Tesla Slashes Prices

[MacherAWD]

but otherwise there's really no difference between AP and BC

One allows hands free, one doesn't, and I say that because if I have to keep hands on the wheel I just drive. I am in New England and every highway I have driven is BC, if it's not hands free I don't use the system in the MME. Just me personally, but it's the first time I consistently use cruise control in 25 years of driving.

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[Auto Motive]

Price is great.

May want to research the real world range.

Did my homework. Driver owner .CA

at or below 60 MPH: ≈ 400 miles or more; 70-75 MPH: ≈ 300 miles; at or above 80 MPH: ≈ 250 miles or less

 

[Mach1E]

Did my homework. Driver owner .CA

at or below 60 MPH: ≈ 400 miles or more; 70-75 MPH: ≈ 300 miles; at or above 80 MPH: ≈ 250 miles or less

Depends on the temp of course.

Basically you quoted the EPA range, but real world Teslas don’t hit those numbers. And your above numbers are still a bit optimistic. https://www.torquenews.com/9539/mus...estimates-testing-while-tesla-falls-short/amp

 

[Pushrods&Capacitors]

Did my homework. Driver owner .CA

at or below 60 MPH: ≈ 400 miles or more; 70-75 MPH: ≈ 300 miles; at or above 80 MPH: ≈ 250 miles or less

Never seen anyone get anywhere near 400 miles of range in any Y even at 60mph and below. And, there are tons of neighbors that have 3s and Ys in our neighborhood. To a person, everyone I’ve ever chatted with (4-5 of them maybe ?) says they’ve never gotten stated range. It’s a common shortcoming that the non-sycophants readily admit.

That said, even the 317 miles (EPA 326 rating) or whatever Edmunds got for the Y is a good distance (60/40 city/hwy split). Be careful of the Y Perf though, it’s rated at 290 and Edmunds got 263, that’s getting a bit short for the $.

Car and Driver got 220miles from a Y LR on their 75mph highway loop, the Mach E 4X got 250. The Y is EPA rated at 330 and that Mach E was 270. That’s more typical of Teslas.

 

[Ghost Ryder]

Did my homework. Driver owner .CA

at or below 60 MPH: ≈ 400 miles or more; 70-75 MPH: ≈ 300 miles; at or above 80 MPH: ≈ 250 miles or less

I have a MYP and I get about 200 miles at 80.

 

[Ghost Ryder]

$15,000 is “overcharge.”

Full circle from the point I made pages ago- it’s one way Tesla makes up for the low base prices.

I already stated how they’re dishonest. So did the NYT article. Why do you keep wanting to beat that dead horse?

15k is overcharge for you but people were willing to pay for it. Market forces. Overcharge is if I said something cost x, but then I charged you x+y without you knowing it. You can argue that it’s overpriced. No argument from me there. But it’s not overcharged.

No. You made a claim that Tesla didn’t release the data. But they did.
I offered a simple solution that only requires NHTSA data that you can point to but claims that Tesla is hiding. If that data is available then show it. The fact that nhtsa don’t have it does not mean that Tesla is dishonest. You can only compare data that’s available

 

[moparguy]

Are you really going to argue that blue cruise is more capable than FSD?

tesla autopilot can function just fine without touching the steering wheel. when It first came out it did t even require the occasional tap if the wheel. It only added because regulators required it to insure drivers were paying attention. But it has not effect of the actual capability of the auto driving suite.

as far as capability between the two systems, FSD vs BC I dont think you can find anyone that can Honestly argue that BC is more advance.

He is pretty much insisting that FSD is the same as bluecruise and adding FSD to the price of a MY Performance to make it sounds like the price of both cars are equal.

I can't argue him any further.

 

[moparguy]

I have a MYP and I get about 200 miles at 80.

With the recent price decrease, no ev makes sense for me other that MYP today, not even worth going M3P, I like the 80 part, I usually do 80-90 highway too, is that 200, for 100% of battery or 80%?
With my Mach E, I am losing about 25-27% of my EPA range, from what I am reading, my loss would be more like 30-33% on the MYP, what's your thoughts?

 

[moparguy]

This was musks personal decision against his engineers. So Tesla was not confident, Musk was. It was a choice on ego, similar to his over-hype of what's available now vs what's coming. And yes it is coming, AI in cities and once national highway and safety oversight signs off by all means let it loose. For now keep it in regulated zones.

Following his " EGO " is the reason why you drive a Mach E today, the reason why this forum exists, if he didn't follow his " EGO " Ford would be still selling Fiestas and Focus with bad trannies and owners would still be complaining on forums.

I never liked Tesla until the last two years, I am hardcore MoparGuy as you can see from my name, but I am willing to try, that's why I drive a Mach E and that's why I gave Tesla the chance, people need to give the guy credit he deserves, 13+ years he's trying hard and competitors are laughing that Tesla will fail until they realized it won't! and now everyone is jumping on the bandwagon.

I personally don't trust any driving assistance software, I used bluecruise multiple times on my GT and twice it drove directly to the lane divider never touched it again, won't buy fsd on a Tesla even if it was $4k but that's just me, these are all beta systems that require my full attention, if I have to watch the road anyway, I'll do it for free.

 

[Ghost Ryder]

So by your logic if 1,000 big ego software CEOs flood our streets with random beta self driving you are good with that? 100 million random programs in use tomorrow? Or is just Tesla allowed to do it?

Actually I believe there should be regulations and certifications. And if they abide by the regulations then they’re good to go. Don’t like the regulations? Talk to your Congress representative to change it. speaking of which. Is BC or supercruise certified and anyway? Or do we just accept that’s it’s safe to use?

 

[MacherAWD]

Actually I believe there should be regulations and certifications. And if they abide by the regulations then they’re good to go. Don’t like the regulations? Talk to your Congress representative to change it. speaking of which. Is BC or supercruise certified and anyway? Or do we just accept that’s it’s safe to use?

There has to be something, similar to how you mention Tesla was hands free then it became required. But there must be some approval needed. I remember Benz applying for L3 in Arizona or something, but tough to find details.

And yeah I agree on regulations, sadly this is where Congress is so old, out of touch and bickering they can't comprehend the tech regulations needed.

 

[MacherAWD]

Following his " EGO " is the reason why you drive a Mach E today, the reason why this forum exists, if he didn't follow his " EGO " Ford would be still selling Fiestas and Focus with bad trannies and owners would still be complaining on forums.

I never liked Tesla until the last two years, I am hardcore MoparGuy as you can see from my name, but I am willing to try, that's why I drive a Mach E and that's why I gave Tesla the chance, people need to give the guy credit he deserves, 13+ years he's trying hard and competitors are laughing that Tesla will fail until they realized it won't! and now everyone is jumping on the bandwagon.

I personally don't trust any driving assistance software, I used bluecruise multiple times on my GT and twice it drove directly to the lane divider never touched it again, won't buy fsd on a Tesla even if it was $4k but that's just me, these are all beta systems that require my full attention, if I have to watch the road anyway, I'll do it for free.

Been driving EV since 2016, considered a Tesla multiple times, done research, they haven't been for me when shopping. But for example had I been shopping recently I would have bought a Y over a MME. That said my beef is with the constant overstating of FSDs ability. You can be on a MME Facebook page, someone mentioning BC and you get bombarded by Tesla people screaming "we can drive handsfree, hang an ankle weight!" A leader is responsible for their rhetoric and his has created an army of clueless owners.

 

[Mach1E]

15k is overcharge for you but people were willing to pay for it. Market forces. Overcharge is if I said something cost x, but then I charged you x+y without you knowing it. You can argue that it’s overpriced. No argument from me there. But it’s not overcharged.

No. You made a claim that Tesla didn’t release the data. But they did.
I offered a simple solution that only requires NHTSA data that you can point to but claims that Tesla is hiding. If that data is available then show it. The fact that nhtsa don’t have it does not mean that Tesla is dishonest. You can only compare data that’s available

Sigh…… fine, it’s “overpriced.”

Do you honestly think that the NHTSA doesn’t have data on where crashes occurred? On urban roads vs highways?

Fine, I’ll google for you.

Guess what? Here’s some categorical data including “fatalities on urban roads……”
https://www.nhtsa.gov/press-releases/early-estimate-2021-traffic-fatalities

Yup, just like the NYT said. Tesla cherry picked data so we don’t know how safe autopilot really is.


More examples of how we don’t know if it’s making things safer:
https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a...s-hundreds-of-crashes-driver-assistance-tech/

“

• Its first report says there have been 392 vehicle crashes in the U.S. involving a Level 2 driver-assist system, six of which had fatalities. However, it's not possible to draw many conclusions from this data, even whether the driver-assist systems are making things worse or better.”

 

[Ghost Ryder]

Sigh…… fine, it’s “overpriced.”

Do you honestly think that the NHTSA doesn’t have data on where crashes occurred? On urban roads vs highways?

Fine, I’ll google for you.

Guess what? Here’s some categorical data including “fatalities on urban roads……”
https://www.nhtsa.gov/press-releases/early-estimate-2021-traffic-fatalities

Yup, just like the NYT said. Tesla cherry picked data so we don’t know how safe autopilot really is.


More examples of how we don’t know if it’s making things safer:
https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a...s-hundreds-of-crashes-driver-assistance-tech/

“

• Its first report says there have been 392 vehicle crashes in the U.S. involving a Level 2 driver-assist system, six of which had fatalities. However, it's not possible to draw many conclusions from this data, even whether the driver-assist systems are making things worse or better.”

The nhtsa link above is for urban roads. AP is used on the HWY. So how does this data apply?

We were talking about data regarding accidents per mile traveled on the HWY. You still haven't produced it. If it's there, then show it. I'm not saying the NHTSA don't have the data. It's that it's not released. So you can't fault Tesla for not releasing data that the NHTSA doesn't have or has not released.

 

[Ghost Ryder]

Been driving EV since 2016, considered a Tesla multiple times, done research, they haven't been for me when shopping. But for example had I been shopping recently I would have bought a Y over a MME. That said my beef is with the constant overstating of FSDs ability. You can be on a MME Facebook page, someone mentioning BC and you get bombarded by Tesla people screaming "we can drive handsfree, hang an ankle weight!" A leader is responsible for their rhetoric and his has created an army of clueless owners.

To make tesla Hands free, all they have to do is change the interior camera to an Infrared one. Can't cost more than a few dollars. Don't know why they haven't done it yet.

I wouldn't say their owners are clueless. I haven't heard of any reports where the owner activated FSD and let it drive directly into a wall. People are pretty vigilant when handing control over to a computer, it goes for BC too. Exceptions are a few idiots that intentionally do stupid stuff to get clicks like jumping in the back seat.

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