Edmunds Massive Charging Comparison - MME is second to last.

[933233311602]

Edmunds did a comprehensive charging speed test on dozens of EVs in the US market.

Out of 43 tested vehicles the MME 4X and GTPE came in #40 and #41, respectively. Only the Bolt EV and EUV were slower to add miles.

Firstly, I call FUD on the "shocking" post title and poor reading of the article. The Mach E is not "second to last" in the rankings; there's a 2021 CA Route 1 example sitting at #33 right there!

Secondly, I personally don't care. The obsession over charge speed isn't a horse race I have much interest in. My standard-battery Mach E has plenty of range for most weekly use, occasionally needing Level 2 top-ups in my garage or at the charger provided at work.

Even if the Mach E was #1 in charge speed, I still wouldn't care. That's not an ability I have much use for. On long road trips when mid-voyage charging is necessary, I want a break from driving anyway. The ability to fully recharge in (for example) 20 minutes is, frankly, a nuisance. That's still not gas-pump fast but is just long enough to require me to stay with the car until finished since I'll be expected to move away for the next person. It's actually better if the charge takes twice as long, at 40 minutes, because that makes leaving the car to use a washroom, fetch a coffee, or just walk around a sensible use of the waiting time.

It's my opinion that we need to stop expecting car life with EVs to be the same as ICEs. Going to the well to fetch a bucket of gas is obsolete. The future is arriving at your destination, plugging in, and re-charging during the hours you're not driving. (There needs to be chargers everywhere.) For long trips when re-charging mid-voyage is needed, the future is rest and entertainment areas, beyond simple coffee & diesel truck-stops, where driving breaks are had while leaving the car parked to re-charge.

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[TheSteelRider]

Isn't the Premium AWD only ER? I question the testing methodology because they list a full 10% difference between the Premium AWD and the Premium RWD ER.

 

[MACH-E Mountain Way]

"Have solar"... what?

You've heard of solar panels, no?

They come in portable too. The point is electricity is all around...just ask Nikola. Electricity may be available in places where gas stations aren't.

 

[TheSteelRider]

I have taken about a dozen road trips that included one or more DCFC stops.

I can remember two times where I was waiting on the car to charge. The other 30 or so DCFC sessions the car was beyond where I wanted to be by the time I returned to the car.

Careful! Some people can't seem to understand you *can* in fact, multi-task while charging.

 

[MACH-E Mountain Way]

Isn't the Premium AWD only ER? I question the testing methodology because they list a full 10% difference between the Premium AWD and the Premium RWD ER.

No. There is a Standard Range model.

 

[Mach-Lee]

Yeah, literally had a Junghans Solar 1 watch some 30 years ago. It had a portable solar panel, but it probably would need 170 years to charge a 70kWh MME.

Exactly how does one pop up a portable solar generator to charge an EV? Have an F350 follow you around towing a MS-432 from Mobile Solar?

LOL.

Folds up on the hitch mount

 

[lwilliams0514]

The MME’s slow charging is detrimental on a bunch of different levels. It means that the MME is technologically behind its competition which affects new sales and resales. It puts a strain on the public infrastructure by reducing throughput. It wastes owners time and it wastes the time of others who have to wait behind the MME.

Assuming it is getting a full 150kw at a DCFC aren’t we talking about minutes extra? Rarely do people pull in at near 0% to charge. My MME takes about 20-30 to charge to 80%. That is reasonable. I think the majority of the time wasted at chargers is the availability (broken chargers, chargers down, etc) and that puts more stress on the ones that work.

Many of these problems will go away once Tesla opens up with their magic docks. I think the people will favor EA and EVgo because I think they will be cheaper.

 

[Ghost Ryder]

Charging speed is like IQ. You don't necessarily need to be the smartest, being in the middle is ok. But you don't want to be on the slowest among your peers.

 

[ArthurDOB]

On the list I found I didn't see my exact model listed (Premium 4X). The closest thing was the Premium AWD and the amount gained in an hour is essentially equivalent to a 100% charge on my Premium 4X.

What is a surprise about the actual results? Assuming the testing was done with some scientific reasoning anyway. The point is that when I got the Mach-E I was led to believe that it would take 35-40 mins or so to charge from 10% to 80% in a road trip situation. The extra 20 mins to get a basically 'full tank' in an hour sounds about right.

Admittedly I have only used a DCFC to see how it works and make sure my account was set up to use when needed. But when the time does come for me to sit and wait at a DCFC stop I will simply reflect on the countless hours that I have banked by 'fueling up' in my garage and smile...or I'll go grab a bite. It's not that big of a deal to me. And I get to drive the best looking car of the bunch IMO.

Would I like it to be faster? Sure. But I'd also like to be taller and better looking.

I will accept without evidence that they controlled all the variables, but I would like to see the data and what those variables were.

By the way, I could always get taller but I can't get any better looking! ?

 

[Blue highway]

The benchmark standard Tesla takes 12 minutes to add 100 miles according to their testing. The mustang takes an additional 6 minutes. The most interesting part of the testing as that there are over 40 EV cars to choose from. Wow!

in a year, the list will nearly double.

 

[Blue highway]

I’m curious why different trims of the same car would have different charging curves. I get that a bigger battery takes longer to charge but that is not how the article is measuring. Instead it’s miles added per hour.

Assuming the various trims have all got the same electronics shouldn’t they all charge at the same rate?

MME's add kW at one of two rates (rate for the SR battery, and a different rate for the ER battery)... but they use the kWh at very different rates... which is why efficiency matters.

kW/mi for the MMEs... RWD<AWD<GT AWD

 

[Blue highway]

Isn't the Premium AWD only ER? I question the testing methodology because they list a full 10% difference between the Premium AWD and the Premium RWD ER.

The RWD gets ~10% more range on the same charge and thus adds ~10% more miles per hour when charging.

 

[dj_stang]

So yeah the mustang is not the fastest. But it looks a lot better than the others. I was a shocked to see so many with over 10% charging loss. I would not be happy with this. Think of how much you are paying for that is wasted. Would you fill up a ICE with a gas tank with a leak of 10% of the gas pumped?

To be fair you have to consider the entire path from energy supply to movement. The loss in efficiency for EV is mostly at the charging station to the battery, and battery to motor efficiency can be up to 95%. On the other hand for ICE, yes the pump to gas tank is close to 100%, but the gas tank to motive power is between 20-30%.

 

[Shayne]

The new paradigm should be accepted because charging stations should be plentiful, clean, safe, with food and entertainment resources to make it pleasurable for those waiting for a 40-minute recharging event.

Fine, but are you willing to pay the $5 per kW price needed to support such infrastructure? Will you be the first one not to bitch about home charging costing 14 cents per kilowatt vs. $5 per kilowatt at the charging megaplex?

The problem is the public charging megaplex network you envision is not supported by any realistic economic market model.

Gas stations make very little on the gas per gallon they make it on car washes, coffee, snacks etc. We are already paying 10 to 20 times what we are paying at home for electricity and you think it will go up to 30 times if they do not put us in the back of a parking lot in the rain/snow. I think if people can make money off those that sit around and will buy stuff they will. I see electric charging becoming similar to gas stations in the future.

 

[GreaseMonkey]

The RWD gets ~10% more range on the same charge and thus adds ~10% more miles per hour when charging.

You make too much sense for this forum. It’s so annoying seeing you refute the hot takes and misinformation with logic, facts, and real evidence. Nothing personal but if your account is not banned, I will have to block you.

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