Ford adapters for Tesla charging stations?

RandyMache

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So you are suggesting that the adapter could replace/ be integrated into the charge port? Interesting approach. I’m not sure there is room, or if Ford would be interested (in the liability of) in making that part. The CANBUS would effectively birth a new module to do this, I believe. I would need to peer at the wiring diagram, but I think there would also have to be NEW contactors to keep DC voltage away from the NACS pins at all times until the EVSE confirms those are DC pins and not AC pins.
If an adaptor already works, clearly this is just swapping out a plug for a different type of plug. What am I missing? Why is your answer so complicated? Yes it must be wired correctly, of course. But if Ford will sell [in 2025] MME’s with the new tesla plug, then it should be an easy swap. Ok, on the back side the wires have to be correct, but that doesn't seem like a big issue.
 

ArthurDOB

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Why do you think it would be so expensive, what’s your idea of expensive? Do you think under $1k?
"Expensive" is a relative thing. For me, if it was over $250.00, I'd call that too expensive. The whole idea makes no sense to me at any price over the cost of the alternative - the adapter.. Why not just use the adapter?
 

helium89

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If an adaptor already works, clearly this is just swapping out a plug for a different type of plug. What am I missing? Why is your answer so complicated? Yes it must be wired correctly, of course. But if Ford will sell [in 2025] MME’s with the new tesla plug, then it should be an easy swap. Ok, on the back side the wires have to be correct, but that doesn't seem like a big issue.
My understanding is that the current setup in the Mach-e has the high voltage DC current routed through one set of pins and the lower voltage AC current routed through another set of pins; NACS has both running through the same set of pins. That means that there needs to be hardware in the car to ensure that the correct type of current is routed to the correct circuit. The adapters avoid this problem by being designed for either AC (Tesla Tap) or DC (the unreleased Ford adapter), but not both. An adapter that did both would be dangerous because it would only take a small error to dump 380v of DC current onto an AC circuit that is not designed for it.
 

RandyMache

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My understanding is that the current setup in the Mach-e has the high voltage DC current routed through one set of pins and the lower voltage AC current routed through another set of pins; NACS has both running through the same set of pins. That means that there needs to be hardware in the car to ensure that the correct type of current is routed to the correct circuit. The adapters avoid this problem by being designed for either AC (Tesla Tap) or DC (the unreleased Ford adapter), but not both. An adapter that did both would be dangerous because it would only take a small error to dump 380v of DC current onto an AC circuit that is not designed for it.
So, how is ford going to do it? And again I ask, if they can do it at the factory, why can’t a dealer do it? I’m not disputing your comments, I’m simply saying it can’t be that difficult.
 


Maquis

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So, how is ford going to do it? And again I ask, if they can do it at the factory, why can’t a dealer do it? I’m not disputing your comments, I’m simply saying it can’t be that difficult.
It will require a control and switching module to detect whether AC or DC is connected and route the power accordingly. How much would such a module cost? Where could it be physically located in existing cars? We don’t know.
But it’s certainly more complex and expensive than an adapter that handles DC only.
 

buzznwood

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So, how is ford going to do it? And again I ask, if they can do it at the factory, why can’t a dealer do it? I’m not disputing your comments, I’m simply saying it can’t be that difficult.
This assumes that the charge port is going to be in the same place, if they switch and just leave it where it is its going to be useless as the charge cable wont reach. There are v4 superchargers coming that have a longer cable but also appear to use magic dock that means you don't even need to use a tesla connector in the first place.

There are around 1800+ super charger locations in the USA at present and the chances of all the stations at those locations being upgraded to v4 in time I suspect would be very slim, we are going to be in for years of a mixture of stations with both ccs1 and ncas connectors along with a whole host of legacy ones stuck using just one..

No matter what you do most people are in for needing to keep an adapter in the car and picking the best option based on where you want to charge. I also doubt existing tesla owners are going to be best pleased with a multitude of awkwardly parked vehicles blocking super chargers to get the cable to reach even if you have the correct native connector.
 

RandyMache

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It will require a control and switching module to detect whether AC or DC is connected and route the power accordingly. How much would such a module cost? Where could it be physically located in existing cars? We don’t know.
But it’s certainly more complex and expensive than an adapter that handles DC only.
Ok, but Tesla did it, and Ford is planning on doing it….. so I would bet that Ford has that part worked out.
 

helium89

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So, how is ford going to do it? And again I ask, if they can do it at the factory, why can’t a dealer do it? I’m not disputing your comments, I’m simply saying it can’t be that difficult.
On a hardware level, it’s likely that a dealer could successfully bolt in whatever parts are needed. It would likely require replacing several reasonably expensive components in both the AC and DC systems, and I assume it would involve dropping the battery to get access to the high voltage system. It would be an awfully expensive way of avoiding using an adapter.

On a software level, Ford would have to write and/or test updates for every hardware version of each of the relevant modules. That seems very unlikely to happen, especially when you consider the difficulties they’ve had managing the various software revisions so far.
 

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If you want a MME with a NACS connector buy a 2025 model when it becomes available, otherwise an adapter will be needed to use non-magic docked Tesla chargers.
 

RickMachE

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Ok, but Tesla did it, and Ford is planning on doing it….. so I would bet that Ford has that part worked out.
I fail to understand the reason you care about this.

First, Tesla did what? Design their cars to charge with their chargers?

Second, dealerships have labor charges of $125 per hour or higher. Are you willing to pay $1 - $2,000, or more with parts?

Third, Tesla charges non-Teslas slower than EA does. Why would you want that?

Fourth, Tesla charges more than other companies to charge.

Lastly, there will be more CCS chargers in the US, thanks to the Infrastructure Bill, a target of 500,000 total new chargers. A large percentage will be CCS, and remain that way for many years. Why would you want Tesla?
 

Shayne

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I'm more interested in how easily we will be able to connect with our charge ports in a different location than the Teslas.

I'm glad to have the extra options, even if there is some cost associated with it.
At a magic dock I did not need the adapter they had one. I opened the Tesla app, tapped charge a non-tesla, followed the instructions, charged at a steady 110, pushed the unlock button beside the port of the MME when up to required percentage and put the cable back. Had to charge at an end charger and take 2 spots because of cable length and MME port location. It was not a problem then but could be.

It is not cheap the most expensive up here. It is because Elon needs the cash that he is ripping us off. ;) It costs by the minute up here and with only 50 Kw chargers as another option you have to weight it takes an hour at 50 KW and 20-30 minutes at the SC. It is still more expensive but quicker.
 

Murse-In-Airy

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Ok, but Tesla did it, and Ford is planning on doing it….. so I would bet that Ford has that part worked out.
I bet Ford does have that part worked out. But likely it’s more than swapping the outlet on the car. There is a lot of converting and communicating going on across those multiple different pins.
Where an adapter can guide the high voltage to the existing high voltage pins, requiring no change on the car side. Once there aren’t high voltage and low voltage pins, somewhere in the car will have to make that decision. It could be a simple routing controlled by a switch built into the different port, or it could be a new onboard charging module in addition to the port and some reprogramming of the controlling module.
The first would be as easy as changing a wall outlet in your house. The second could require a new entrance to the house and a new breaker panel. Right now all we know is a change will occur. But I’d lean toward it being a bit more complex and nuanced.
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