For tax credit purposes, is the Mach E an SUV? I'm not so sure...

[Rudy Bega]

I mean I'd agree that it's definitely more SUV than sedan to me. Especially when compared to the ICE Mustang. But I was surprised to see the Y and MME classed differently by that site considering they're usually considered direct competitors.

And yea I'm 200% a worrier. I should really ban myself from this site for a while just so I don't fall into more doom and gloom lol.

New Law looks to have categories and caps by category. Start to worry, caps are low…

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[easycomeeasygo]

It is somewhat disconcerting that different federal agencies call the MME different things.

And I am not arguing that you will not get the federal tax credit. I am simply pointing out that the rules in CA use the EPA rating irregardless of what your registration states. I have been deeply involved in tracking what the AQMD will do with the changes to the CA rebate program. You can read the proposed changes for yourself here. https://ww2.arb.ca.gov/sites/default/files/2021-10/fy21-22_fundingplan.pdf

But to back up my statement about the use of the EPA rating in CA read the following paragraph...

Bifurcate model minimum MSRP cap requirement; Reduce MSRP cap to $45,000 for smaller vehicle classes: In the FY 2020-21 Funding Plan, the Board approved staff’s proposal of a framework to bifurcate eligible vehicles into “Cars” and “Large Vehicles” based on EPA vehicle class. The Large Vehicles category includes minivans, pickups, and SUVs, while the Cars category includes all other light-duty vehicle classes (e.g., hatchbacks, sedans, wagons, two-seaters). Staff is proposing a reduction in the current MSRP cap of $60,000 to $45,000 for all vehicles that fall under the Cars category. This would exclude the BMW i3 REx (which has been phased out by BMW), and the Polestar 2. The proposed 25 percent reduction in the MSRP cap for cars is appropriate given the broader range of vehicles available in this class, their range options, and price points. This modest reduction would allow CVRP to continue to support the growing ZEV market, while placing an emphasis on more economical options. This change would not impact vehicles that fall under the Large Vehicle category as they would retain a $60,000 model minimum MSRP cap. As stated in previous updates to the long-term plan for light-duty vehicles, staff is making a change to this program lever to ensure that funding is not going to luxury vehicles and to encourage vehicle manufacturers to produce more affordable EVs.

 

[yngwenli]

I honestly feel no matter what they classify it as, you would have a valid claim to very successfully argue with the IRS if they deny you your federal EV credit.

There is too much general info (magazines, articles, other stuff folks posted here) that makes it too unlikely they would challenge the MME is a Sedan. Sure, they can, but the IRS isn't the most well funded government agency and it's unlikely anyone would get challenged on this for a MME (again, my opinion).

A long time ago (not THAT long actually), for anyone living in California and was shopping for properties in new areas, Mello-Roos were similarly argued and ambiguous whether it was property tax. A few legal challenges and lots more discussion and it's fine now and everyone just deducts it (even though recent tax laws make deductions not that helpful anymore).

Looking at the new EV tax credit, I think it's dumb to have vehicle price limits if the idea is to help climate. I suppose it's class warfare again saying just because someone can buy a Lucid Dream, they shouldn't get their credit because they're too rich. Just complicates the law and they should just find other ways to correctly tax the wealthy. Also, some car nuts may not be wealthy, but are just too into cars (or trucks) and might want something that they've always wanted...Not fair to those folks to deny them the credit. Some companies still pay $0 tax, but they're hoping to change that.

With the CA CVRP thing, that's more of a rebate and the funds are more limited (you can only get that 1 time now in your lifetime) so I'm less against that I suppose.

I guess it's good my MME is < 55k MSRP so what they do with the new law won't affect me (unless they put in that 40k MSRP limit the Senate had I think?)

Also, if this EV credit isn't refundable or POS, no poor person will be able to use this honestly.

 

[Kamuelaflyer]

Right. Zero chance.

Congress has routinely made tax code changes retroactive. The odds of the new tax credit, if any, being retroactive are substantially higher than zero.

 

[RickMachE]

Not if it reduces a credit.

 

[phil]

It is somewhat disconcerting that different federal agencies call the MME different things.

I find it helps to remember that all federal agencies are led and staffed by imbeciles.

 

[jddrews]

It’s entirely possible that the price thresholds reflect the base price of the vehicle. At a base price of $48,100 the premium falls well below the $55,000 cutoff.

 

[Ccarbs]

The build back better plan separates SUVs and then "all other vehicles". The mach e is a station wagon under the EPA, so it falls under the "all other vehicles" category. I have a premium AWD at $57k on order so this stinks. Unless they change the cap we are hosed. I may change it to a Rte 1 AWD that comes in at $54.7

 

[Ccarbs]

It’s entirely possible that the price thresholds reflect the base price of the vehicle. At a base price of $48,100 the premium falls well below the $55,000 cutoff.

It's MSRP of the vehicle, not base model

 

[RickMachE]

This thread is a great example of self-flagellation.

 

[BalsaDust]

The build back better plan separates SUVs and then "all other vehicles". The mach e is a station wagon under the EPA, so it falls under the "all other vehicles" category. I have a premium AWD at $57k on order so this stinks. Unless they change the cap we are hosed. I may change it to a Rte 1 AWD that comes in at $54.7

If you read back thru this thread and others you will see the truth, at least whats been theorized based on facts, conjecture, and possibly a Ouija board as well.
The bill has not been passed, changes can happen, and remember, the EPA is not the ones giving you the credit!

Tony

 

[Ccarbs]

If you read back thru this thread and others you will see the truth, at least whats been theorized based on facts, conjecture, and possibly a Ouija board as well.
The bill has not been passed, changes can happen, and remember, the EPA is not the ones giving you the credit!

Tony

Reading the actual bill proposed to the house is a better source, which is where my info is coming from. It is expected to be voted on when they come back in session next week. There are still some things in the air, but none of the things that specific congress members are holding out on are associated with this part of the bill. You are right that it hasn't passed yet, but it is starting to narrow down. The EPA doesn't give credits, but they do classify the vehicle type.

 

[BalsaDust]

Reading the actual bill proposed to the house is a better source, which is where my info is coming from. It is expected to be voted on when they come back in session next week. There are still some things in the air, but none of the things that specific congress members are holding out on are associated with this part of the bill. You are right that it hasn't passed yet, but it is starting to narrow down. The EPA doesn't give credits, but they do classify the vehicle type.

 

[Ccarbs]

Then educate me. What have I said that isn't true?

 

[generaltso]

none of the things that specific congress members are holding out on are associated with this part of the bill.

https://www.macheforum.com/site/threads/manchin-opposes-union-favored-tax-credit.11357/

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