Mach-E resale value

Popeye

Well-Known Member
First Name
Jason
Joined
Nov 15, 2019
Threads
3
Messages
59
Reaction score
68
Location
06067
Vehicles
2013 Ford Taurus
Occupation
Computer Programmer
Country flag
Availability of far better batteries in 2025 does not automagically replace the ones in your existing 2021 model. Even if you are willing to spend $10k or more they may not be compatible. The newer batteries may require a completely different BMS, thicker or wider bus cabling, etc etc.

If you want to go farther, recharge faster, or in general have to worry less about practicality of longer drives or dirves to more remote locales, you will care about the resale value.
Back last year when the MME, they said they were future-proofing the MME by overspecing it. Examples they gave were extra CPU’s, thicker cabling, etc. allowing for updates and upgrades later down the road. Pure speculation on my part, but might not be as daunting of a task to upgrade the battery as you might think.
Sponsored

 

dbsb3233

Well-Known Member
First Name
TimCO
Joined
Dec 30, 2019
Threads
54
Messages
9,297
Reaction score
10,812
Location
Colorado, USA
Vehicles
2021 Mustang Mach-E FE, 2023 Bronco Sport OB
Occupation
Retired
Country flag
Back last year when the MME, they said they were future-proofing the MME by overspecing it. Examples they gave were extra CPU’s, thicker cabling, etc. allowing for updates and upgrades later down the road. Pure speculation on my part, but might not be as daunting of a task to upgrade the battery as you might think.
It will be interesting to what the next generation of cells will be, and whether they will be backward compatable for upgrade/replacement. Just as important as wiring/BMS/etc is physical size. It could very well be that the most efficient size/shape of next-gen batteries won't fit in the same form factor that the MME now uses. (Like say, too tall.)

OTOH, higher energy density (by definition) means more power in less space. And most BEVs use similar skateboard shapes for the frame, so one would think nextgen batteries would be able to fit in that general shape. They just may not be able to be maximized in the pack as well as a new pack/skateboard designed precisely for the new battery.
 

Billyk24

Well-Known Member
First Name
William
Joined
Nov 29, 2019
Threads
88
Messages
1,581
Reaction score
792
Location
PA
Vehicles
Ford C-Max Energi, Premium Mach-E ordered
Country flag
It will be interesting to what the next generation of cells will be, and whether they will be backward compatable for upgrade/replacement. Just as important as wiring/BMS/etc is physical size. It could very well be that the most efficient size/shape of next-gen batteries won't fit in the same form factor that the MME now uses. (Like say, too tall.)

OTOH, higher energy density (by definition) means more power in less space. And most BEVs use similar skateboard shapes for the frame, so one would think nextgen batteries would be able to fit in that general shape. They just may not be able to be maximized in the pack as well as a new pack/skateboard designed precisely for the new battery.
I would disagree with concept of solid state batteries unable to fit in the same (current) size battery pack. That was not the message from where Bill Gate's investment company QS stands. They stated their pouches were smaller than the current lithium ion ones.
 

tomterky

Well-Known Member
First Name
E
Joined
Jun 30, 2020
Threads
5
Messages
198
Reaction score
396
Location
55129
Vehicles
2010 Mustang Pony Edition Convertible; 2021 Mach E
Country flag
When new batteries are developed and released, why couldn't they just be put into the Mach E already owned. Why get an entire new vehicle.

I know the obvious answers of less new money generated for a new vehicle...but why not start a new market.
 

Popeye

Well-Known Member
First Name
Jason
Joined
Nov 15, 2019
Threads
3
Messages
59
Reaction score
68
Location
06067
Vehicles
2013 Ford Taurus
Occupation
Computer Programmer
Country flag
When new batteries are developed and released, why couldn't they just be put into the Mach E already owned. Why get an entire new vehicle.

I know the obvious answers of less new money generated for a new vehicle...but why not start a new market.
obvious is money. But people style change as well. My brothers F150 from the 90’s is basically the same size as the new ford ranger. The new F150 is much much bigger. With OTA’s,I don’t see why they couldn’t be fitted in. I believe there was a discussion back I think in January on one these forums where we discussed it. I think the conclusion was if your willing to “pony” up the money for new battery, it should be compatible.
 


MerryBrown

Well-Known Member
First Name
Mary
Joined
Jul 24, 2020
Threads
20
Messages
416
Reaction score
809
Location
Northern, CA
Vehicles
2018 Ford Escape, Red Ford Mach-E on order
Occupation
Finance
Country flag
The question still stands, "How will the 2021 Mach-E's range and charging speed compare against rivals in 2024?"

I think the answer will drive the resale value.
I agree, but I also think reliability and customer satisfaction will also have something to do with it.
 

silverelan

Well-Known Member
Joined
Nov 25, 2019
Threads
117
Messages
3,018
Reaction score
4,295
Location
Seattle
Vehicles
2021 Mustang Mach-E GT
Country flag
That's a key. Living with frequent road trip charging (twice as often and half the distance of gas refuels) would be more palatable if they could cut the charging time in half.

But even if they can't and new BEVs in 2025 have more range and half the charge time, the MME will make for a good 2nd car to one of the new BEVs. Most MMEs today are likely going into 2-car households anyway (with the ICE as the road-tripper).
It's possible they can't make the MME's charging power much, if any, higher than 150kW. The Chevy Bolt EV for example is limited by its hardware to 55kW.

My family has only ever had one car and for me, the MME will be it. I'm genuinely curious how common it is to have the Mach-E as the only car or to be a pure EV-only household.
 

RyZt

Well-Known Member
Joined
Nov 17, 2019
Threads
14
Messages
674
Reaction score
815
Location
San Jose
Vehicles
Mach E4X
Country flag
My family has only ever had one car and for me, the MME will be it. I'm genuinely curious how common it is to have the Mach-E as the only car or to be a pure EV-only household.
I currently drive a 2013 CMax Hybrid. I'll replace it with Mach E ER AWD. Mach E will be the only car in my household.
 

Billyk24

Well-Known Member
First Name
William
Joined
Nov 29, 2019
Threads
88
Messages
1,581
Reaction score
792
Location
PA
Vehicles
Ford C-Max Energi, Premium Mach-E ordered
Country flag
It's possible they can't make the MME's charging power much, if any, higher than 150kW. The Chevy Bolt EV for example is limited by its hardware to 55kW.

My family has only ever had one car and for me, the MME will be it. I'm genuinely curious how common it is to have the Mach-E as the only car or to be a pure EV-only household.
the charging profile -taper- means more than the max charging power. This was shown and confirmed by a Tesla owner on this forum displaying the taper at the V3 charger and needing 40+ minutes to "fill-up".
 

timbop

Well-Known Member
First Name
Tim
Joined
Jan 3, 2020
Threads
63
Messages
6,729
Reaction score
13,758
Location
New Jersey
Vehicles
Solar powered 2021 MME ER RWD & 2022 Corsair PHEV
Occupation
Software Engineer
Country flag
the charging profile -taper- means more than the max charging power. This was shown and confirmed by a Tesla owner on this forum displaying the taper at the V3 charger and needing 40+ minutes to "fill-up".
Yes and that screen shot you posted in that thread is misleading: the time remaining on the screen is to go to 100%, not 80% (look at where the bar is on the battery picture). Frequently, the last 20% on DCFC can take as much time as the first 80%, and I suspect you know that. The Mach E will likely take well over an hour to "fill up" on DCFC. That is why the general rule of thumb is not to bother charging that extra 20% at a DCFC charger. The M3 LR charges 10%-80% in 25 minutes on an v3 supercharger. Skip to the 2:30 mark of the following video and see it go from 10% to 80%, although the car still says "30 min remaining" when it is at 80%SOC. The car is calculating the time to go to 100%.
https://insideevs.com/news/427836/tesla-model-3-v3-supercharging-test/

As for the taper, yes that is more critical than the peak of the curve. Hopefully the SR/ER MMEs do better than 38 and 45 minutes to go 10%-80%. I am hopeful that they will, but we'll see.
 

buzznwood

Well-Known Member
Joined
Nov 14, 2019
Threads
3
Messages
1,113
Reaction score
1,328
Location
california
Vehicles
focus st & GTPE
Country flag
It will be interesting to what the next generation of cells will be, and whether they will be backward compatable for upgrade/replacement. Just as important as wiring/BMS/etc is physical size. It could very well be that the most efficient size/shape of next-gen batteries won't fit in the same form factor that the MME now uses. (Like say, too tall.)
While the future is a pure unknown, even if manufactures have no interest 3rd parties will no doubt offer solutions after all the electric motor doesn't care where it gets the electricity from, however with the battery being a large % of the cost of a BEV manufactures will be leaving money on the table not offering upgrades further down the line.

There is also the issue of spares, in various parts of the world legislation requires that spare parts be made available for a number of years post sale no manufacture is going to be storing spare batteries for the best part of 10 years so chances are if you need to replace a module that they will be created in such a way that any future revisions will be made so that they can be made to work as a spare for early models either with a smaller module or a similar size but higher density equivalent.
 

Shayne

Well-Known Member
Joined
Aug 9, 2020
Threads
18
Messages
3,338
Reaction score
2,484
Location
Northern Ontario Canada
Vehicles
2021 MME4x Prem
Occupation
Retired
Country flag
That's why we'll likely keep it 10-15 years, along with our Escape to pair with it.

Whether it's better than ICE still depends on each buyer's situation. For some purposes, yes; for other purposes, no.
10 to 15 is our forecast also; first one I have wax for ;) as I want to limit depreciation (just to us; not for resale).

For a cleaner future we may be required. I can just drive it to a rental car location and rent one. For 99% of our needs it will suit us fine. If I need to go a far distance, for an emergency, @ -5 oF I would need only to drive to a rental car location and the MME should make it. Here is hoping that 1% is highly unlikely. For some it is no more gas stations, not as many service appointments, less hassle, and hopefully less annual expense; not only on fuel cost but maintenance. I do agree that at the stage of current tech, as anything, does not fit all. Once the 4 electric motor versions start coming out more and more may find them attractive. In evolving tech if you look at what is coming in the future you will never buy anything.

There are a few things I can name where you can change their batteries. As far as backward compatibility that should be an advantage for parts and supply/profit. The latest CPU normally requires a new motherboard but that silver dollar cmos battery has been around since IBM's first pc's. Nothing is future proof and you need to pick if it fits your needs.

OT: Has anyone seen an electronic owners manual to date? Maintenance schedule, extended maintenance offers etc.? Tesla has a no void warranty even if 0 maintenance is done.
 

rplinpa

Well-Known Member
First Name
Roger
Joined
Apr 25, 2020
Threads
7
Messages
78
Reaction score
48
Location
New Oxford, PA
Vehicles
Mustang Mach E
Occupation
Business owner
Country flag
From my experience all new cars depreciate pretty fast after introduction. Two things are in the Mach-E's favor: 1. For those with an FE, it may enter the realm of being a collector's item and 2. because the computer will be updated regularly through the web, it is less likely to become as obsolete as other cars have in the past.
 

RW Journey

Well-Known Member
Joined
Mar 15, 2021
Threads
3
Messages
110
Reaction score
120
Location
Dallas
Vehicles
2021 Ford MME FE
Country flag
Here is my take: solid state electric car batteries arrive in 2024. Your 300 mile range MME becomes 475 with the new more energy dense battery pack. Your 10-80% SOC charging experience at 45 minutes becomes just under 15 minutes. This is all being stated by QuantumScape (QS) which Bill Gates has an investment in and the company recently raised 1 billion in investments . QS is going to deliver these batteries for VW starting in 2024. These solid state batteries are designed in a pouch, smaller than the current lithium-ion pouches meaning additional pouches can be fitted into the existing battery pack hardware. Links: https://www.pv-magazine.com/2020/09/04/us-battery-builder-quantumscape-raises-1-billion/ https://www.quantumscape.com/

EV autos are undergoing remarkable advances. The MME of 2021 could appear "dated" in 2025 if the prediction of solid state batteries in EV is correct. Resale values dropping 50% in four years is likely accurate with this type of advancement.
While the future is a pure unknown, even if manufactures have no interest 3rd parties will no doubt offer solutions after all the electric motor doesn't care where it gets the electricity from, however with the battery being a large % of the cost of a BEV manufactures will be leaving money on the table not offering upgrades further down the line.

There is also the issue of spares, in various parts of the world legislation requires that spare parts be made available for a number of years post sale no manufacture is going to be storing spare batteries for the best part of 10 years so chances are if you need to replace a module that they will be created in such a way that any future revisions will be made so that they can be made to work as a spare for early models either with a smaller module or a similar size but higher density equivalent.
Absolutely! Just look around today at batteries, how many brands provide "specialized" batteries for legacy products? Several. Swapping parts on cars isn't new. If new batteries are lighter and less capacity can fit in a legacy vehicle, the weight savings could have a positive impact on range..
Sponsored

 
 




Top