DBC

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I'm confident I'm not going to get 3.3 miles/kWh in my drives. The temps aren't an issue but it's too hilly. Lots of energy to move a 5000 pound vehicle up hills. Regen helps but you don't get back everything you lose. I'm also quite a bit more aggressive, so I'll be happy with 3 miles/kWh.

I'm not going to drive until the battery goes flat. I'll get the report from the MME as to how many miles it thinks it got per kWh and I can check that against the power in kWh used from the wall. I'll assume the MME has 88 kWh available and come up with a range.

These tests have so many uncontrolled variables it's hard to draw any real conclusions. Probably safe to say that the ranges of the MY and MME AWD Ext aren't gong to be very different. The MME RWD Ext will probably go a little further, though from the reports of a member who has driven both you'll need to trade some range for some fun.





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DBC

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One other point Bjørn is thinking and I also have heard from a few other autotest drivers. They think ford is really only allowing you to use 84kwhmaybe 85kwh of the battery now.
I think the chances of Legal letting Ford advertise 88 kWh available and then making only 84 kWh available is about zero. Anything of course is possible but allowing that type of misrepresentation to slip through would have to fall into the "not likely" category.

The estimates of how much battery is left and how much range is left may be pessimistic but that's different than not delivering the number of kWh promised.
 

timbop

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I think the chances of Legal letting Ford advertise 88 kWh available and then making only 84 kWh available is about zero. Anything of course is possible but allowing that type of misrepresentation to slip through would have to fall into the "not likely" category.

The estimates of how much battery is left and how much range is left may be pessimistic but that's different than not delivering the number of kWh promised.
My theory is that zero on the guess-o-meter isn't really zero, the same way "E" isn't really empty on an ICE. They may cap displaying the value at 0 (ie not allow it to go negative), but it seems likely that they might leave a couple kwh available for nitwits like me who push it beyond where I'm supposed to.

Just my uninformed opinion.
 

Woeo

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Let's take one step back and look at ICE vehicles. Generally when fuel efficiency is compared, it is between vehicles in the same class, i.e., of similar type, size, etc., curb weight of each vehicle certainly has an impact on its mpg ratings but it rarely enters the conversation when people compare the fuel efficiency of two vehicles in the same class.
Rarely do two comparable vehicles in the same class vary in curb weight by so much, however that part of my discussion was more of an aside and meant only to draw attention that there are multiple variables contributing to Tesla's efficiency number. Some maybe related to motor & battery technology while others relate to basic physics.

The MY may have a lower drag coefficient and it may be lighter, but there are associated costs. The slippery design is not well liked, for example. To lose pounds Tesla MY may not be built to as high a standard. Maybe the frunk hood needs to be gingerly closed lest it bend & dent.

To me personally range beyond 250 miles is not meaningful as nearly all of our day-trips are within a 100-mile radius and none is beyond a 125-mile radius. For longer road trips I would take the minivan anyway. So I am hardly someone obsessed with the number.
You have made your determination. Great for you. But, the question isn't what meets your needs.

The question is what is the real world range of these cars [MME and MY] and, by extension, how efficient are they? That is being sorted out bit by bit. The rest of us are looking for that information to make our decisions in an informed way.

Alex has created some data points. As has Edmunds. Both are in the business of comparing autos and making range estimates of EVs and traditional vehicles. I trust they are making their claims as cross-comparable as possible. Are there aspects that raise questions? Yes. Hence the discussion.

Whatever other issues Tesla vehicles may have, they have had a head start on improving efficiency and as a result set the benchmark for now. That may very well change in the future as competitors improve their products.
You introduced efficiency as a way to assert that Tesla is the market leader.

My point in making the range comparisons and spelling out the efficiency numbers was to make the clear that right now there are data points, from reputable sources, showing Tesla may not be the benchmark in terms of range or efficiency. Tesla may be losing in terms of overall range [attributable in large part to MME's larger battery] but also may be less efficient [or comparable] in terms of m/kw or Wh/m in a real world full battery test.

I include again those efficiency numbers....who is on top?

225 miles Alex actual Tesla range/75 kw = 3 m/kw or 333 Wh/m
283 Alex MME range/88 kw = 3.215 m/kw or 311 Wh/m
250 Alex back of envelope adjusted Tesla range miles/75 kw = 3.33 m/kw or 300 Wh/m
304 Edmunds/88 kw = 3.45 m/kw or 290 Wh/m
 
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timbop

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I’m not sure but when I calculate for KM I get this:

266.3mi= 428.5683km
266.3mi / 4.1mi = 64.95 kW used
428.5683 / 64.95 = 6.598 km per kW.
Right?
yes. I used 1 km=.62 mi as an approximation, and that's about what I got.

average speed is roughly 48mph or 77 kph
 

JoeSmoeFromIDontKnow

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I think the chances of Legal letting Ford advertise 88 kWh available and then making only 84 kWh available is about zero.
I think it's possible that since bjorn's calculations were at freezing cold temperatures, that it is reasonable to have less apparent kWh available for its calculated buffer until considered empty. Remember, 0% is not really empty. I'd imagine that a 0% charge displayed on the dash can be variable depending on what it calculates as potential kW draw over time at a given temperature. Whereas, I'll bet if bjorn had conducted his tests in warmer temperatures, the calculated kWh available would have been be a lot closer to 88kWh.
 

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Ok anyone who thinks there isn’t 88kWhs available in the pack should prove their point by driving a MME until the car stops or they change their position, whichever ever comes first.
If I can get a demo car for more than 5 minutes I will do it just so we can know for sure.
 
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silverelan

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Ok anyone who thinks there isn’t 88kWhs available in the pack should prove their point by driving a MME until the car stops or they change their position, whichever ever comes first.
If I can get a demo car for more than 5 minutes I will do it just so we can know for sure.
I don't know for sure if there is/isn't but I do give Bjørn the benefit of the doubt since he showed his work. 84-85 kWh usable energy available in his test vehicle is plausible. We need more data points and I'd be interested in a confirmation from Ford when he asks them about it.
 

highland58

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As a pessimist I think of it as being an hour closer to my death!
The time is gone, the song is over
Thought I'd something more to say
 

Jimmy2

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Yea, she was really freaking out there; too bad they had to stop in Las Vegas for the night, huh?
 

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