JustSomeQuickGuy

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And this is why Ford won't shrink the buffers any more, people would abuse them.
I'm going to guess that 95%+ of Mach-E owners plug in to 100% every night, don't have an account on these forums, nor have flipped through the manual, and have no idea about buffers, OTA updates, battery conditioning, etc.
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generaltso

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Well, if Ford doesn't want me to charge to 100% then they can push a software update that prevents that from happening. If they think people are going to read the owner's manual, setup max charge rates, etc, they're kidding themselves.
It's a suggestion, not a requirement. That's why I said to keep doing what you're doing and don't worry about it. It won't affect the battery warranty.
 

JustSomeQuickGuy

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It's a suggestion, not a requirement. That's why I said to keep doing what you're doing and don't worry about it. It won't affect the battery warranty.
Oh sorry, thank you, my comment was more in general and agreeing with you. I think you're right, people spend a bit too much time trying to squeeze out every drop. :)
 

JustSomeQuickGuy

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This isn’t an LFP battery
I'm newer on these forums, and it sounds like this subject has been beat to death over the years, just seems to me as a software solutions architect, if the hardware actually was damaged long term, it shouldn't let me charge to 100% -- and the software should prevent that from happening. Or at least, give you an option to allow it to go to 100% but with a bunch of warnings saying it may hurt the battery long term.

The fact it doesn't warn you sand lets you hit 100% by default is either..

1) a glaring engineering blunder on Ford's part that they haven't fixed since the production of the Mach-E a few years ago..
2) ..or not actually something Ford is too worried about
 


acosmichippo

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I'm newer on these forums, and it sounds like this subject has been beat to death over the years, just seems to me as a software solutions architect, if the hardware actually was damaged long term, it shouldn't let me charge to 100% -- and the software should prevent that from happening. Or at least, give you an option to allow it to go to 100% but with a bunch of warnings saying it may hurt the battery long term.

The fact it doesn't warn you sand lets you hit 100% by default is either..

1) a glaring engineering blunder on Ford's part that they haven't fixed since the production of the Mach-E a few years ago..
2) ..or not actually something Ford is too worried about
because it's a matter of degrees, not a binary issue. the fact is merely using your battery at all is technically "damaging it"... just some uses are slightly more damaging than others.

Some people prefer to err on the safer side, especially if they don't need the full 100% range on a daily basis. You can always opt to charge to 100% if you're planning on going on a longer drive.
 

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Good grief! After all of the posts I am still not sure if there is a problem or not. I know that our Mach E is apparently up to date but I am surprised that Ford has still not done anything in the Sync user interface to indicate, monitor, analyze 12v battery condition. The high voltage battery reporting tools, trip data, is great but I can find nothing for the 12v battery and if it fails, you have a brick. For the user, a 12v battery failure is just as bad as a High Voltage battery failure. In either scenario the car is a brick!

For us, based on current driving routine, the Mach E is in the temp controlled garage every night. Gets plugged in about once per week, when the battery is below 50% and gets charged to 90%. When in the garage it is within our household WIFI foot print so it has good WIFI access every day, i.e. every night. Updates get done weekly, or whenever they come out. etc. and no significant problems, yet.

We really like the recent updates that made changing cabin or seat heater temps much easier/safer to manage but apparently Ford doesn't seem to think 12v battery data management is important. That is why I bought a cigarette lighter digital battery voltage device, so I can see charging voltage. Admittedly I don't look at it much, but at least I can if I feel the need.

The Fordpass app on my Smartphone is still a train wreck, but we have gotten used to the poor management/design of the application. ( It is obviously problem for Ford because in one year there have been at least 12 updates, and the updates were mostly not to add features, they were to fix bugs. The IT resource focus is on the car, not the FordPass app. In retrospect I cannot think of a FordPass app fault that would "brick" the car, so Ford seems fine to do "reliability engineering" on the fly, with FordPass. )

After a year now, this Mach E is OK. We have a Lightning 150 on order, February delivery, but I am going to cancel it. One "first rodeo EV technology" vehicle in my garage is enough for now. Perhaps later as technology and reliability engineering matures. Our 2nd car is a good old fashioned ICE as a back up. :cool:

As I stated before, these things are NOT cars, "they are laptops on wheels" and they may not be appropriate for everyone as a replacement for their former ICE vehicle routine. I remember my first laptop, years ago, and after 3 years it was obsolete. That is why our Mach E will be traded in for something else, within 12 to 24 months. The prospect of owning a "legacy" EV, i.e. past 5 years or older old is kinda scary. In the past, owning a 10 year old mustang, with a worn out engine and/or transmission was relatively easy to rejuvenate and maybe even make it better. With an EV the practical risk of doing that is prohibitive. Would you take a 10 year old Dell laptop, gut it, rebuild it to modern specs? I think not.

In 2021 the average new EV range was about 250 miles. In 2022 the average new EV range was 350. In 2023 many new EVs coming to market are boasting 450 miles. Our 2021 Mach E was probably designed around 2016/17 and things have changed. Range is a big, major EV attribute/feature and just like old laptops and cell phones, battery life was a primary focus for future development. Todays cell phone and laptop batteries last twice as long and power attributes that are more than double the past. I don't think Moore's law can apply to EVs but time will tell. Someone needs to come up with a new EV law for development. Any ideas on a catchy name?
 

RickMachE

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I'm going to guess that 95%+ of Mach-E owners plug in to 100% every night, don't have an account on these forums, nor have flipped through the manual, and have no idea about buffers, OTA updates, battery conditioning, etc.
It's quite a sad commentary that people spend $60 - $80,000, or more, on a purchase and are too lazy / busy / not smart enough / fill in your answer here that they don't read the manual. But - buy that fancy coffee maker (fill in toy here) and they read the manual. It's pretty amazing what people post on various forums / social media like "I've owned the ____ for a year and didn't know it did that".

One of the big factors that will slow EV adoption is the consumer's lack of interest in learning.

Note - I am not saying that anyone here is lazy / not smart enough. Just an overall observation from participation in forums for the last 40+ years (back when they were call BBs).

Kind of disappointed this post got put as a top post on the site and it isn't even true, I guess Admin doesn't read the threads?
Yeah, the title should be changed.
 

RickMachE

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Good grief! After all of the posts I am still not sure if there is a problem or not. I know that our Mach E is apparently up to date but I am surprised that Ford has still not done anything in the Sync user interface to indicate, monitor, analyze 12v battery condition. The high voltage battery reporting tools, trip data, is great but I can find nothing for the 12v battery and if it fails, you have a brick. For the user, a 12v battery failure is just as bad as a High Voltage battery failure. In either scenario the car is a brick!

For us, based on current driving routine, the Mach E is in the temp controlled garage every night. Gets plugged in about once per week, when the battery is below 50% and gets charged to 90%. When in the garage it is within our household WIFI foot print so it has good WIFI access every day, i.e. every night. Updates get done weekly, or whenever they come out. etc. and no significant problems, yet.

We really like the recent updates that made changing cabin or seat heater temps much easier/safer to manage but apparently Ford doesn't seem to think 12v battery data management is important. That is why I bought a cigarette lighter digital battery voltage device, so I can see charging voltage. Admittedly I don't look at it much, but at least I can if I feel the need.

The Fordpass app on my Smartphone is still a train wreck, but we have gotten used to the poor management/design of the application. ( It is obviously problem for Ford because in one year there have been at least 12 updates, and the updates were mostly not to add features, they were to fix bugs. The IT resource focus is on the car, not the FordPass app. In retrospect I cannot think of a FordPass app fault that would "brick" the car, so Ford seems fine to do "reliability engineering" on the fly, with FordPass. )

After a year now, this Mach E is OK. We have a Lightning 150 on order, February delivery, but I am going to cancel it. One "first rodeo EV technology" vehicle in my garage is enough for now. Perhaps later as technology and reliability engineering matures. Our 2nd car is a good old fashioned ICE as a back up. :cool:

As I stated before, these things are NOT cars, "they are laptops on wheels" and they may not be appropriate for everyone as a replacement for their former ICE vehicle routine. I remember my first laptop, years ago, and after 3 years it was obsolete. That is why our Mach E will be traded in for something else, within 12 to 24 months. The prospect of owning a "legacy" EV, i.e. past 5 years or older old is kinda scary. In the past, owning a 10 year old mustang, with a worn out engine and/or transmission was relatively easy to rejuvenate and maybe even make it better. With an EV the practical risk of doing that is prohibitive. Would you take a 10 year old Dell laptop, gut it, rebuild it to modern specs? I think not.

In 2021 the average new EV range was about 250 miles. In 2022 the average new EV range was 350. In 2023 many new EVs coming to market are boasting 450 miles. Our 2021 Mach E was probably designed around 2016/17 and things have changed. Range is a big, major EV attribute/feature and just like old laptops and cell phones, battery life was a primary focus for future development. Todays cell phone and laptop batteries last twice as long and power attributes that are more than double the past. I don't think Moore's law can apply to EVs but time will tell. Someone needs to come up with a new EV law for development. Any ideas on a catchy name?
I agree that a portion of owners will sell/trade in the first few years, because they want the latest and greatest. But some have professed a desire to keep it for 10 - 15 years, who knows if they will. [typing on a desktop computer bought at a university clearance for $50, cleaned up and 500gb SSD and 4TB drive put in]... 🤣
 

Calgary MACH E

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When we started dating there was less mystery surrounding how my wife thinks and makes decisions than there is for this car.
 

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I usually do my updates when I pull into garage and the SOC is never that high. I typically charge late at night.
 

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The charging strategy below was provided by Ford Special Vehicle Engineering:
While ignition is off, if 12V battery reaches 40% state of charge, then vehicle waits 48 hours , before the DC-DC transfers 300 Watt-hours of energy to recharge the 12V battery. The HV power comes from either HV battery or wall power while on plug. If the 12V battery state of charge reaches 30%, then this HV to LV energy transfer happens immediately with no delay.
Note:
• This system was designed to recharge 12V battery while the vehicle was left parked for many days
either on or off plug or occasional drain from customer usage. The 12V battery will wear out if this energy transfer is completed daily due to aftermarket loads draining the 12V battery down to 40% or lower.
• Vehicle has 35 Amp-hour AGM 12V Battery
I get not over-charging the 12V and wearing it out unnecessarily. What I don't get is why, when there is an update ready, the computer (i.e. stupid Ford Software Engineers) don't force the 12V to charge right away to the necessary level. Basically, here is how the conversation with the car goes.

Me: "Hey, it shows an update ready. Can you install it?"
Mach-E: "No."
Me: "Why not?"
Mach-E: "I need the 12V battery at 80% charge."
Me: "Um... you control how much the 12v battery charges. Can you please charge it?"
Mach-E: "(yawn) I guess so, like, when I get around to it. Check back with me in a month."
 

Solares

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Seems like many of us have our own rituals for getting a OTA.

Equipment needed:
- Tinfoil

Mine:
0. Make a tinfoil hat.

1. Watch out for that one specific guy in FB about him bragging about receiving a OTA.

2. mark my calendar as I know that from experience I am 2 weeks behind him.

3. making sure my SOC is at 80%

4. Schedule a preheat for that week every day.

5. Success. Is the above steps necessary? I don’t know.. But i keep getting those sweeeet OTAs.
 

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As others have said, it is the SOC of the LVB (12 volt). There is an api endpoint on the ford owner website (Right click, Inspect, Network. It helps to filter by "api/v2") which provides (I am guessing, this hasn't been confirmed anywhere) the LVB SOC %. It would be a nice feature to have the LVB info in the FordPass app given that this SOC is the most important factor for OTA updates: As you can see in the screenshot below, the current LVB SOC is 72%. This endpoint response is also cached, so you will need to refresh your FordPass app (which I guess happens anyway once you are driving)
Screenshot 2023-01-23 at 4.05.33 PM.png
Hey, I'd never noticed that key/field in the JSON before. I need to see about adding that in the Android widget. Thanks for pointing it out.

Edit: I realized that field is for the HVB, which the widget already uses.
 
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