2022 car is bricked in garage :/

[GreaseMonkey]

It’s really only such a problem in the Mach-E since there’s no mechanical way to open any part of the vehicle if the 12V is dead. The electronic door latches are a failed “innovation”/fad and creates more problems than they solve.

If there was a way to open the frunk or any door with a key blade then you can just pop it open and jump it with a jump pack you keep in the car and be on your way. But instead you have to hope the 12V is dead enough to allow the emergency frunk pop and you still need an external 12V source.

Even a lithium 12V would be an improvement in longevity and reliability but there’s not really any standardized Li-ion 12V so they’re all proprietary. And when they do actually fail (as all batteries will eventually), they can cost thousands of dollars and you can only get them from the dealer.

Tesla’s 16v seems to cost $440 ??‍.

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[E90alex]

Tesla’s 16v seems to cost $440 ??‍.

Teslas LV Li-ion is teeeeny tiny. 6.9 Ah.

Teslas electrical system architecture is also fundamentally different than Ford which has its roots in ICE vehicles obviously.

Doing any little thing on a Tesla will “wake it up” and close the HV battery contactors and thus rely on DC-DC to power the vehicle systems. Even simply opening the Tesla app on your phone would wake the car and connect the HV until a recent update a few months ago. It can wake itself up at any point if needed to charge the LV.

Whereas Ford is a more “traditional” system where the HV battery for the most part remains disconnected unless the ignition is on or is actively charging. Thus relying more heavily on the 12V battery.

Although with all that said, Teslas still had rampant issues with 12V lead acids dying without notice before they switched to Li-ion. So it’s just an inherent problem with lead acid batteries, not a specific Ford issue.

Li-ion LV batteries in ICE vehicles with 60-80Ah capacity are typically thousands of dollars. Eg newer BMW M cars and some Porsches.

 

[GreaseMonkey]

Teslas LV Li-ion is teeeeny tiny. 6.9 Ah.

Teslas electrical system architecture is also fundamentally different than Ford which has its roots in ICE vehicles obviously.

Doing any little thing on a Tesla will “wake it up” and close the HV battery contactors and thus rely on DC-DC to power the vehicle systems. Even simply opening the Tesla app on your phone would wake the car and connect the HV until a recent update a few months ago. It can wake itself up at any point if needed to charge the LV.

Whereas Ford is a more “traditional” system where the HV battery for the most part remains disconnected unless the ignition is on or is actively charging. Thus relying more heavily on the 12V battery.

Although with all that said, Teslas still had rampant issues with 12V lead acids dying without notice before they switched to Li-ion. So it’s just an inherent problem with lead acid batteries, not a specific Ford issue.

Li-ion LV batteries in ICE vehicles with 60-80Ah capacity are typically thousands of dollars. Eg newer BMW M cars and some Porsches.

Insightful. Thank you. But the idea is to do a full sweep change to the entire architecture not only to the battery. Tesla sometimes changes for the sake of change, but this one seems appropriate. The industry has been threatening to go with a 48v for many years until Tesla did it in CT. I hope that prompts the industry to accelerate the evolution.

 

[Just Lurking]

My 2022 was recently tested by Ford mobile service at about the 26 month mark (about 30 months since build date) and was reported to me as "75%".

No idea if this is SOC or SOH so I don't take too much stock in it, but makes me wonder if I might qualify for a free replacement before the warranty expires.

 

[E90alex]

Insightful. Thank you. But the idea is to do a full sweep change to the entire architecture not only to the battery. Tesla sometimes changes for the sake of change, but this one seems appropriate. The industry has been threatening to go with a 48v for many years until Tesla did it in CT. I hope that prompts the industry to accelerate the evolution.

Yes, hopefully the next gen of EVs from Ford and other legacies will be less constrained by the “traditional” ICE methodologies.

 

[Shayne]

Or just use a 48v lithium ion and be done with it. Why do we need to be behind the times? The legacy OEMs are failing in the innovation game to our collective detriment.

I'd like to see a 12V power supply booting and running off the 365V 91 KW battery. A bigger 12V would be like putting a big CMOS battery in a computer to run it. Makes no sense when there it a electrical outlet or a huge lithium battery already.

Tesla’s 16v seems to cost $440 ??‍.

No cussing in the forum

Teslas LV Li-ion is teeeeny tiny. 6.9 Ah.

Teslas electrical system architecture is also fundamentally different than Ford which has its roots in ICE vehicles obviously.

Doing any little thing on a Tesla will “wake it up” and close the HV battery contactors and thus rely on DC-DC to power the vehicle systems. Even simply opening the Tesla app on your phone would wake the car and connect the HV until a recent update a few months ago. It can wake itself up at any point if needed to charge the LV.

Whereas Ford is a more “traditional” system where the HV battery for the most part remains disconnected unless the ignition is on or is actively charging. Thus relying more heavily on the 12V battery.

Although with all that said, Teslas still had rampant issues with 12V lead acids dying without notice before they switched to Li-ion. So it’s just an inherent problem with lead acid batteries, not a specific Ford issue.

Li-ion LV batteries in ICE vehicles with 60-80Ah capacity are typically thousands of dollars. Eg newer BMW M cars and some Porsches.

It does not help that they have fear of closing the contacts due to the HVJB issue. The contacts stay open to avoid too many cycles to save ford $.

 

[Guss-E 2021]

Good to hear the car is safely at the dealership. I also have 2022 Premium, factory order was shipped from Mexico in Sep 2022 and I took ownership on Oct 25, 2022 So three years coming up in 10 months. I have 25k Km, about 15k miLes, curious to find out when did you take ownership of yours in 2022 and did your batteries fail before 3 years. Thanks

I have a 2022 Mach-E Premium. Took ownership in May 2022. It has 48K on the odometer. Had one of the forum members remote into my car and check the health of my 12v. I'm at around 65% state of health. I plan on replacing the battery in May.

Not sure if my extended warranty will be cover it. I'm planning on paying out of pocket just in case.

Update: Extended warranty does not cover replacing the 12v. Not really surprised though. It is wearing out, not defective.

 

[Rusky]

I have a 2022 GT with 40'000 miles and came out after work the other day to a battery too weak to allow the car to start. I got the message on the big screen powering down to conserve energy. This makes absolutely no sense since it isn't like there is a huge starting current required. Fortunately I was able to open the door and the frunk at which point I put the window down and disabled walk away lock. After the jump start I called ford on the way home and since they had a battery in stock I picked it up and did the I stall and reset the BMS. The weird thing is that I did a l pool ad test on the old battery before I returned it and it passed with flying colors.

 

[Whoosahh]

I have read multiple statements and concerns about the strong possibility of the 12V battery needing replacement within 3 years. My 2022 Premium will hit the 3 year mark 10/2/25, but I currently have nearly 47,000 miles due to annual multi-state road trips and tri-state, I live in NY, weekend drives. However, I have taken my car for the 10,000 maintenance service just before the annual road trip for about 21,000 reward points, I am curious to know if those who have experienced the abrupt battery issues completed annual maintenance visits?

Thank you.

 

[alexgorod]

Whereas Ford is a more “traditional” system where the HV battery for the most part remains disconnected unless the ignition is on or is actively charging.

It also charges it when LV battery SOC drops below 50% (or something like that) unless HV SOC is below 15% (again, not sure in exact percentage that triggers the logic). And the LV SOH drops very quickly - in a few hours it goes from high 80s to 60s even for a new battery.

I'm not a specialist, but think that the high number of charges contributes to the low lifetime of the batteries in EVs.

 

[Thesnowback]

OP - did it turn out to be your 12v? Lots of posts here stating that it is your battery, but curious if that’s what the dealer found when they looked. Saw your statement about mfg date. Sorry if this is repetitive (I am sure someone will let me know if it is).

 

[E90alex]

It also charges it when LV battery SOC drops below 50% (or something like that) unless HV SOC is below 15% (again, not sure in exact percentage that triggers the logic). And the LV SOH drops very quickly - in a few hours it goes from high 80s to 60s even for a new battery.

I'm not a specialist, but think that the high number of charges contributes to the low lifetime of the batteries in EVs.

It’s a combination of things exacerbated by the small capacity batteries EVs use.

But most lead acid car batteries last 3-5 years typically anyways so it’s not far out of the norm. It’s just with an EV there’s usually no warning signs the battery is weak until it’s dead. In an ICE car you can tell when the car struggles to start. And even when that happens there’s still enough juice to run most of the electronics for a while longer so you’re not locked out (not even considering having mechanical door locks).

In an EV by the time the battery is too weak to flip the HV contactors it’s also too weak to run anything else, so the car is just totally dead.

 

[Shayne]

It also charges it when LV battery SOC drops below 50% (or something like that) unless HV SOC is below 15% (again, not sure in exact percentage that triggers the logic). And the LV SOH drops very quickly - in a few hours it goes from high 80s to 60s even for a new battery.

I'm not a specialist, but think that the high number of charges contributes to the low lifetime of the batteries in EVs.

Sitting at 35% in -20C certainly did not help at least now if you are lucky enough to receive OTA it is 55% (not for me). 55% when really cold is not helping the battery at all either. When you run all the tech off the 12V it is not hard to understand why it does not last that long. But also hard for the 12V to close those contacts when it is frozen solid.

It’s a combination of things exacerbated by the small capacity batteries EVs use.

But most lead acid car batteries last 3-5 years typically anyways so it’s not far out of the norm. It’s just with an EV there’s usually no warning signs the battery is weak until it’s dead. In an ICE car you can tell when the car struggles to start. And even when that happens there’s still enough juice to run most of the electronics for a while longer so you’re not locked out (not even considering having mechanical door locks).

In an EV by the time the battery is too weak to flip the HV contactors it’s also too weak to run anything else, so the car is just totally dead.

Old flood 12V's up here normally last a least a decade and AGM first impression is they last longer. May be 3 years for hot climates can not say but not the norm here. I guess if we keep repeating the same disinformation it eventually becomes fact?

 

[DaveR]

If you can get the frunk open, do it. Pull the rear and left side beauty panels. The battery jump points are under where the “+” and “-“ are on the left side beauty panels.

There are a pair of jump cables behind a pull out panel in the front bumper. It looks like a tow hook access but isn't.

 

[khbkhb]

Has anyone tried one of the memory savers, like https://a.co/d/htoYes3 unlike an ICE car we don't need a lot of amps ... just enough to switch on the HV battery ;>

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