ford will allow regen to charge the battery beyond 100%, which would mean exceeding the maximum designed electric potential (aka "voltage")of the cells. It's unlikely, but it's possible.

It doesn't matter if they do. The charging curve is still going to limit how much power the battery can accept.

And then there's the fact that it takes more energy to get up to speed than you get back by slowing down with regen. As you said earlier, unless someone starts at 100% SOC on the top of a long steep mountain, I just don't see it being an issue.

It is an issue. I discuss why in my post above. It isn't a bad thing, it's just a thing, a fact of life. This all came about because I questioned a post that stated that the Mach-e wouldn't be affected by limited regen. I don't see how that's possible, unless the Mach-e has very limited regen to begin with. I hope that's not it.

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[ajmartineau]

I'm hoping the ReGen is stronger than the 70kW the FWD 160kW Bolt motor can do. I haven't seen any power gauges on the MME that display how much regen you are recouping.

Nevermind. This is a Window sticker thread.

Any news on the RWD window sticker.

 

[EVer]

It doesn't matter if they do. The charging curve is still going to limit how much power the battery can accept.

It’s not so much a matter of power as it is total energy. You can charge a li-ion battery beyond the “maximum” voltage if the BMS allows it, which is why some devices without sophisticated BMS ship with instructions to plug in for a given period of time.

 

[TheLight75]

The sticker has been confirmed as real by members of this forum who I believe have inside information.

The sticker overall may be real, but is the EPA range official or placeholder?

 

[TheLight75]

Model Y has better range with same performance/utility as Mach E...that is a competitive issue for Ford. Yes Tesla has fit and finish problems, but Ford has released their share or poorly built vehicles too (time will tell if the Mach E build quality is up to snuff). Tesla does not need to build "compliance cars" since their entire lineup is EVs.

I don’t have proof but I strongly feel that Tesla’s strong range performance is due to (1) aero shape and (2) lower overall weight due to minimalistic quality interior and substitution of aluminum for steel in the chassis/body. This seems to become apparent when seeing numerous anecdotes about Tesla suspension/wheel components sheering far earlier than the average automobile. At the end of the day, the pied piper must be paid. Extreme lower weight must be paid for by early component deterioration.

 

[TheLight75]

I wonder if some of the EV engineers are beginning to realize that "saving the battery life" efforts might make the difference between 25 years or 20 years while staying above 80% of original capacity? That even 20 years for most people is well beyond their expected ownership horizon...

I know some early adopters, like the initial Leaf owners and many Energi owners (myself included) were disappointed by steep battery degradation. However, I believe the latest approaches to BMS software will help owners achieve significant longevity. For example, I have nearly 20k miles on my Kona, have seen no discernable battery degradation since the first month after the software adjusted to my driving habits and gave me a range of closer to 250 instead of 258 miles (I tend to drive quite "sporty" but I still get 3.8 to 4.1 mi/kWh on any given trip. My lifetime average is 4.0 mi/kWh, a theoretical range of 256 mi at that efficiency level. That is with A/C and ventilated seats on most of the time, cruise set at 70 or 75 most of the time, with passing spurts up to 85/90 mph.)

What part of the world do you live in? The Kona does have degradation but it’s less noticeable due to a large buffer. Your post sounds like needing AC is far more common For you than needing heat. In my area (New England), I average 2.5 mi/kWH in the winter (avg 34F). Generating heat taxes the battery far more than generating AC.

 

[Kamuelaflyer]

The sticker overall may be real, but is the EPA range official or placeholder?

The sticker and it’s contents were confirmed as official by insiders. The car has met every single one of its range targets. Without using the buffer. The EPA will release the numbers after Thanksgiving in the USA iirc.

 

[RonTCat]

Say what? Lithium ion technology is closer to 35 years old than 10.

Yes, but primary degradation is due to cathode/anode breakdown. Cathode design changed last week.

 

[RonTCat]

I wonder if some of the EV engineers are beginning to realize that "saving the battery life" efforts might make the difference between 25 years or 20 years while staying above 80% of original capacity? That even 20 years for most people is well beyond their expected ownership horizon...

I know some early adopters, like the initial Leaf owners and many Energi owners (myself included) were disappointed by steep battery degradation. However, I believe the latest approaches to BMS software will help owners achieve significant longevity. For example, I have nearly 20k miles on my Kona, have seen no discernable battery degradation since the first month after the software adjusted to my driving habits and gave me a range of closer to 250 instead of 258 miles (I tend to drive quite "sporty" but I still get 3.8 to 4.1 mi/kWh on any given trip. My lifetime average is 4.0 mi/kWh, a theoretical range of 256 mi at that efficiency level. That is with A/C and ventilated seats on most of the time, cruise set at 70 or 75 most of the time, with passing spurts up to 85/90 mph.)

You are correct, battery management became a serious focus about the time of Fusion Energi with both Ford and Toyota (and likely everyone else).

 

[ChasingCoral]

Cathode design changed last week.

What do you mean by that?

 

[EVer]

What do you mean by that?

Probably that the state of the art is still evolving.

 

[malba2366]

Tesla does has the best range but not by the margin that EPA numbers suggest. Anytime you see real world tests (not conducted by a Tesla forum member) the results are the same...Other EV makes get much closer to their published EPA range than Tesla does.

With that being said...it is still a marketing issue that Ford can't match Tesla's EPA range. The Mach E actually has a higher WTLP range than the Model Y...so real world range may turn out to be higher than the Model Y. The EPA stupidly allows manufactures to apply different multipliers to EV range, Tesla has been at this the longest so they know how to work this system better than others.

 

[efisher]

That makes sense. The articles I have read say Tesla's rear permanent magnet motor is more efficient, and the front inductive motor is only used when you need it. And as you said, you cannot turn off the permanent magnets so the motors must be "always on". Probably the extra weight makes a difference as well as someone else suggested.

I have not ordered a Mach-E yet, and I cannot decide between the LR AWD or LR RWD. Range is really important to me, but so is the fun of accelerating to 60 in less than five seconds. I have read all the arguments in this thread (and others) regarding range and the spacing of chargers, but I want to drive 80 mph. And I want to drive as far as possible without stopping. Personally, I think 30 miles more range is huge. Arrrg! I really want the AWD!

It might be worth waiting to see what the real-world range difference is. The EPA figures are one thing, the actual range difference might be something else.

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