The New Tesla / NACS Charging Connector Explained

[kennethjk]

I don‘t know the percentage, but there are 12,000 V3 stations, so the number is not small. That’s what they’ve been installing since 2019.

Thanks for the info, good to know

Sponsored

 

[AZBill]

NACS also has a new and deeper connector to support up to 1000v. V3 does not support that, only V4, and none of those exist in the US. This is why NACS is inadequate for the 800v cars.

 

[hartmms]

I looked up the protocol stuff. I found a good article about it. Focusing only on DC (fast charging) CCS protocol is ISO-15118, the "old" Tesla protocol seems to be DIN 70121. DIN 70121 was an early publish of the DC section of ISO-15118 before it was fully defined.

And I read this in the NACS spec:

4.5 Communication between the EV and EVSE​

​

4.5.1​

For DC charging, communication between the EV and EVSE shall be power line communication over the control pilot line as depicted in DIN 70121.​

​

4.5.2 The North American Charging Standard is compatible with “plug and charge” as defined in ISO-15118.​

Do all superchargers conform to all aspects of the NACS? If so, there is nothing to worry about here, our cars will charge at any supercharger site. But several posts here state v2 superchargers don't speak ISO-15118, so that implies not all superchargers conform to the NACS.

I can't find any confirmation about what version of superchargers speak what protocol except for a couple of posts in this thread. So assuming those folks are right and if the future adapter is dumb, then our cars won't work with any supercharger that only speaks DIN 70121. However, with DIN 70121 being a precursor to ISO-15118, I would hope a simple micro-controller could do the low level conversion (translation at the data link layer, perhaps?)

Stepping back out of the technical bits (OSI model, anyone?), I still can't imagine how they are gonna handle educating the Ford EV owing public "well, you can use this supercharger site, but not that one." Not even plug share calls out a difference between NACS superchargers. Something doesn't see right here.

 

[voxel]

What % of Tesla SC are V3? My guess is small, if this is correct the adapters will be useless to us, correct?

In FL, I’d guess 60% V3 and 40% V2.

Back in 2021, I’d say it was 80% V2 and 20% V3. Tesla went crazy and built SCs at a rapid rate.

The likelihood of Tesla upgrading V2 stalls is zero from a Tesla inside I’ve spoken to. Might as well build a new location given the upgrade cost.

As for the video… yawn… nothing new lol.

 

[generaltso]

Do all superchargers conform to all aspects of the NACS? If so, there is nothing to worry about here, our cars will charge at any supercharger site. But several posts here state v2 superchargers don't speak ISO-15118, so that implies not all superchargers conform to the NACS.

I can't find any confirmation about what version of superchargers speak what protocol except for a couple of posts in this thread. So assuming those folks are right and if the future adapter is dumb, then our cars won't work with any supercharger that only speaks DIN 70121.

There’s no need to speculate. V3 was right in the original Ford announcement:

https://media.ford.com/content/ford...n-access-to-12-000-tesla-superchargers--.html

A Tesla-developed adapter will provide Ford F-150 Lightning, Mustang Mach-E and E-Transit vehicles fitted with the Combined Charging System (CCS) port access to Tesla’s V3 Superchargers.

 

[hartmms]

There’s no need to speculat

Thanks for pointing that out.

While it's great we get access to v3 superchargers, seems like it's not gonna be the "full Tesla experience" where you can roll up to any supercharger.

Maybe plug share, apple maps and Google maps will update their filters so users like us can filter not just by connector type, but also supercharger v3 sites only.

 

[generaltso]

Maybe plug share, apple maps and Google maps will update their filters so users like us can filter not just by connector type, but also supercharger v3 sites only.

I'm sure they will eventually. In the meantime, you can filter them by power in the Tesla app. V2 stations are 150kW while V3 stations are 250kW.

 

[Jimrpa]

All of the magic dock sites are V3. But there are only around a dozen of them in the country out of around 12,000 V3 plugs.

How do you know if a Tesla supercharger is V3?

 

[Jimrpa]

While watching this, I thought of a potential concern with the adaptors. They’ll be carrying high voltage/high current. They’ll also be subject to frequent physical connections/disconnections by people who may at times … be “careless”. Aren’t the connectors going to be subject to wear over time and become “loose”? Leading to potential overheating or arcing?

 

[Guss-E 2021]

I'm sure they will eventually. In the meantime, you can filter them by power in the Tesla app. V2 stations are 150kW while V3 stations are 250kW.

Well that, at least, is handy.

 

[Guss-E 2021]

While watching this, I thought of a potential concern with the adaptors. They’ll be carrying high voltage/high current. They’ll also be subject to frequent physical connections/disconnections by people who may at times … be “careless”. Aren’t the connectors going to be subject to wear over time and become “loose”? Leading to potential overheating or arcing?

Yes. Tom at State of Charge grilled the Ford charging guy he interviewed about this. The industry can't stress test this stuff enough, I tell you.

Laugh all you want about the idea and potential of inductive charging, but it completely eliminates all this noise. I use wireless charging almost exclusively on my phone and my charge port is as pristine as the day I got it. Friction sucks.

 

[azerik]

Seeing how most of my P&C's have failed to work I'm really hoping that Testla isn't going to use P&C as THE auth and charge system as many of us havn't been successful with it in it's current state. If Ford can't seem to get P&C functioning all of the time I can see frustration at a Tesla SC in our future. If I can RFID with with my phone or via the Tesla app I'm a little more upbeat about yet another protocol or protocol switcher being in play.

 

[generaltso]

How do you know if a Tesla supercharger is V3?

The biggest difference is that it has a much thinner cable.

 

[Jimrpa]

Yes. Tom at State of Charge grilled the Ford charging guy he interviewed about this. The industry can't stress test this stuff enough, I tell you.

Laugh all you want about the idea and potential of inductive charging, but it completely eliminates all this noise. I use wireless charging almost exclusively on my phone and my charge port is as pristine as the day I got it. Friction sucks.

I’ve been casually following inductive charging, and it’s very compelling. One company that looks interesting is Witricity. I’d love to see magnetic inductance charging take off.

 

[Jimrpa]

The biggest difference is that it has a much thinner cable.

Too bad they aren’t more visually distinctive - like an informational display or something. That’s one thing I think that’s weird about Tesla superchargers - there’s absolutely NO user interface.

Sponsored