Using your Mach-e to Power electric devices for 'Glamping' or Home Emergency Battery Backup

[RedStallion]

All you need is this small generator. 10kW output running on anything flammable. Remember, 1 gal of gas is equivalent to 33kWh of electricity. You can charge your car too.

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[woody]

1kWh? Nothing.
We have a 30kWh backup to our solar (currently produce 100%+ of energy consumed. Must double this production in order to keep up demand in winter, in order to produce all of our energy directly from the sun). Battery backup is about one fourth of our requirements for sustained electricity supply(winter). Any long term (utility)outage would not be covered unless the sun is shining.
Batteries are currently the greatest expense.
We even have three 1500w space heaters just in case.
Bi-directional EV should be 80+kWh minimum. (next EV purchase)
Remain grid tied, of course.

I believe generators run on fossil fuels? Or at the very least some sort of combustion?
I must be missing the point of all this.

 

[Rpgonzalez]

as long as the refrigerator power requirements (watts when running) are less than what the built-in power ports can support.... sure.


resting state electronics with car on seem to hover around 200watts. So continuous load for export should be kept below 1200w. I'd expect peak loads a little higher would be ok for brief periods with a 'buffer battery' in the mix.

The camping fridge is supposedly 50W-75W. Power port supposedly maxes at 20A, so about a quarter of the load….

If I’m reading this thread correctly however, the dc-dc charger should kick in at about 12V, AND such a small draw shouldn’t exceed the abilities of the LVB (like drawing 1000w would do).

so, should I risk leaving the car off?

 

[Rpgonzalez]

The concept is to wire a 'suicide cord' with a 240v NEMA 14-50 plug at one end, and a 'regular' 120v plug at the other. An easy way to do this is to use a regular 'Range Whip', and connect BOTH the L1 (red) and L2 (black) to the 120v Plug 'hot' connection which is usually the brass screw.

I’m assuming the neutral from the 5-15 connects to white on the 14-50?

On the record for any electrician Nannys, I am not planning on ever having to do this, but I saved this extremely helpful tutorial from this post in case something terrible happens (earthquake??) and if it comes to it, I’m going to try and save my family. This post will keep me from a) dying b) burning the house down with my kids in it or c) killing a line worker. So thanks!!

 

[MachGT]

Ok, has my attention. So the question is what is the amperage that the internal 12v system can sustain and was is designed for continuouse use, say 48 hours with temperatures above 80 degrees.

If you have a GT, the DC-DC inverter kicks out 220 amps (220×12v=2,600watts continuous). The thread below has the police Modifier Bulletin that explains how it neeeds to be wired up.

The spare battery with the 120v inverter is a great idea because it provides some surge capacity for startup of something like a microwave. I'm definitely going to copy this.

https://www.macheforum.com/site/thr...adding-12-volt-accessories-gt-specific.19039/

 

[Garbone]

If you have a GT, the DC-DC inverter kicks out 220 amps (220×12v=2,600watts continuous). The thread below has the police Modifier Bulletin that explains how it neeeds to be wired up.

The spare battery with the 120v inverter is a great idea because it provides some surge capacity for startup of something like a microwave. I'm definitely going to copy this.

https://www.macheforum.com/site/thr...adding-12-volt-accessories-gt-specific.19039/

Curious if this inverter can be purchased and retrofitted. A bit overkill but in 5 years if a persons inverter fails it would be good to be able to upgrade.

 

[dtbaker61]

I’m assuming the neutral from the 5-15 connects to white on the 14-50?

yes....
green to green
white to white
blk&rd (240v plug) to black (120v plug)

another way to do it if you do not have a 240v outlet, (if you have a hardwired wall charger for instance)... is:
- fabricate TWO 120v male-male 'suicide adapters'
- figure out the nearest two 120v outlets that are on different 'legs' in your service panel.... on the 'left' and 'right' sides
- follow the same procedure to isolate from the grid before using your 'generator'
- run TWO extension cords from the built in inverter outlet(s).... each to an outlet on different 'legs'... and plug in using your m-m connectors.
- when you turn on your little inverter, it will energize both L1 and L2 in your main service panel, but remember the power will be 'in-phase', not 'split-phase'.... so none of the 220v circuits should be on, because they won't work!

 

[dtbaker61]

If you have a GT, the DC-DC inverter kicks out 220 amps (220×12v=2,600watts continuous). The thread below has the police Modifier Bulletin that explains how it neeeds to be wired up.

The spare battery with the 120v inverter is a great idea because it provides some surge capacity for startup of something like a microwave. I'm definitely going to copy this.

https://www.macheforum.com/site/thr...adding-12-volt-accessories-gt-specific.19039/

the dc-dc converter (not 'inverter') is a different part number on the GT than other trims. I think the connections, bolt pattern, and coolant lines are slightly different. I don't think you can bolt the GT dcdc to a non-GT front motor.

 

[dtbaker61]

The camping fridge is supposedly 50W-75W. Power port supposedly maxes at 20A, so about a quarter of the load….

If I’m reading this thread correctly however, the dc-dc charger should kick in at about 12V, AND such a small draw shouldn’t exceed the abilities of the LVB (like drawing 1000w would do).

so, should I risk leaving the car off?

The 12v accesory power ports will turn off completely after timeout period if you turn MME 'off'. You must leave MME on, and disable 'auto-off' setting if you want to run anything.....

 

[Rpgonzalez]

The 12v accesory power ports will turn off completely after timeout period if you turn MME 'off'. You must leave MME on, and disable 'auto-off' setting if you want to run anything.....

oops sorry... this is if I decide to wire the fridge to the jump terminals or use a small inverter for a speaker or something. Forgot to mention that.

 

[dtbaker61]

oops sorry... this is if I decide to wire the fridge to the jump terminals or use a small inverter for a speaker or something. Forgot to mention that.

I would leave the MME 'on' if you are running accessory loads.... much kinder to our *very small* 12v battery. You really don't want to cycle the LVB any more than you have to as it was designed and sized to withstand only the very small loads when the MME is 'sleeping'.

 

[Rpgonzalez]

All you need is this small generator. 10kW output running on anything flammable. Remember, 1 gal of gas is equivalent to 33kWh of electricity. You can charge your car too.

sd
One gallon of gas is theoretically equivalent to 33kwh of electricity. Under ideal conditions (power plant for example) you can expect around 13kwh (source), and a gas generator such as this one would be significantly less. Cars are pretty inefficient hovering about 20%. I would expect about 10kwh per gallon of gas. What could you expect from a full tank? About the same as a Mach-e battery? Whereas I dont have the space to keep a generator lying around, I DO have a mach-e battery lying around

 

[MyLittlePony2022]

sd
One gallon of gas is theoretically equivalent to 33kwh of electricity. Under ideal conditions (power plant for example) you can expect around 13kwh (source), and a gas generator such as this one would be significantly less. Cars are pretty inefficient hovering about 20%. I would expect about 10kwh per gallon of gas. What could you expect from a full tank? About the same as a Mach-e battery? Whereas I dont have the space to keep a generator lying around, I DO have a mach-e battery lying around

I think it is a matter of what you plan to do with the 120 volt connection from the MME or the generator. The MME is a great "oh shoot" back-up and for glamping. Campsites normally don't like generator noise. If you are going camping out in the middle of nowhere, then the generator may be your better options to power your "stuff". The generator would also be a better back up for the house. I see it as apple and oranges.

I also, do not have the room for a generator, but would like one. If I had to power my frig, freezer, and a few lights, I would get a generator (inverter). I would size it for those and probably 220 volts to charge the MME too. If I needed a little bit of power, just in case, the MME is a great solution. I think cost and available room become a consideration. No room for a generator, use the MME. Cannot afford the MME conversion but have room, get a cheap Harbor Freight generator. Don't have room or money....hope your neighbor has a generator.

 

[mkhuffman]

After experiencing five days without power after a hurricane, a generator to me is a requirement. If you have a house and a garage, you can find a place to store a generator. There are also whole house generator options, which attach to your NG or propane gas lines and sit in your yard. That takes up no inside space.

While it would be inefficient and costly to charge your car with a portable or home generator, you could do it. And if you needed the charge to go somewhere during a massive power failure, it would probably be worth the extra cost. Not probably.

 

[dtbaker61]

I think it is a matter of what you plan to do with the 120 volt connection from the MME or the generator. The MME is a great "oh shoot" back-up and for glamping. Campsites normally don't like generator noise. If you are going camping out in the middle of nowhere, then the generator may be your better options to power your "stuff". The generator would also be a better back up for the house. I see it as apple and oranges.

I also, do not have the room for a generator, but would like one. If I had to power my frig, freezer, and a few lights, I would get a generator (inverter). I would size it for those and probably 220 volts to charge the MME too. If I needed a little bit of power, just in case, the MME is a great solution. I think cost and available room become a consideration. No room for a generator, use the MME. Cannot afford the MME conversion but have room, get a cheap Harbor Freight generator. Don't have room or money....hope your neighbor has a generator.

I have tackled the issue by putting together three different packages, which use the MME battery capacity slightly differently.

A. 1500watt inverter direct pull from MME connection points. 120vAC output via standard extension cord to whatever load you want. msrp under $400 delivered by Amazon, no fabrication required.

B. Portable 'Glamping' unit with 1kWhr lithium battery buffer, 1500watt inverter, charge controller all stuffed into a 20" carryon. Can be charged via a small solar module for portable 'remote' use, or charged from MME with jumper cables..... msrp $950, or $1200 with 100wat solar and 25' cord

A/B *can* be used to energize 120v circuits throughout your home utilizing a male-male adapter which can be fabricated with about $15 in matlerials, after isolating house from grid. Limited to 1500 watts aggregate load

C. Stationary backup system in shelving, usually best right next to existing 240v outlet. minimum suggested configuration would be 4kWhr of battery, 3000w inverter, 400w of solar to keep it charged for daily use. This can be used to energize 'all' circuits in the home.... least expensive is to stick to using a 120v output inverter with the total system MSRP around $3k including shelving and labor, or closer to $4k if you want 240v output.... With this design the 4kWhr stationary battery is the 'buffer' that can support heavy loads for a little while, and the MME is basically 'charger' capable of 40amp charging based on the voltage sag of the buffer pack.


.... any of these options give you access to your MME battery capacity, don't make any noise, and don't burn any gasoline.... which I do NOT want to store in my garage.

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