Heat Pump Cold Weather Range?

[Jimrpa]

Ok, now that we have had a solid block of cold weather across the country, has anyone looked at the comparison of range between heat-pump equipped cars and non-heat pump cars?

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[DAC17]

I would be really interested in this, as my wife's 2023 extended range has lost at least a third of its range, in CT.

 

[CynicCE]

I set a departure for the morning commute, went to work, drove to grab lunch, drove to a meeting after work, back to office, and then home totaling 95.4 miles and i arrived home with 20% battery left. I'm in MN and the majority of the drive time was in sub zero temps so I had the heat blasting as well as the seat and steering wheel. It's a new to me 25 premium awd extended range and I knew the range cost of blasting heat as well as an occasional playful acceleration. I don't have anything to compare to but the multiple trips without conditioning the battery for more than the first trip leads me to believe I probably took a good hit warming the battery for those small trips too.

 

[Billyk24]

Would be even better if battery temperature could be displayed/revealed while driving the heat pump issued vehicles.

 

[Kamuelaflyer]

No data is available @Jimrpa. BEV batteries don’t function in temperatures approaching absolute zero.

 

[eponey]

Listen there is no magic here, it's a very complex answer. Just remember energy usage for the HVAC is accrued over time. So if the 5kw heater is running full tilt each hour it will use 5KW, so for an hour of drive time it would reduce the future range of a AWD mustang 16.3 miles (5x3.26).

You have to realize that in the situation that the ptc is running full tilt it's not obvious the heat pump would be using less power.

Now imagine the ptc is using 1kw which would reduce range 3.26 miles per hour. If the heat pump was perfect it would only use 1 ish miles per hour.

The endurance of the mach e is only like 5 hours at 65mph on a flat road.

So a ptc mach e would lose 16.3 miles the heat pump mach e could potentially only lose 5.5, over an entire 0-100 5 hour 300 mile trip, this is assuming a cop of 3 ish.

The relationship is not simple, it's even less simple given the car can scavenge heat in the later model years. So will it be better than a 21, yes, but will it be better than a 24 l, probably but less so.

Does this help you?

I know it's fun to be excited about a car but heat pumps are not magic fairy dust, they probably save energy at an increase to complexity.

Now if we work in their risk due to their complexity and future cost the whole thing probably goes tits up.

I have never not had to service the air conditioning on a car I've owned. The PTC can break but it's only a heating element hooked up to a couple of pipes.

 

[Blue highway]

Listen there is no magic here, it's a very complex answer. Just remember energy usage for the HVAC is accrued over time. So if the 5kw heater is running full tilt each hour it will use 5KW, so for an hour of drive time it would reduce the future range of a AWD mustang 16.3 miles (5x3.26).

You have to realize that in the situation that the ptc is running full tilt it's not obvious the heat pump would be using less power.

Now imagine the ptc is using 1kw which would reduce range 3.26 miles per hour. If the heat pump was perfect it would only use 1 ish miles per hour.

The endurance of the mach e is only like 5 hours at 65mph on a flat road.

So a ptc mach e would lose 16.3 miles the heat pump mach e could potentially only lose 5.5, over an entire 0-100 5 hour 300 mile trip, this is assuming a cop of 3 ish.

The relationship is not simple, it's even less simple given the car can scavenge heat in the later model years. So will it be better than a 21, yes, but will it be better than a 24 l, probably but less so.

Does this help you?

I know it's fun to be excited about a car but heat pumps are not magic fairy dust, they probably save energy at an increase to complexity.

Now if we work in their risk due to their complexity and future cost the whole thing probably goes tits up.

I have never not had to service the air conditioning on a car I've owned. The PTC can break but it's only a heating element hooked up to a couple of pipes.

yes... but there are lots of posts here where they do break... and cost something like $900.

 

[DonM]

From google gemini:


Winter Range Comparison: AWD Extended Range (91 kWh)
The table below compares the performance of the 2024 and 2025 models in typical sub-freezing temperatures (approx. -7°C to 0°C / 20°F to 32°F).

Metric	2024 AWD Extended Range	2025 AWD Extended Range
Heating Tech	Resistive (PTC) Heater Only	Vapor Injection Heat Pump + PTC
EPA Est. Range	300 miles	300 miles (No change in rating)
Real-World Winter Range	~180 – 210 miles	~225 – 245 miles
Range Loss vs. EPA	30% to 40% loss	15% to 25% loss
Winter Efficiency	~2.0 – 2.2 mi/kWh	~2.5 – 2.7 mi/kWh
Utility Trade-off	Larger Frunk (no heat pump)	Smaller Frunk (hardware space)

 

[eponey]

From google gemini:


Winter Range Comparison: AWD Extended Range (91 kWh)
The table below compares the performance of the 2024 and 2025 models in typical sub-freezing temperatures (approx. -7°C to 0°C / 20°F to 32°F).

Metric	2024 AWD Extended Range	2025 AWD Extended Range
Heating Tech	Resistive (PTC) Heater Only	Vapor Injection Heat Pump + PTC
EPA Est. Range	300 miles	300 miles (No change in rating)
Real-World Winter Range	~180 – 210 miles	~225 – 245 miles
Range Loss vs. EPA	30% to 40% loss	15% to 25% loss
Winter Efficiency	~2.0 – 2.2 mi/kWh	~2.5 – 2.7 mi/kWh
Utility Trade-off	Larger Frunk (no heat pump)	Smaller Frunk (hardware space)

Math doesn't work - your saying the ptc uses 27-36.8 kw vs 16 to 23 kw.

36.8kw is 7 hours of PTC use at 5kw.

 

[Maquis]

Math doesn't work - your saying the ptc uses 27-36.8 kw vs 16 to 23 kw.

36.8kw is 7 hours of PTC use at 5kw.

Well, it’s AI……so here we are.

 

[Sikkun]

Well, it’s AI……so here we are.

Hey the AI is probably pulling the results from the last time someone posted the AI results on here and therefore now they are fact!

 

[E90alex]

There’s way too many variables to give any definitive answer unless someone tests a 2024 and a 2025 at the same time in the same conditions driving the same way. Ideally at various temperatures.

 

[RickMachE]

AI should be banned. Total crap information.

No one, including Ford, has posted any comparison between pre and post heat pumps. Why. Negligible impact.

Over all Mach-Es sold by Ford, a negligible impact adds up to fleet impact. For a person, it's not noticeable.

 

[scout]

From google gemini:


Winter Range Comparison: AWD Extended Range (91 kWh)
The table below compares the performance of the 2024 and 2025 models in typical sub-freezing temperatures (approx. -7°C to 0°C / 20°F to 32°F).

Metric	2024 AWD Extended Range	2025 AWD Extended Range
Heating Tech	Resistive (PTC) Heater Only	Vapor Injection Heat Pump + PTC
EPA Est. Range	300 miles	300 miles (No change in rating)
Real-World Winter Range	~180 – 210 miles	~225 – 245 miles
Range Loss vs. EPA	30% to 40% loss	15% to 25% loss
Winter Efficiency	~2.0 – 2.2 mi/kWh	~2.5 – 2.7 mi/kWh
Utility Trade-off	Larger Frunk (no heat pump)	Smaller Frunk (hardware space)

 

[Kamuelaflyer]

AI should be banned. Total crap information.

Yup. AI, like that anyway, is extremely dependent upon exactly how you ask the question and how much detail or background you provide it. If you ask a general question without providing any context or additional information, you’ll get some rather “off” results.

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