RWG
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That's good data however it does not indicate heat output at different ambient temps. By default as ambient temps decrease pump heat output will decrease to. Also heat leakage from the cabin will increase as ambient temps decrease. So overall it is a bit of a science project to determine heat output and load. To add to the complications cabin heat leakage will vary significantly when to car is moving. Cabin heat loss is very different at 70 mph vs. 10 mph.
When it comes to repairs, normally on HVAC system I only replaced the part that failed not the whole system, the would be cost prohibitive. In addition one of the significant costs of fixing an AC system ,heat pump or standard AC is you have to manage / remove and replace the refrigerant. When I was doing that as a tradesman anybody could buy refrigerant by the pound. Now refrigerants have changed and sold by the ounce and it's much more expensive and I don't think you can even buy refrigerant unless you have a government (EPA) issued certificate/permit/license. The regulations all tightened up after the Montreal Protocol , 1987, was globally implemented to control holes in the ozone. Ironically this all became mute when the world decided Global warming was a bigger issue. As a result of the Montreal ProtocolL an entire category of refrigerants we used for decades became obsolete and then within a few years the entire industry got turned upside down again as non global agent warming refrigerants were introduced and no you normally CANNOT put old style refrigerants in new systems. That is kinda like putting gasoline in your diesel ICE vehicle. Not good.
When Kigali Amendment, 2016, was added to the Montreal Protocol, of 1987 everybody in the HVAC business had to start over in the formulation of refrigerants and the design of HVAC systems. Fortunately the new refrigerants and systems perform like legacy systems but they all use different and more expensive refrigerants and service techs cannot use their old tools, gauges, evacuation pumps, for fear of cross contamination and expensive regulatory violations. So if your a current HVAC tech working on pre - 1987 systems and everything else up to today, you will need some of the nearly same tools 3 times over and you must be certified because of government regulations. (You an be criminally charged and fined if you work on refrigeration systems without a license or illegal equipment. It's the law.)
I am glad to be retired, I have one set of pre 1987 tools , that I don't use, and wouldn't want to have 3 sets.
Sorry for the long narrative but it is a complicated subject that most people don't understand and this evolutionary change in. refrigerants impacts your vehicles, your refrigerator, your dehumidifier, and your car AC, the refrigeration & AC systems of your favorite grocery store, etc.. There are now literally millions of residential & commercial home AC systems now using R22 refrigeration which is technically discontinued and illegal to make. To repair one of these old systems you can only source used refrigerant and you may pay $300 per pound. When I was doing that type of work new R22 sold for about $3 per pound. At typical residential AC unit may have about 10 lbs. ($300) A car A/C system used to have a couple lbs. of R12 and then R134a and now R-1234yf which costs $3.50 to$5.00 per ounce! All of these old and new refrigerants have similar thermo dynamic qualities/specs. But each was designed to meet the needs of the industry and regulations at the time and each one costs more to accomplish the same thermal performance, at a much higher price.
Even though the EPA has recently dropped Global Warming. regulations, if you are a vehicle OEM selling cars outside the USA, I don't see the the USA OEM industry going back to the legacy refrigerant technologies. If they did they couldn't' sell any cars in other global markets, they have to comply with local regulations.
The whole world is using the new stuff and going back would cost $ billions, for no benefit, and in a few years might get changed again
Amen.
When it comes to repairs, normally on HVAC system I only replaced the part that failed not the whole system, the would be cost prohibitive. In addition one of the significant costs of fixing an AC system ,heat pump or standard AC is you have to manage / remove and replace the refrigerant. When I was doing that as a tradesman anybody could buy refrigerant by the pound. Now refrigerants have changed and sold by the ounce and it's much more expensive and I don't think you can even buy refrigerant unless you have a government (EPA) issued certificate/permit/license. The regulations all tightened up after the Montreal Protocol , 1987, was globally implemented to control holes in the ozone. Ironically this all became mute when the world decided Global warming was a bigger issue. As a result of the Montreal ProtocolL an entire category of refrigerants we used for decades became obsolete and then within a few years the entire industry got turned upside down again as non global agent warming refrigerants were introduced and no you normally CANNOT put old style refrigerants in new systems. That is kinda like putting gasoline in your diesel ICE vehicle. Not good.
When Kigali Amendment, 2016, was added to the Montreal Protocol, of 1987 everybody in the HVAC business had to start over in the formulation of refrigerants and the design of HVAC systems. Fortunately the new refrigerants and systems perform like legacy systems but they all use different and more expensive refrigerants and service techs cannot use their old tools, gauges, evacuation pumps, for fear of cross contamination and expensive regulatory violations. So if your a current HVAC tech working on pre - 1987 systems and everything else up to today, you will need some of the nearly same tools 3 times over and you must be certified because of government regulations. (You an be criminally charged and fined if you work on refrigeration systems without a license or illegal equipment. It's the law.)
I am glad to be retired, I have one set of pre 1987 tools , that I don't use, and wouldn't want to have 3 sets.
Sorry for the long narrative but it is a complicated subject that most people don't understand and this evolutionary change in. refrigerants impacts your vehicles, your refrigerator, your dehumidifier, and your car AC, the refrigeration & AC systems of your favorite grocery store, etc.. There are now literally millions of residential & commercial home AC systems now using R22 refrigeration which is technically discontinued and illegal to make. To repair one of these old systems you can only source used refrigerant and you may pay $300 per pound. When I was doing that type of work new R22 sold for about $3 per pound. At typical residential AC unit may have about 10 lbs. ($300) A car A/C system used to have a couple lbs. of R12 and then R134a and now R-1234yf which costs $3.50 to$5.00 per ounce! All of these old and new refrigerants have similar thermo dynamic qualities/specs. But each was designed to meet the needs of the industry and regulations at the time and each one costs more to accomplish the same thermal performance, at a much higher price.
Even though the EPA has recently dropped Global Warming. regulations, if you are a vehicle OEM selling cars outside the USA, I don't see the the USA OEM industry going back to the legacy refrigerant technologies. If they did they couldn't' sell any cars in other global markets, they have to comply with local regulations.
The whole world is using the new stuff and going back would cost $ billions, for no benefit, and in a few years might get changed again
Amen.
vd238
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That is at full-blast though right? I assume once desired cabin temp is reached, the resistive heaters would ramp power down.
That is a good point! I measured while parked, but maybe heat pump would draw more power when moving.
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