Ford Announces 'Hands-Free’ Active Drive Assist With Driver-Facing Camera for Mach-E, Available Next Year with OTA Update

[ab13]

My belief is that the hardware will be install at the plant on all models simply because it will be cheaper for Ford and more efficient on the assembly line. Just imagine if they have to install a mirror with cam and then one with not ? Also probably that the wiring bundles will be ready for everything. So that is a reason I believe on FE-Premium and RT-1 hands free driving is included because you pay for all of the hardware/software, would be stupid to charge for hardware that would be partly useless if you don't have the software that comes with it. For the Select and GT Ford Co-Pilot 360 2.0 and Ford Co-Pilot Assist 2.0 is included has stated in the eager2own thread(we all are) like on the other models, and that I believe is enough to give you lane keep assist and probably intelligent cruise control with stop and go. For hands free driving on those 2 models you will have to had 360 Camera which is $550 Can and ParK Assist 2.0 which is $1995 Can, so figure at least 25% less in the US. They also have the Comfort package (67B) which is $1595 Can which gives you almost everything you find on the Premium except the panoramic roof and the B&O sound system. You will also get with this package 19" wheels and tire and Black roof. Pretty interesting in my opinion.

There's no benefit to install parts that are not being purchased. Especially if they can be installed at a later time. The question/confusion is what models were supposed to have the features. I wouldn't expect the base model to have the parts installed. For higher volume products with lots of parts, the cost is largely in the materials, and labor is saved if you don't have to install more parts.

From touring the the Ford Rouge plant, I recall all types of truck model versions being assembled on the same line. You couldn't take pictures, so I can't check against anything, but some vehicles had sunroofs, and other didn't, various other options were or were not installed, etc...

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[zhackwyatt]

Ford is a penny pinching company.

You are making the assumption that Ford will do what is best for the customer and not what is best for their bottom line. That's a bad assumption

Sounds very entitled. How is spending money putting hardware on a car that most likely won't be used better for their customers? That increases cost which is passed onto the consumer. Increases insurance premiums, warranty claims, repairs, etc.

Tesla does this for different reasons -- they harvest the data to train their self-driving models. Ford is not the same, they don't make promises of full self-driving capability in a few years like Tesla because they aren't stupid. (Tesla promised a full self-drive car from New York to LA in 2017.)

Point being, one company is a Silicon Valley tech company and another is a car company. That doesn't make them penny-pinching, it's a sign of being run by adults.

I can't remember if they outright said they wouldn't charge for hands-free or not. If they said they wouldn't, and now they are, then they deserve condemnation. Especially without an explanation. If I recall, hands-free driving was never promised before, it was speculation on our part.

 

[macchiaz-o]

There's no benefit to install parts that are not being purchased. Especially if they can be installed at a later time.

I really doubt Ford would support installing the "Ford Co-Pilot360 Active 2.0 Prep Package" after vehicle delivery. It changes the side mirrors, adds a front camera, driver monitoring cameras and sensors, and possibly other items. It's quite possible that different wiring harnesses are used when cars are produced with this setup. If I were the manufacturer, I'd opt for putting in a lot less wiring to save cost, weight, etc if I didn't need it for the product being produced.

Some might think they could get this figured out after market, using salvage parts, etc. Maybe? Maybe not. One could figure out how to get the hardware installed (if wiring supports it), but you'd still need to convince the firmware/software that it's authorized and usable.

 

[zhackwyatt]

From touring the the Ford Rouge plant, I recall all types of truck model versions being assembled on the same line. You couldn't take pictures, so I can't check against anything, but some vehicles had sunroofs, and other didn't, various other options were or were not installed, etc...

You can see a tour of Ford Rouge here:



They do different cab and bed sizes on the same line. My car, the C-Max was built on the same line as the Ford Focus.

 

[macchiaz-o]

I can't remember if they outright said they wouldn't charge for hands-free or not. If they said they wouldn't, and now they are, then they deserve condemnation. Especially without an explanation. If I recall, hands-free driving was never promised before, it was speculation on our part.

To the best of my knowledge, this was never officially communicated. We've only heard that hands-free highway driving would be a complimentary update from 3rd hand parties, and maybe only once or twice.

 

[zhackwyatt]

To the best of my knowledge, this was never officially communicated. We've only heard that hands-free highway driving would be a complimentary update from 3rd hand parties, and maybe only once or twice.

Other updates may be complementary, but it seems that those that are adding major features are not.

 

[Stickboy46]

Sounds very entitled. How is spending money putting hardware on a car that most likely won't be used better for their customers? That increases cost which is passed onto the consumer. Increases insurance premiums, warranty claims, repairs, etc.

Tesla does this for different reasons -- they harvest the data to train their self-driving models. Ford is not the same, they don't make promises of full self-driving capability in a few years like Tesla because they aren't stupid. (Tesla promised a full self-drive car from New York to LA in 2017.)

Point being, one company is a Silicon Valley tech company and another is a car company. That doesn't make them penny-pinching, it's a sign of being run by adults.

I can't remember if they outright said they wouldn't charge for hands-free or not. If they said they wouldn't, and now they are, then they deserve condemnation. Especially without an explanation. If I recall, hands-free driving was never promised before, it was speculation on our part.

I don't think you understand what entitled means. You also completely missed the point of the argument.

The argument from someone else was that they were just going to include the hardware and NOT charge the customer until they decide to activate it. Thats just flat out not going to happen at Ford. That's never been how they run their company. They have a huge service and aftermarket network. They will sell you every piece of hardware separately if they could. That's their philosophy. Always has been. Even better when they can put magically model year barriers to make you buy a new car in order to get a small upgrade.

As far as the "being run by adults"... Come on now... Both are run by adults... You are just being childish. One of those companies is worth a hell of a lot more than the other... I'll let you guess which one that is.

But you are correct, one is a tech company and one is a car company. That's exactly the point here.. they both have their strengths and weaknesses. Ford is a car company .. they have had decades to perfect their assembly techniques and have no problem having 400 variations of cars on the same production line. Tesla is not a car company so their are still working through that. That's why they standardize everything as much as possible and limit variations by putting all hardware on all cars and software lock it.

On the flip side, Tesla completely destroys Ford when it comes to their software and tech (and pretty much every other legacy auto company). Their interface and speed of updates is unmatched. We will see if Ford can get close with the OTAs here.. but that's not their strong point.

There was an official company rep that came out and said it would be a Free OTA update during one of the shows. It wasn't an official press release so they have that to fall back on.

Hopefully before the orders open up they will iron this out. Otherwise they are potentially asking people to pay extra for hardware that you will have to pay an unknown amount in the future to use. I think all of the versions that are being opened up next week are said to come standard with it though. So it buys them some time.

 

[zhackwyatt]

I don't think you understand what entitled means. You also completely missed the point of the argument.

The argument from someone else was that they were just going to include the hardware and NOT charge the customer until they decide to activate it. Thats just flat out not going to happen at Ford. That's never been how they run their company. They have a huge service and aftermarket network. They will sell you every piece of hardware separately if they could. That's their philosophy. Always has been. Even better when they can put magically model year barriers to make you buy a new car in order to get a small upgrade.

Why do you take this so personally? My argument was against your "penny pinching" comment. I think its entitled thinking if you buy a low-trim model expecting it to have hardware for a future feature. If you don't like that word, we can use greedy, or privileged.

As far as the "being run by adults"... Come on now... Both are run by adults... You are just being childish. One of those companies is worth a hell of a lot more than the other... I'll let you guess which one that is.

Appreciate the name-calling. That helps your argument.

But you are correct, one is a tech company and one is a car company. That's exactly the point here.. they both have their strengths and weaknesses. Ford is a car company .. they have had decades to perfect their assembly techniques and have no problem having 400 variations of cars on the same production line. Tesla is not a car company so their are still working through that. That's why they standardize everything as much as possible and limit variations by putting all hardware on all cars and software lock it.

I'm curious, how many years does Tesla have to be in business until the "still working through that" turns into "this is unacceptable"?

On the flip side, Tesla completely destroys Ford when it comes to their software and tech (and pretty much every other legacy auto company). Their interface and speed of updates is unmatched. We will see if Ford can get close with the OTAs here.. but that's not their strong point.

It's not any car company's strong point. Ford will be the first to do it after Tesla. I'm curious, what makes the SW superior? Because you can watch Netflix, or because of things like Smart Summon (which is mostly a gimmick)? I was in my friend's Model 3 when the Bluetooth stopped working, he had to reboot the display. It was fun being in a modern car w/o a speedometer or any other indication of anything while your driving along. What's superior?

There was an official company rep that came out and said it would be a Free OTA update during one of the shows. It wasn't an official press release so they have that to fall back on.

Hands-free driving specifically? If they did it's slightly better than asking people to pay $7k for a feature with delays and delays. Both are still bad.

Hopefully before the orders open up they will iron this out. Otherwise they are potentially asking people to pay extra for hardware that you will have to pay an unknown amount in the future to use. I think all of the versions that are being opened up next week are said to come standard with it though. So it buys them some time.

The hardware is not standard on all versions. Period. It's very clear if you look at the model comparison information on the website.

 

[Stickboy46]

I saw multiple similar statements in this thread.

I'm genuinely interested in how Tesla Autopilot (without FSD) is "more sophisticated" than Adaptive Cruise Control (with Stop and Go) and Lane Keep Assist found in any other car models.

I could have misunderstood Tesla Autopilot all along, and that misunderstanding may have lead to me making misinformed decisions.

I have not used lane keep assist but from the videos I've seen online it's more of a "correction" tool than an actual autopilot like tool. So if you start to drift to over a lane edge it will redirect to back to the center. So if you tried to just let the car "drive itself" it would likely ping pong back and forth. I also saw no examples of it working around turns and bends. It also would only work well on highways.

Autopilot is centering and driving the car. It will take it around bends and corners in highways. You can also enable it on any road. Including city streets. So there definitely are some differences in how much you are doing vs what the car is doing.

 

[Stickboy46]

Why do you take this so personally? My argument was against your "penny pinching" comment. I think its entitled thinking if you buy a low-trim model expecting it to have hardware for a future feature. If you don't like that word, we can use greedy, or privileged.


Appreciate the name-calling. That helps your argument.


I'm curious, how many years does Tesla have to be in business until the "still working through that" turns into "this is unacceptable"?


It's not any car company's strong point. Ford will be the first to do it after Tesla. I'm curious, what makes the SW superior? Because you can watch Netflix, or because of things like Smart Summon (which is mostly a gimmick)? I was in my friend's Model 3 when the Bluetooth stopped working, he had to reboot the display. It was fun being in a modern car w/o a speedometer or any other indication of anything while your driving along. What's superior?


Hands-free driving specifically? If they did it's slightly better than asking people to pay $7k for a feature with delays and delays. Both are still bad.


The hardware is not standard on all versions. Period. It's very clear if you look at the model comparison information on the website.

Two things then I'm moving on.

1. You keep missing that I'm not advocating for them to include the hardware on all models. I'm just saying that anyone expecting that will be disappointed because Ford is not in the business of giving stuff away for free. Their primary goal is stockholder value ... Ie the penny pinching comment.

2. You have an anti Tesla bias I can tell. That's fine.. but that combined with your inability to understand the initial argument and instead going straight to attacking me and calling me entitled (while completely missing the point of the post) means I'm not gonna try to explain anything to you. Have a good day.

 

[zhackwyatt]

Two things then I'm moving on.

1. You keep missing that I'm not advocating for them to include the hardware on all models. I'm just saying that anyone expecting that will be disappointed because Ford is not in the business of giving stuff away for free. Their primary goal is stockholder value ... Ie the penny pinching comment.

Didn't say you were advocating them. I was simply trying to say that calling ford penny-pinching because they do not put the hardware on all models was inaccurate.

2. You have an anti Tesla bias I can tell. That's fine.. but that combined with your inability to understand the initial argument and instead going straight to attacking me and calling me entitled (while completely missing the point of the post) means I'm not gonna try to explain anything to you. Have a good day.

1. I don't have an anti-Tesla bias. Just because I call out some of their crap doesn't mean I'm biased. In the same paragraph I called out Ford's crap (assuming its true that they promised free hands-free driving before). Am I anti-Ford as well? You are basically devaluing my opinion and dismissing any argument I have. I could just as easily call you a fan boy and dismiss everything you say. But I don't believe that to be true.
2. I didn't attack you. You called me childish. I said that people expecting that the hardware is on all trim levels and characterizing Ford as penny-pinching because they didn't sound entitled.
3. You have a good day as well.

 

[dbsb3233]

One of those companies is worth a hell of a lot more than the other

I don't wanna get in the middle if this, but I can't help but comment on that one point which is oft repeated. From a speculative stock market capital standpoint, that's true. But by most tangible measures it's not. TSLA's annual revenues are $26B, Ford's are $150B. TSLA sold 367k vehicles last year, Ford 5.4 MILLION.

Tesla is more trendy. And it's got a lot of cheereaders buying stock. But if I'm picking the company that has BY FAR the biggest impact on what far more people actually drive, it's Ford, not Tesla.

 

[Stickboy46]

I don't wanna get in the middle if this, but I can't help but comment on that one point which is oft repeated. From a speculative stock market capital standpoint, that's true. But by most tangible measures it's not. TSLA's annual revenues are $26B, Ford's are $150B. TSLA sold 367k vehicles last year, Ford 5.4 MILLION.

Tesla is more trendy. And it's got a lot of cheereaders buying stock. But if I'm picking the company that has BY FAR the biggest impact on what far more people actually drive, it's Ford, not Tesla.

Not arguing that at all. The comment was in relation to saying that Ford is run by adults while insinuating that Tesla isn't. One of the measures of how well a company is ran is it's Market Cap and stock price.

 

[dbsb3233]

Not arguing that at all. The comment was in relation to saying that Ford is run by adults while insinuating that Tesla isn't. One of the measures of how well a company is ran is it's Market Cap and stock price.

Fair enough. There's surely more fair ways to describe the difference between Ford and Tesla in between the extremes of "penny-pinching" and "run by adults". They're both good companies that produce good products. Which increases competition. We all win when that happens. ?

 

[Stickboy46]

Fair enough. There's surely more fair ways to describe the difference between Ford and Tesla in between the extremes of "penny-pinching" and "run by adults". They're both good companies that produce good products. Which increases competition. We all win when that happens. ?

Yup agreed. As I stated earlier they are both good in their own ways. They could both learn a lot from the other.

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