Just got hit with stop safely now

[WyldStallyn]

I just got a message that my car is ready - it was a failure of the 12 V. Unfortunately I might not be able to pick it up until tomorrow.

The car had a contactor stuck closed DTC. There have been a couple this week where the dealership has been able to just reset the DTC. This is likely still a HVBJB issue.

It's good that you can't pick it up today. It's possible that you will still get the HVBJB replaced.

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[Caramel]

Sounds like the dealership is telling me something different than what you are seeing, unless I’m confused or the service advisor I’m talking to is confused.

 

[DevSecOps]

When the HVBJB is bricked the LVB doesn't get maintained by the HVB or charging and therefore it dies.

Normally this is an incorrect diagnosis by a dealer and the problem will resurface in a couple days.

The death of the LVB triggers, literally, hundreds of DTCs that can look overwhelming and the one singular DTC for the contactor can be missed.

 

[Caramel]

I asked them to examine the HVBJB.

 

[mwtechy]

The car had a contactor stuck closed DTC. There have been a couple this week where the dealership has been able to just reset the DTC. This is likely still a HVBJB issue.

It's good that you can't pick it up today. It's possible that you will still get the HVBJB replaced.

12v failing throw a bunch of DTCs which may or may not indicate a problem. I had a long list of DTC failures myself but they wound up replacing the BECM and 12v. Something todo with when decreased voltage getting to each module causes a failure to be reported I would assume.

I was more just curious why there has been so much focus on HVBJB when at least from the forum it appears that 12v occurs just as much.

 

[DevSecOps]

I was more just curious why there has been so much focus on HVBJB when at least from the forum it appears that 12v occurs just as much.

95% of LVB issues are caused by something else. People incorrectly attribute those issues to the LVB. Plain and simple.

If your alternator goes out in an ICE vehicle do you blame the battery? Same with EVs.

 

[mwtechy]

95% of LVB issues are caused by something else. People incorrectly attribute those issues to the LVB. Plain and simple.

If your alternator goes out in an ICE vehicle do you blame the battery? Same with EVs.

Well of course not but the few times I have had a bad alternator usually the battery is still good since it gets swapped out first before you realize the alternator is the problem. Just super weird to me so many issues would be reported around the 12v battery regardless if it actually was a bad battery, BECM, or contactors welding in the HVBJB for the 12v. I don't have gobs of time to look into all this stuff, was just hoping there was some more easy to review info regarding 12v related issues and how many forum members have been impacted by related causes/what those causes were regardless.

 

[KevinS]

Well of course not but the few times I have had a bad alternator usually the battery is still good since it gets swapped out first before you realize the alternator is the problem. Just super weird to me so many issues would be reported around the 12v battery regardless if it actually was a bad battery, BECM, or contactors welding in the HVBJB for the 12v. I don't have gobs of time to look into all this stuff, was just hoping there was some more easy to review info regarding 12v related issues and how many forum members have been impacted by related causes/what those causes were regardless.

Electric cars live by their own set of rules, apparently, and we have to throw away our mental baggage from a lifetime of ICE issues.

 

[Neil4Real]

When the HVBJB is bricked the LVB doesn't get maintained by the HVB or charging and therefore it dies.

Normally this is an incorrect diagnosis by a dealer and the problem will resurface in a couple days.

The death of the LVB triggers, literally, hundreds of DTCs that can look overwhelming and the one singular DTC for the contactor can be missed.

So clearly no changes have been made to the new HVBJB DTCs? They can still easily clear and don't resurface unless you drive the car again and get it to, like in my case? Wow. I'd have thought after the few early fiascos they had, Ford would have sent dealership letters out stating to replace the HVBJB no matter what when the relevant DTC is thrown.

 

[WyldStallyn]

So clearly no changes have been made to the new HVBJB DTCs? They can still easily clear and don't resurface unless you drive the car again and get it to, like in my case? Wow. I'd have thought after the few early fiascos they had, Ford would have sent dealership letters out stating to replace the HVBJB no matter what when the relevant DTC is thrown.

In this and another case it is the original stuck contactor DTC which is being reset.

 

[Matt Bagne]

I asked them to examine the HVBJB.

Sorry if I missed it, but how many miles are on the car?

 

[DevSecOps]

Well of course not but the few times I have had a bad alternator usually the battery is still good since it gets swapped out first before you realize the alternator is the problem.

And in these cases the battery is still good as well. There's always the occasional bad battery, which is rare.

Just super weird to me so many issues would be reported around the 12v battery regardless if it actually was a bad battery, BECM, or contactors welding in the HVBJB for the 12v. I don't have gobs of time to look into all this stuff, was just hoping there was some more easy to review info regarding 12v related issues and how many forum members have been impacted by related causes/what those causes were regardless.

I really don't follow your logic here. You say regardless of the root cause let's blame the LVB. That's like cutting your evse cable and then saying "my on board charge controller is broken".

We analyze these cases everytime we get the opportunity. We look at the DTCs thrown and we can see the root cause.

Unfortunately, dealers are also incorrectly diagnosing critical failures as LVB related. We've seen this happen 3 times this week. Ford corporate had to contact the dealers and correct the situation. @Caramel case is yet another. When they posted the solution from the dealer it was immediately seen here, escalated and someone called the dealer.

As I mentioned earlier, the LVB draining causes a landslide of DTCs which is overwhelming. The LVB in the MME is very small and doesn't last long when it's not maintained. This is why we suggest that if you have a critical fault you turn off the car, roll down the windows and close the doors to preserve the LVB as much as possible.

So the reason no one is talking about LVB issues is because there aren't any that I've seen in months.

 

[mwtechy]

I really don't follow your logic here. You say regardless of the root cause let's blame the LVB. That's like cutting your evse cable and then saying "my on board charge controller is broken".

Well I said 12v "related" issues. In other words if the ford dealer calls it as a LVB issue like they did in mine but then they wind up replacing the BECM, cracking open the HVB to test every cell but not replacing anything else. 12v is all over this forum, would just be nice if someone had more clear definitions of issues. There are free open source problem ticket tools if someone felt the desire to start tracking stuff. It sounds like you have a good grasp of what issues have been reported on this site it might be beneficial to your free time to rope in more people with something like a problem ticket managing tool....granted it's the Internet so you'd never really be able to confirm any of it aside from people saying this or that or the other thing.

 

[WyldStallyn]

Sounds like the dealership is telling me something different than what you are seeing, unless I’m confused or the service advisor I’m talking to is confused.

Any news this morning or are they still saying it is good to go?

 

[Caramel]

Any news this morning or are they still saying it is good to go?

They’re saying they’re going to “do more inspecting.”

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