agoldman

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just seeing this. this is messed up. not even a proper band aid it seems. I'm afraid to drive the car now. bad case of buyers remorse and absolutely no confidence in this software update or Ford in general. sigh..
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ARK

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Unbridled extend disables brake regen and switches to using friction brakes only. So I assume the idea here is to come down the hill just using the friction brakes, but you can do the same just by switching to neutral.

Seeing how going up hills really eats into your range the last thing you want to do is not take advantage of the fact that the regen will be able to maintain your speed coming down the other side while putting energy back into the battery. No body should have to work around one of the actual benefits of an EV
Interesting, I didn’t know that. But just to be clear, when you say disables brake regen, you mean lifting off the accelerator doesn’t cause any regen AND pressing the brake pedal doesn’t also doesn’t trigger some regen?

Because otherwise with say Whisper, where there is no/very little accelerator lift-off regen, you still get regen when you press the brake pedal. Ditto for Engage and Unbridled (except of course those two modes have increasing amounts of accelerator lift-off regen).
 
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scoopman

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just seeing this. this is messed up. not even a proper band aid it seems. I'm afraid to drive the car now. bad case of buyers remorse and absolutely no confidence in this software update or Ford in general. sigh..
I’m looking at other EVs. This isn’t acceptable to me. Also let’s think about this new part.
Do we think they’ve put more engineering rigor and quality in developing and testing it? Have they changed their testing since they shipped our cars with the original part? Do you think they’ve changed anything in testing since modeling the software that was supposed to protect and fix the issue?

There are very few cars with the new part in the real world and I'm now going to be their tester to see if this new part has basic reliability.

I'm at the stage now that I don't trust the engineering in the car or Ford in standing behind it.
 

agoldman

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I’m looking at other EVs. This isn’t acceptable to me. Also let’s think about this new part.
Do we think they’ve put more engineering rigor and quality in developing and testing it? Have they changed their testing since they shipped our cars with the original part? Do you think they’ve changed anything in testing since modeling the software that was supposed to protect and fix the issue?

There are very few cars with the new part in the real world and I'm now going to be their tester to see if this new part has basic reliability.

I'm at the stage now that I don't trust the engineering in the car or Ford in standing behind it.
I agree with you 100%. Only problem now is the scarcity of alternative vehicles. But honestly this makes me feel sick. Really disappointed (and plenty mad). They now need to do a major recall and fix the hardware period. This isn't going to help resale either.
 

agoldman

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It's the half assed way they are handling this so far. Feels like a semi cover up. I'm afraid to drive my car for fear of being stranded. Geeze... think we should all take our cars to the track and floor it until the parts fail so we can get proper ones and don't have to drive with constant worry about failure. What a load of s***. Sorry, but I'm really mad at this. The software fix is simply the equivalent of a tow truck. bleh..

furthermore, this OTA should be available NOW, 100% to anyone who wants to download it. Period! F'ing Ford Idiots!
 
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ARK

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Timbop is another member that has me ignored so not sure if he'll see your response since you tagged me. ?‍♂

But to negate his point, there's a lot of talk on this forum about "damaged" contactors. There's nothing that indicates that compounding damage is to blame. I'm not a Ford Engineer so I can't say for certain that is the case, but from my understanding it is not the case. Welding isn't something that happens progressively over time in MOST cases.

Normally what happens, from what I was explained, is that the silver alloy of the contact tips will heat up and become molten and then tack weld themselves. This happens because of excessive heat which will cause said "molten" status. There's also the possibility that when the contactor opens it welds at that point, but that's due to it being cycled while it's still molten and then when it cools the tack is applied. So the issue is purely the process of heating and cooling, not damaging.

My sources say that Ford is even worried about the software being too late to the game (being vague). I think we'll find out more as time goes on.
Do you have a thought on what the warning scoopman’s Mach-E threw could mean? Or put differently, do you think his HVBJB really was toast and he was wise not to turn the vehicle off?

I suppose if this contactor issue is all or none, and his HVBJB had not yet failed, what metric could the vehicle have detected that it threw an error code, thinking failure was in the very near future?
 
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scoopman

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It's the half assed way they are handling this so far. Feels like a semi cover up. I'm afraid to drive my car for fear of being stranded. Geeze... think we should all take our cars to the track and floor it until the parts fail so we can get proper ones and don't have to drive with constant worry about failure. What a load of s***. Sorry, but I'm really mad at this. The software fix is simply the equivalent of a tow truck. bleh..

furthermore, this OTA should be available NOW, 100% to anyone who wants to download it. Period! F'ing Ford Idiots!
track use would negate the warranty I bet -- but driving your car normally like I did last Thursday is well within the normal operation covered by the warranty.
 

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This update feels like a diagnostic tool for ford to determine which HVBJB they should replace while satisfying NHTSA requirements. As said here, not a fix. We can only hope Ford will do the right thing before a class action lawsuit is needed.

Sucks to have to debate taking my $72k car from an easy NY to DC drive next week.

Good luck scoopman on your trip back. Can’t wait to see what happens….
 

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Do you have a thought on what the warning scoopman’s Mach-E threw could mean? Or put differently, do you think his HVBJB really was toast and he was wise not to turn the vehicle off?
Let me just say, he called me as soon as he got the error. I told him - DO NOT TURN OFF THE CAR.

I suppose if this contactor issue is all or none, and his HVBJB had not yet failed, what metric could the vehicle have detected that it threw an error code, thinking failure was in the very near future?
Could be resistance, temps, power draw. I don't personally know for sure but something comes up out of spec. There's some smart electrical engineers here that have made educated guesses and I'm sure they are probably correct. Resistance, from my understanding is normally visible with arcing and pitting, or damage, which again, can happen, but in these cases I don't think that's what's happening. I would assume once the contactors are in a molten state there would be something that could be measured as well.

I hope that more details about his HVBJB will be made public to him so he can talk about it.
 
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scoopman

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Do you have a thought on what the warning scoopman’s Mach-E threw could mean? Or put differently, do you think his HVBJB really was toast and he was wise not to turn the vehicle off?

I suppose if this contactor issue is all or none, and his HVBJB had not yet failed, what metric could the vehicle have detected that it threw an error code, thinking failure was in the very near future?
The new workshop instructions for the DTC I had specifically state to replace the HVBJB and potentially also BECM. The car limits your power to 30% on the highway. I don't think these are some false worries that you can ignore.
 

ARK

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The new workshop instructions for the DTC I had specifically state to replace the HVBJB and potentially also BECM. The car limits your power to 30% on the highway. I don't think these are some false worries that you can ignore.
I didn’t mean to imply that at all, I agree 1000% percent that what happened is wholly unacceptable. You were driving a key route in one of the most EV-friendly places in the world. I was just trying to get a handle on what exactly happened on a technical level.
 
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scoopman

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Do it!

I hope that you put all of this on YouTube for everyone to see. A collaboration video with an EV automotive journalist would help.

@Ford Motor Company refusal to put new HVBJB in every under-spec'ed car is absolutely awful.
I didn’t mean to imply that at all, I agree 1000% percent that what happened is wholly unacceptable. You were driving a key route in one of the most EV-friendly places in the world. I was just trying to get a handle on what exactly happened on a technical level.
I would be surprised if I'm told that, this is a highly-regulated industry and it is pretty clear to me that the recall solution that Ford proposed to NHTSA for a core safety issue does not work.

We should expect to hear basically the same amount of information from Ford, which is not anything more than they are required to state legally.

The only way Ford will be forced to replace the faulty parts is if pressure is applied by owners in visible forums like this (which it is claimed is read by Ford executives), in the press, in their stock price, and legally through NHTSA or class action lawsuits.

I hope someone from Ford is reading these messages, especially those from other owners who now are doubting trusting their cars (and you should be if you have a GT).
 

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The only way Ford will be forced to replace the faulty parts is if pressure is applied by owners in visible forums like this (which it is claimed is read by Ford executives), in the press, in their stock price, and legally through NHTSA or class action lawsuits.

I hope someone from Ford is reading these messages, especially those from other owners who now are doubting trusting their cars (and you should be if you have a GT).
Have you made another submission to NHTSA, detailing that you had another failure after having the recall software applied? Maybe they will not view Ford's solution to be sufficient?
 
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scoopman

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Have you made another submission to NHTSA, detailing that you had another failure after having the recall software applied? Maybe they will not view Ford's solution to be sufficient?
I am working on a full document to send directly to the nhtsa investigator who emailed me.
 

MustThee?

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I would be surprised if I'm told that, this is a highly-regulated industry and it is pretty clear to me that the recall solution that Ford proposed to NHTSA for a core safety issue does not work.

We should expect to hear basically the same amount of information from Ford, which is not anything more than they are required to state legally.

The only way Ford will be forced to replace the faulty parts is if pressure is applied by owners in visible forums like this (which it is claimed is read by Ford executives), in the press, in their stock price, and legally through NHTSA or class action lawsuits.

I hope someone from Ford is reading these messages, especially those from other owners who now are doubting trusting their cars (and you should be if you have a GT).
You mentioned “if you have a GT” but my understanding is that it is not GT only issue, correct?
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