Per Study, ICE fueling costs fall below price of EV charging

[RedOctobrrr]

4 mi/kWh

Is ¼ of your drive downhill coasting with pure regen for several miles?

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[timbop]

Is ¼ of your drive downhill coasting with pure regen for several miles?

yes, it's downhill BOTH WAYS! ?

 

[AliRafiee]

I pay $0.10 per kWh. My battery capacity is 88 kWh. So $8.80 to go about 300 miles.
you do the math.

 

[superdave80]

Is ¼ of your drive downhill coasting with pure regen for several miles?

No. It's probably a mix of 1/3 highway (60-65 mph), 2/3 city driving. Oh, I also don't drive 80 MPH like some of you crazies on this board

Oh, to blow your mind even more? I'm actually closer to 4.4 mi/kWh. I just use a round number to make math easier.

 

[Woeo]

@ 3.1 MI/KwH my home charging cost is now $10.96/100 mi., so yes I expect many on here are in that group. Be thankful you live where elect. rates have not skyrocket.

You are paying 34 cents per kw for your charging?

 

[RyanSD]

Living in Southern California, I pay some pretty stupid prices (EV-TOU-5 pricing plan)

Winter Pricing:

Summer:

My ChargePoint home charger is configured to only charge during Super Off-Peak hours so it looks something like this:

Having solar on my roof has really help to keep costs down by feeding the grid, during the daytime.

During the winter, my roof will produce about 20 kWh of energy… summer, up to 35 kWh of energy.

Without the solar, I can see my bill being “Snoop Dog” level high.

 

[superdave80]

I managed to find a link to the a more detailed report (from 2021):
https://www.andersoneconomicgroup.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/04/EV_ICE_FuelingCosts_2ed4-5-22.pdf

Page 72 has a nice breakdown of the numbers they used. My biggest problem was that they added the cost of a home charger at $364/year! (over 12k miles). That added almost 30% of the cost (and now I know how they go to such a large number for the EV). But then they didn't bother to add oil changes, which could easily run $100+/year. Who here is buying a new charger every year?

 

[Peaceowl]

some articles have an agenda, way beyond the truth. You can usually spot it right away.

 

[nmope]

I couldn’t view the original article due to subscriber login but I found this synopsis:

https://s3-prod.autonews.com/2023-01/EV Cost Analysis 2022 Q4 Update.pdf

interestingly enough the article actually says for luxury vehicles vs luxury EV, the EV is a lot cheaper.

Also interestingly a large cost of charging the EV is the cost of the level 2 charger Which is a similar conclusion to what I reached in my prior post

 

[AKgrampy]

I wonder how many read the article. It even included “opportunity costs” when people wait to charge their vehicle. Just goes to show you data can be manipulated in many ways; however, we do need to understand that many of us, especially during the winter, do not have the savings as many do in areas with lower cost electricity.

 

[AKgrampy]

Are we talking the TOTAL cost of kwh delivered to your home? Because our electric bill is broken up into 13 cents/kwh for electric supply, and another 13 cents/kwh for the delivery. One company supplies the electricity, and another company maintains the delivery infrastructure.

In the end, I'm paying 26 cents/kwh, so I'm curious of others are listing their total price, or just the supply cost.

30 cents/kwh in Alaska is beyond belief. Aren't you sitting on trillions of barrels of oil up there? Your energy costs should be the cheapest in the nation.

Please google what percentage of generation in the US is oil fired and you will find that it is close to zero as oil fired generation is way more expensive than coal, natural gas, wind, solar of nuclear. That is why in places in Alaska without NG or a good hydro source people can be paying close to $0.75 or more per kWh.

 

[Hammered]

Living in Southern California, I pay some pretty stupid prices (EV-TOU-5 pricing plan)
Without the solar, I can see my bill being “Snoop Dog” level high.

Why don't you invest in ~30kWh worth of LFP batteries and a grid-tie inverter than can neutral out your load during the peak times around the solar. Fill them up with cheap super-off-peak power. I'm about to have 60kWh worth of batteries to do the same. My super off peak is 1.49 cents, off peak 6.9cents (which is most of the time sans summer 3 months which is ~24 cents 2p-7). The goal is to only buy super off peak power, while having the solar means to go without the grid entirely. The super off-peak power is just too cheap not to buy. Cover the solar when possible once you get your storage to an adequate size to reduce degradation.

Current LFP batteries can run 80% depth of discharge every day for over 20 years before they reach a point where they're down to 80% of remaining rated capacity. Between your solar and batteries, you'd have 30kWh worth of super off peak power and 20kWh of solar power to offset those insane rates. How much would your bill drop if you were able to remove 732kWh of power from peak times? If that was summer on-peak, that power is $550 in savings. If it was an average spread of winter usage, that's $244 worth of real savings, or well over $3500/yr.

Batteries and an inverter make $ back far faster than solar alone when you have highly discounted night rates. Without any panels at all, such a setup with my rates would make 1830kWh worth of house power cost $79 (plus any power used for the house during the SOP hours), Add in 800 miles of EV power, another $14, and for...
$100 on the nose = 2,000kWh+ for house power (10% efficiency loss included FWIW), and 800 miles of EV fuel.

With a 20kWh solar array factored in however (actual capacity, not total daily output), on average I end up with a surplus of power (~3,000kWh monthly generation potential).....
That's where it gets tricky as the $100 is so cheap and then panels alone kinda not make it worth it once the inverters and LFPs are online. How much piece of mind is being 100% grid independent worth though....

 

[Guss-E 2021]

Old Acura had the best fuel economy when using premium (as recommended by the OEM). Averaged 24mpg city/highway with little deviation. Avg cost of premium here is $4.20 so $17.50 for 100 miles.

My electrical rates are way up. But even at a (low) winter 2.2 mi/kW (2.8 on the upper end), it's costing me around $14.50. Not a huge savings but in the summer gas prices go up and EV range improves, so annually the savings are there.

Also, no ICEV owner will ever have the option for a free gas pump at home which equates to home solar for BEV owners. Even if a free gas pump (and underground tank) at home were possible, highly doubt it would qualify for a 30% tax credit. That solar system will also power more than just a car as well.

It’s really a silly comparison because gasoline will never be free. I should also state that between my car payment (the Acura was paid for) and rising electrical rates, my MME won't be saving me money for a while. But the quality of life, peace of mind of no fumes and the driving experience are worth it for me. In my case, the $7,500 credit cleared a balance I had with the IRS that was on a payment plan ($200/month now back in the bank) and still nets me a $5K refund. MME Life is good.

 

[Guss-E 2021]

Consider yourself lucky and blessed. In the northeast, there's no such thing as "offpeak" rates. We pay 24 cents/kwh all year long.

A bit infuriating given how much electricity NH gets from nuclear. But I know New England's rates are regionally influenced and on the whole most of NE still relies heavily on LNG for power generation. Yeah fossil fuels!

 

[GreaseMonkey]

And it doesn’t seem like they’re making fair comparisons of the vehicles, either. The Mach E is a 4 door crossover/SUV that goes 0-60 in around 5 seconds or less for AWD. What AWD ICE can do that and achieve like 30 MPG city?

Exactly. The closest comparable vehicle to a MME Premium AWD from size and performance perspective is Porsche Macan S. It is rated 17 city/ 23 highway or ~20 combined and requires premium gas. Cost for 100 miles is around $22.

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