Mach E Fast Charging Rate

[mkhuffman]

The SoH of my battery seems to drop daily so I fail to see how Ford's conservative DCFC strategy is helping the health of my battery. I also vote for a faster charging curve.

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[silverelan]

Yeah our pack charges very slow for how big it is, one of the slowest C rates of modern EVs. Most of the other manufactures allow 1.5C or greater rates down low as you can see. I think Ford could easily make our charging curve more like the ID4, so about 150 kW sustained. But they are just ultra conservative, I think it's driven by an extreme fear of potential future warranty costs. I've mentioned this before, but I find it bizarre how they've focused so heavily on limiting the DC charge curve and ignored enforcing a daily charge limit of 90% or less or moderating cold pack regen levels, which also contribute to early pack degradation.

The 2021-2022 ID4s use the same Polish LG Chem batteries as the MME yet VW can sustain 125-135kW for much longer at a low SoC.

The irony of Ford's conservatism with the battery pack to save money, is that it any saved money on battery warranties gets blown up because they cheaped out on the HVBJB.

 

[silverelan]

Agree. Yeah I really think it should be able to do 120+ kW for a while (like from 10-50%), and that shouldn't damage the pack. It can handle more than it does now and still meet the warranty targets IMO. It's just funny how they're super conservative about the DC charging curve, but very liberal when it comes to allowing huge amounts of regen when the pack is below freezing (not great for the pack). Also the lack of heating the pack to a decent temperature before giving a high DCFC rate. I think the Mach-E charges faster than any other EV (in terms of C rate) with a 0ºF pack temp, which isn't a good thing.

What I don't understand, is why Ford is standing still on the MME's DCFC charging. Aside from softening the landing off the 80% cliff, the charging profile for the MME is the same now as back in 2020. Contrast that with what other car companies like Tesla, Polestar, Volkswagen, and Volvo are doing to reduce charge times. It makes me wonder why Ford's engineers aren't working on this.

 

[21st Century Pony]

What I don't understand, is why Ford is standing still on the MME's DCFC charging. Aside from softening the landing off the 80% cliff, the charging profile for the MME is the same now as back in 2020. Contrast that with what other car companies like Tesla, Polestar, Volkswagen, and Volvo are doing to reduce charge times. It makes me wonder why Ford's engineers aren't working on this.

This is the graph of my son's 2020 Audi E-Tron charging curve.

 

[Shayne]

I do not DCFC a lot but it would be nice to see it do a steady 44 KW from 10 to 90% on 50 KW chargers. It did at one point but now does not as is clear at the second wall of the blue curve. Appears to have nothing to do with the physics of charging the pack and more time/soc based. Even if you have been charging only at 44 KW the wall at 80% is the same. The hard walls at 25 and 80% stand out. I would say they do not have the physic modeled quite right to date. Possible the programed walls are due to uncertainty as not much in nature behaves like that.

I will take the blue pill it is better than red one was. It appears there is still not too much to brag about when you roll into a charging station. Hey Alexa what's up with the DCFC curve?

Yellow 50 KW charger curve or shift that green one up.

 

[silverelan]

I do not DCFC a lot but it would be nice to see it do a steady 44 KW from 10 to 90% on 50 KW chargers. It did at one point but now does not as is clear at the second wall of the blue curve. Appears to have nothing to do with the physics of charging the pack and more time/soc based. Even if you have been charging only at 44 KW the wall at 80% is the same. The hard walls at 25 and 80% stand out. I would say they do not have the physic modeled quite right to date. Possible the programed walls are due to uncertainty as not much in nature behaves like that.

I will take the blue pill it is better than red one was. It appears there is still not too much to brag about when you roll into a charging station. Hey Alexa what's up with the DCFC curve?

Yellow 50 KW charger curve or shift that green one up.

is it confirmed that the charge rate after 80% is 30kW now and not > 40kW?

 

[At427]

I was pulling 44kW just a few percent before, at 95% it fell down towards level 2 rates.

 

[louc757]

is it confirmed that the charge rate after 80% is 30kW now and not > 40kW?

It depends on the day, outside temp, battery temp I think. Mine rate was lower, but as noted, some people are getting 40 kW. Here is my ray data. When I started, there was 1 other person charging. I was on an EA 350 kW charger. When I finished, all 6 chargers were in use.

Also, we had 3 MME in row!

 

[Shayne]

is it confirmed that the charge rate after 80% is 30kW now and not > 40kW?

Was in October I do not DCFC or long distance travel much in the winter. Only update since is the heating system.

Edit: above was after the power up. I went in right away for the TSB and this is the curve after it

Appears the power up down graded the TSB

 

[silverelan]

It depends on the day, outside temp, battery temp I think. Mine rate was lower, but as noted, some people are getting 40 kW. Here is my ray data. When I started, there was 1 other person charging. I was on an EA 350 kW charger. When I finished, all 6 chargers were in use.

Also, we had 3 MME in row!

nice data sheet! I bet that if there was another column for time, you’d see the peak charge rate last for 2 mins and that the row for 80kW/40% SoC would line up at the 20 minute mark.

The MME ER gets its best charging for twenty minutes but it’s at a relatively low kW compared to its competitors. It’s disappointing to me that since 2020, Ford hasn’t improved the 10%-80% charging time.

 

[louc757]

I took a trip to Cincinatti this weekend and needed to fast charge. I saw @Mach-Lee's post about battery preconditioning and wanted to see if I had this feature. I have a 23, with no OTA updates, Sync Ver 22280 or 10/7/22 and my car was built on 11/9/22. It turns out I do have it. I was able to warm the battery up to 80 deg F before charging.

I did not do this the last time I fast charged, and I obtained some interesting results. I started the charge at 23%. The first charger I used only got to 44kW, so I moved to another charger, and got over a 100 kW. This charge started at 25%. The last time when it was 40 deg out, with no preconditioning, the rate from 40-80% was about 76 kW. This time, from 40-60% I was at 100 kW, and then at 80 kW until 80%. From there it ramped down to about 40 kW. Here is a graph showing battery preconditioning vs no preconditioning. I'll post more later. The reason I went to Cincy was to go Micro center to build a new computer since I was running a Gen 1 i7 from 2009!. My new build is working, but I haven't moved everything over yet.

 

[bshaw]

I took a trip to Cincinatti this weekend and needed to fast charge. I saw @Mach-Lee's post about battery preconditioning and wanted to see if I had this feature. I have a 23, with no OTA updates, Sync Ver 22280 or 10/7/22 and my car was built on 11/9/22. It turns out I do have it. I was able to warm the battery up to 80 deg F before charging.

Did you use the Ford nav to tell the car you were heading to a DCFC session?

The reason I went to Cincy was to go Micro center to build a new computer since I was running a Gen 1 i7 from 2009!. My new build is working, but I haven't moved everything over yet.

That's amazing dedication to Microcenter!! After Fry's on the west coast folded, there really is no other store like Microcenter anywhere.

 

[louc757]

Did you use the Ford nav to tell the car you were heading to a DCFC session?

Yes, you have to use the Ford Nav and pick a charger from the CHARGERS tab. Waze, Apple maps, Google maps, etc won't work.

That's amazing dedication to Microcenter!! After Fry's on the west coast folded, there really is no other store like Microcenter anywhere.

Fry's was great too. Sad day when they closed. I got the parts from my last computer at Microcenter, and my son & I went back to pick out the parts fire the new one and we built it together. Great deal on an i7 with an Asus MB for $70, and great father/son time! I let him drive in the way back, he was all smiles. ?

 

[Shayne]

I took a trip to Cincinatti this weekend and needed to fast charge. I saw @Mach-Lee's post about battery preconditioning and wanted to see if I had this feature. I have a 23, with no OTA updates, Sync Ver 22280 or 10/7/22 and my car was built on 11/9/22. It turns out I do have it. I was able to warm the battery up to 80 deg F before charging.

I did not do this the last time I fast charged, and I obtained some interesting results. I started the charge at 23%. The first charger I used only got to 44kW, so I moved to another charger, and got over a 100 kW. This charge started at 25%. The last time when it was 40 deg out, with no preconditioning, the rate from 40-80% was about 76 kW. This time, from 40-60% I was at 100 kW, and then at 80 kW until 80%. From there it ramped down to about 40 kW. Here is a graph showing battery preconditioning vs no preconditioning. I'll post more later. The reason I went to Cincy was to go Micro center to build a new computer since I was running a Gen 1 i7 from 2009!. My new build is working, but I haven't moved everything over yet.

From what I understand it is not physics based but time based at the beginning and then a random wall at 80%. It drops faster at 80% if you have more points.

If you take your blue and shift the beginning to 5 - 10% they match pretty well.

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