Wear on motor(s) with 1-pedal driving?

[Teslaeata]

In general, the motor assembly consists of:

1. Rotor - Contains an arrangement of permanent magnets and ... well ... rotates.
2. Stator - Contains an arrangement of coils of wire and stays stationary, hence why it is called a "stator."

The rotor and stator do not make contact with each other whatsoever.

I am going to assume you know what magnets and electromagnets are, as well as what poles are and how opposites attract and like poles repel. You make the motor move by applying electrical pulses to the stator in a specific manner to attract and repel the magnetic poles on a motor in the way you want.

Regenerative braking relies on the fact that a changing magnetic field induces current in a coil of wire. It is just like how any generator works. As a rotating machine by itself, it can change roles (motor vs. generator) anytime ... It is up to the motor drive electronics (motor).

Like others may have mentioned, wear and tear of the motor comes from heat (hence the coolant going into the motor, gearbox, and inverter), mechanical stresses (torque), and friction (hence the lubrication).

If you have about an hour, look at this video from Weber State University in Utah where Professor Kelly shows the motor taken apart and points out the various features:

Always like a Weber video, though

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[Nikos]

In general, the motor assembly consists of:

1. Rotor - Contains an arrangement of permanent magnets and ... well ... rotates.
2. Stator - Contains an arrangement of coils of wire and stays stationary, hence why it is called a "stator."

The rotor and stator do not make contact with each other whatsoever.

I am going to assume you know what magnets and electromagnets are, as well as what poles are and how opposites attract and like poles repel. You make the motor move by applying electrical pulses to the stator in a specific manner to attract and repel the magnetic poles on a motor in the way you want.

Regenerative braking relies on the fact that a changing magnetic field induces current in a coil of wire. It is just like how any generator works. As a rotating machine by itself, it can change roles (motor vs. generator) anytime ... It is up to the motor drive electronics (motor).

Like others may have mentioned, wear and tear of the motor comes from heat (hence the coolant going into the motor, gearbox, and inverter), mechanical stresses (torque), and friction (hence the lubrication).

If you have about an hour, look at this video from Weber State University in Utah where Professor Kelly shows the motor taken apart and points out the various features:

I like to add a story from my own personal experiences. As an aircraft mechanic/avionics tech, I have seen 2 catastrophic failures of aircraft generators. Since these gens always generate electrons at specific frequencies, 400HZ and at maximum load up to 200A, and rotate at close to 18000rpm, they get hot. As long as the aircraft is flying there is airflow ducted to the inside of the generator to keep it cool as possible. Over time the heating and cooling of the generator, especially at altitudes, weakens the copper windings and magnets which they become very brittle. Without any warning the generator will destroy itself. Of course the components that regulate the generator’s frequency and voltage will shut down the delivery of electrons to the aircraft. The flight crew will try to reengage the generator without any success. I usually tell the FE upon landing to insert his hand at the cooling inlet and grab a handful of the copper and magnets that have fallen out of the generator. My reply is….your generator is gone.
Since the principle on our EVs of how a motor/generator operates is the same, heating and cooling and prolonged hard operation of the motors over time will take its toll on these components.
Hopefully they are designed to handle 2-3 times higher loads,( HP, Torque, RPM and Heat ), that us human operators ask from them.
Eventually they will fail but the gentler me and you use them, the longer they last.

 

[Makiato]

There is a misconception that somehow the car will operate 'differently' depending on if you use 1PD or 2PD mode. It doesn't. It's the same motor/brakes/regen system regardless of which mode you use.

It's like there is a device that turns on, and you have the option to push a button or pull a lever. There is no difference in how the device operates, it just depends on whether you like pushing buttons or pulling levers.

almost true. bearings are loaded during acceleration & deceleration. bearings are not loaded during free spinning. there IS a difference between 1PD & off.

 

[Makiato]

I like to add a story from my own personal experiences. As an aircraft mechanic/avionics tech, I have seen 2 catastrophic failures of aircraft generators. Since these gens always generate electrons at specific frequencies, 400HZ and at maximum load up to 200A, and rotate at close to 18000rpm, they get hot. As long as the aircraft is flying there is airflow ducted to the inside of the generator to keep it cool as possible. Over time the heating and cooling of the generator, especially at altitudes, weakens the copper windings and magnets which they become very brittle. Without any warning the generator will destroy itself. Of course the components that regulate the generator’s frequency and voltage will shut down the delivery of electrons to the aircraft. The flight crew will try to reengage the generator without any success. I usually tell the FE upon landing to insert his hand at the cooling inlet and grab a handful of the copper and magnets that have fallen out of the generator. My reply is….your generator is gone.
Since the principle on our EVs of how a motor/generator operates is the same, heating and cooling and prolonged hard operation of the motors over time will take its toll on these components.
Hopefully they are designed to handle 2-3 times higher loads,( HP, Torque, RPM and Heat ), that us human operators ask from them.
Eventually they will fail but the gentler me and you use them, the longer they last.

Finally. An informed response. Not an opinion or smart ass wrong opinion. thank you.

 

[Brent@ANParts]

Technically, yes, one pedal driving introduces additional wear on the motors, but it's a negligible amount given the added stress it puts on them. Drive how you like!

 

[devmach-e]

almost true. bearings are loaded during acceleration & deceleration. bearings are not loaded during free spinning. there IS a difference between 1PD & off.

When you press on the brake pedal, the motor is turned into a generator. Only if the braking request can’t be satisfied by regenerative braking will the friction brakes engage. Pretty much no difference in 1PD and 2PD.

 

[grein002]

almost true. bearings are loaded during acceleration & deceleration. bearings are not loaded during free spinning. there IS a difference between 1PD & off.

Yes, but most of the "additional stress" that is alleviated by coasting is then realized during braking, as the system still uses regen at that point. You are trading WHEN the regen is being applied, not removing it from the equation entirely.

 

[Mach-Lee]

I like to add a story from my own personal experiences. As an aircraft mechanic/avionics tech, I have seen 2 catastrophic failures of aircraft generators. Since these gens always generate electrons at specific frequencies, 400HZ and at maximum load up to 200A, and rotate at close to 18000rpm, they get hot. As long as the aircraft is flying there is airflow ducted to the inside of the generator to keep it cool as possible. Over time the heating and cooling of the generator, especially at altitudes, weakens the copper windings and magnets which they become very brittle. Without any warning the generator will destroy itself. Of course the components that regulate the generator’s frequency and voltage will shut down the delivery of electrons to the aircraft. The flight crew will try to reengage the generator without any success. I usually tell the FE upon landing to insert his hand at the cooling inlet and grab a handful of the copper and magnets that have fallen out of the generator. My reply is….your generator is gone.
Since the principle on our EVs of how a motor/generator operates is the same, heating and cooling and prolonged hard operation of the motors over time will take its toll on these components.
Hopefully they are designed to handle 2-3 times higher loads,( HP, Torque, RPM and Heat ), that us human operators ask from them.
Eventually they will fail but the gentler me and you use them, the longer they last.

FYI the windings of the main Mach-E motor are oil cooled. The thermal shock should be a lot less than on an airplane.

I think the motors on this car will last a long time unless the fluid changes are missed. Battery will go first.

 

[superdave80]

almost true. bearings are loaded during acceleration & deceleration. bearings are not loaded during free spinning. there IS a difference between 1PD & off.

Why do you think that 1PD and 2PD have different 'loadings'?

 

[Nikos]

FYI the windings of the main Mach-E motor are oil cooled. The thermal shock should be a lot less than on an airplane.

I think the motors on this car will last a long time unless the fluid changes are missed. Battery will go first.

Agree.!!
From my own experiences and observations, on long trips, I monitor both my motors with an OPD II reader and carscaner app. The dashboard options are many. I monitor the flow of electricity, rpm, temps, hp and torque. For a 4 1/2 year old Mach E all looks and operates nominally. Within specs.
I still enjoy my Mach E.

 

[Bad Dolphin]

One tip is to always use premium electricity as to avoid knocks and pings 🫨

Oh, that's interesting! So if I have a TOU meter, I should always fill up our Mach E at the premium hours. Thanks!

 

[Deleted member 19354]

Oh, that's interesting! So if I have a TOU meter, I should always fill up our Mach E at the premium hours. Thanks!

Oh let me ask Siri🫨

 

[MME Farmer]

In general, the motor assembly consists of:

1. Rotor - Contains an arrangement of permanent magnets and ... well ... rotates.
2. Stator - Contains an arrangement of coils of wire and stays stationary, hence why it is called a "stator."

The rotor and stator do not make contact with each other whatsoever.

I am going to assume you know what magnets and electromagnets are, as well as what poles are and how opposites attract and like poles repel. You make the motor move by applying electrical pulses to the stator in a specific manner to attract and repel the magnetic poles on a motor in the way you want.

Regenerative braking relies on the fact that a changing magnetic field induces current in a coil of wire. It is just like how any generator works. As a rotating machine by itself, it can change roles (motor vs. generator) anytime ... It is up to the motor drive electronics (motor).

Like others may have mentioned, wear and tear of the motor comes from heat (hence the coolant going into the motor, gearbox, and inverter), mechanical stresses (torque), and friction (hence the lubrication).

If you have about an hour, look at this video from Weber State University in Utah where Professor Kelly shows the motor taken apart and points out the various features:

Just as an observation after watching this very interesting video. We use many 10 - 20 hp electric motors on the farm and about any of them appear to be bigger in size than these 280 hp motors. I realize that 400 volts vs 120 volts makes for a lot of the difference, but I only know enough about electricity to get into trouble so that's probably why it seems kind of amazing to me. I also noticed since my 21 GTPE does exactly 123 mph as it says it does and looking up the revs/mile on the extreme contacts I just put on, that means the motors are turning roughly 13425 rpm's so not far from their max.

 

[Kamuelaflyer]

What do you think the rotor spins on?

I’m right, aren’t I?

 

[Teslaeata]

FYI the windings of the main Mach-E motor are oil cooled. The thermal shock should be a lot less than on an airplane.

I think the motors on this car will last a long time unless the fluid changes are missed. Battery will go first.

Oil cools the transmission & motor, coolant cools the oil by means of a heat exchanger.

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