Mach-E GT Performance Edition - First Drive Preview by Motorweek

Interesting. Does this mean the embargo is over?

I like the Willy Wonka reference.

They also make a pretty bold claim, “we wish we could tell you it’s like the Mustang GT coupe, but in reality it’s much better.” I honestly wasn’t expecting that to be how the sentence ended.

Mach1E said:

Interesting. Does this mean the embargo is over?

I like the Willy Wonka reference.

They also make a pretty bold claim, “we wish we could tell you it’s like the Mustang GT coupe, but in reality it’s much better.” I honestly wasn’t expecting that to be how the sentence ended.

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Yea, that's something John Davis will be hearing about.

Carsinmyblood said:

Yea, that's something they'll be hearing about.

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Although it is kinda SOP for internet journalism these days. Say something a little outlandish that will elicit a response, then put a “comments section” below the article/video.

1. What's up with their color wash on the still shots of Grabber Blue?
2. That "better than a Mustang Coupe" comment is going to make nOt A mUsTaNg! people crazy

Just wait till they take it to that ancient drag strip they use and it traps a fat 101. My man John Davis is gonna turn even more red than that damn spray tan has him already.

But I bet it does great on the road course portion.

Pushrods&Capacitors said:

Just wait till they take it to that ancient drag strip they use and it traps a fat 101. My man John Davis is gonna turn even more red than that damn spray tan has him already.

But I bet it does great on the road course portion.

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I still have it as a “maybe” on the road course.

We know 2 things about power delivery so far:

1. in normal modes, it cuts power significantly after just a few seconds of full throttle, then continues to cut power for subsequent full throttle (for an unknown amount of time). This would be horrible for the track.

2. in unbridled extend, it cuts power all the time to a unknown amount. Seems to be about 75% power based on acceleration runs so far. Also horrible if a 480 hp car can only use 360 hp.

Seems like unbridled extend turns a GT into a regular AWD in terms of power. So the only track advantage would be the brakes and suspension?

Side note on unbridled extend. When reading about it months ago, did anyone expect it to make the car slower? Not me for sure! I thought it would let you use 100% power for longer (at the track).

Mach1E said:

Side note on unbridled extend. When reading about it months ago, did anyone expect it to make the car slower? Not me for sure! I thought it would let you use 100% power for longer (at the track).

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I thought you were going to be able to tap into the part of the battery they're not using on all the vehicles for a select amount of time to wring out every last bit of performance they can. Not hamper it just so you can spend more time doing laps at a slower pace.

Mach1E said:

Side note on unbridled extend. When reading about it months ago, did anyone expect it to make the car slower? Not me for sure! I thought it would let you use 100% power for longer (at the track).

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I did since you couldn't possibly make it last longer without limiting some other factors.

Mach1E said:

I still have it as a “maybe” on the road course.

We know 2 things about power delivery so far:

1. in normal modes, it cuts power significantly after just a few seconds of full throttle, then continues to cut power for subsequent full throttle (for an unknown amount of time). This would be horrible for the track.

2. in unbridled extend, it cuts power all the time to a unknown amount. Seems to be about 75% power based on acceleration runs so far. Also horrible if a 480 hp car can only use 360 hp.

Seems like unbridled extend turns a GT into a regular AWD in terms of power. So the only track advantage would be the brakes and suspension?

Side note on unbridled extend. When reading about it months ago, did anyone expect it to make the car slower? Not me for sure! I thought it would let you use 100% power for longer (at the track).

Click to expand...

As you know from other threads, we’re on the same page re: power limiting issue.

My comment about doing great on track is based on chassis/steering/braking performance, separate from the power issue. The current high point of the 4X for enthusiast types is the neutral chassis balance, steering feel, and damper tuning. After seeing the Throttle House review I checked it out myself, and it is true. Even on horrific, low-grip 225/55-19 Michelin Primacy touring tires you can feel the responses to inputs that let you know it’s special.

So, you take that already well sorted chassis and then tune it for the track and you can really do something. And although I believe GM’s chassis engineers are the best in the business currently, Ford has really closed the gap since the S550 launch in 2015. Big time.

On big tracks like VIR, COTA and the like the GT isn’t ready for prime time with the power cut issue but at those small technical tracks that Throttle House, Edmunds, MT and those guys use it is absolutely gonna kill the competition.

And yes, I understood Unbridled Extend to be a track use mode that would allow multiple laps without battery cooling issues and drastic power loss. But not full-tilt boogie the whole time. Basically, it was a shot across the bow of Tesla, which is notorious for shitting the bed in hard lapping. Less so with the 3 than the S. But still.

Pushrods&Capacitors said:

As you know from other threads, we’re on the same page re: power limiting issue.

My comment about doing great on track is based on chassis/steering/braking performance, separate from the power issue. The current high point of the 4X for enthusiast types is the neutral chassis balance, steering feel, and damper tuning. After seeing the Throttle House review I checked it out myself, and it is true. Even on horrific, low-grip 225/55-19 Michelin Primacy touring tires you can feel the responses to inputs that let you know it’s special.

So, you take that already well sorted chassis and then tune it for the track and you can really do something. And although I believe GM’s chassis engineers are the best in the business currently, Ford has really closed the gap since the S550 launch in 2015. Big time.

On big tracks like VIR, COTA and the like the GT isn’t ready for prime time with the power cut issue but at those small technical tracks that Throttle House, Edmunds, MT and those guys use it is absolutely gonna kill the competition.

And yes, I understood Unbridled Extend to be a track use mode that would allow multiple laps without battery cooling issues and drastic power loss. But not full-tilt boogie the whole time. Basically, it was a shot across the bow of Tesla, which is notorious for shitting the bed in hard lapping. Less so with the 3 than the S. But still.

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I figured not “full tilt boogie” the whole time.

But as it stands, it’s not “full tilt boogie” any of the time.

I would have accepted that a BEV would start to pull power after a few laps. Right now it pulls power after 4 seconds, or you can run reduced power the whole time.

There is no “go run a lap at full power” option. And if Ford wants a BEV to be a serious performance competitor, this is a huge issue.

It’s not like this is a new unknown hurdle. How many years has Formula-E been around?

Mach1E said:

Interesting. Does this mean the embargo is over?

I like the Willy Wonka reference.

They also make a pretty bold claim, “we wish we could tell you it’s like the Mustang GT coupe, but in reality it’s much better.” I honestly wasn’t expecting that to be how the sentence ended.

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I doubt it since they really didn't say anything except "the GT is faster and the GTPE is faster than that. kthxbye"

This isn't any different than the original GT video where they showed it driving around a track and didn't say a single thing about stats or performance.

Mach1E said:

I figured not “full tilt boogie” the whole time.

But as it stands, it’s not “full tilt boogie” any of the time.

I would have accepted that a BEV would start to pull power after a few laps. Right now it pulls power after 4 seconds, or you can run reduced power the whole time.

There is no “go run a lap at full power” option. And if Ford wants a BEV to be a serious performance competitor, this is a huge issue.

It’s not like this is a new unknown hurdle. How many years has Formula-E been around?

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I hear ya. And yet, the acknowledged battery tech leader still can’t get its cars to hot lap repeatedly either. That’s why they go to shorter tracks like Laguna Seca or Willow and run fantastic times and then go to the big-boy pants Nurburgring and run like 12th best in the production sedan category even though the Plaid accelerates like Light incarnate from what’ve I’ve read/seen. ?

I didn’t expect Ford to solve it in a $60-$70K suv. But, 8-10 hot laps at 75-80% is way better than 3/4 of a lap at 100%. Ask the Model S P90/100D fellas.

physib said:

I did since you couldn't possibly make it last longer without limiting some other factors.

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I figured the limiting factor would be battery life.

I figured wrong.

Now knowing what they did, I understand why. But it seems like we are going to have to add this to the list of “things to fix about BEVs before they completely replace ICE.”

Having a “track mode” that makes you slower seems like the opposite of what the goal should be. The BEV engineers have some more work cut out for them. Make the battery better.

Yes, Tesla has degradation after a while (at lower SOC), but making it slower right away? Lame.

Pushrods&Capacitors said:

I hear ya. And yet, the acknowledged battery tech leader still can’t get its cars to hot lap repeatedly either. That’s why they go to shorter tracks like Laguna Seca or Willow and run fantastic times and then go to the big-boy pants Nurburgring and run like 12th best in the production sedan category even though the Plaid accelerates like Light incarnate from what’ve I’ve read/seen. ?

I didn’t expect Ford to solve it in a $60-$70K suv. But, 8-10 hot laps at 75-80% is way better than 3/4 of a lap at 100%. Ask the Model S P90/100D fellas.

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Is it too much to ask for 1 lap at 100% then the remainder at 75-80 though?

Personally I won’t track the car. But there are definitely situations I want more than 4 seconds of full power.