Range Anxiety or Charging Anxiety?

[Randy E.]

It occurred to me a few months ago that the term "Range Anxiety" really isn't about range at all. Sure, most everyone asks "How far can it go on a single charge?" But the question isn't really about range-per-charge, or having anxiety about a vehicle not being able to go far enough on a single charge. Rather, it's a question that's in search of a solution for Charging Anxiety - "How long does it take to charge?" We all know the answer is simply too long. So we work around it, and that workaround is to find how how far, how long one can drive, and avoid charging again.

The anxiety is really about the charge times. After all, once one learns the range of a single charge, the next question is the true question "How long does it take to charge up?" THAT is the heart of the matter. The "How far on a single charge" is really talking about the effect, not the cause.

If I told you a MME (pick your flavor) could fully charge in 10 minutes, sure, you'd be shocked, but your next question - reflexively - would be "How far on a single charge?" To which I would then answer - "Does it matter? I mean, it takes 10 minutes to charge at any charging station, just like a gas vehicle at a station (longer at Costco). It's like a gas car at this point. Range is no big deal. Oh, and BTW, it gets about 250 miles a charge. But does the questioner care anymore if it's 300 miles or 250 miles per charge if they can just charge up in 10 minutes? Not really. Because the true question is about the cause - the 2, 4 or 6 hours of charging time. Since that's eliminated, range doesn't matter nearly at all. Certainly no more than a gas vehicle.

Do I even have a clue how much my Stinger GT gets per fill? I really don't. Is it 300 miles or 425 miles? I absolutely don't care. I don't care because I fuel up when it needs fuel - again who cares because filling takes 10 minutes at best.

And thus, the EV company that can get to a full charge in 10-15 minutes – virtually anywhere - that's when these companies can sell en mass, and they won't need to go 400 miles a charge or even 300 miles a charge. Rather, car makers could reduce the batteries needed, greatly reducing cost. Fewer cobalt needed, fewer batteries needed across the board is going to be a huge deal moving forward to keep a supply / demand ratio working in favor of price reduction instead of batteries shifting north in cost (another topic, and kinda scary when looking at what predictions are vs reality of raw material availability, but I digress...).

Hyundai/KIA are laser focused on charging speeds. Having an 800v charger on the EV6 (in best conditions of course) that charges 210 miles in as short as 18 minutes... Specs like that start getting the wheels spinning on EV's moving beyond commuting vehicles and being an anywhere, anytime vehicle that requires little or no planning to go places, road trips, sales ventures, on and on...

Range Anxiety? It's not a thing. Charging Anxiety, that's real – and I hope Ford hugely tackles that issue moving forward.

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[TRP]

Brilliant observation

 

[Texas-E]

Agree! Most people don't worry about quick fill-ups impacting the long-term health of their gas vehicle, either. EV owners do, to some degree.

 

[Motomax]

I think range anxiety is all in peoples heads. Honestly, the only people who should be concerned with range are the people that can’t charge everyday (ie some renters) and the 1% that travel more than a couple times a year.

My commute is 90miles every day (which is more than double the average commute in the US) and I’m perfectly satisfied with a 200miles range. Sure if I go on a long trip i might lose a couple hours charging but you’ve save 4-8 hours a year compared to filling up every week anyways so who cares really.

 

[21MachEGT]

My challenge today is partially range/time to charge but also what battery level do i want to charge too. In the past month my car has done mostly long haul trips of >140 miles each way. Given the GT gets slightly lower range per charge, it begs the question of how high do i charge the battery to get there and how long does it take to recharge is definitely a question.

How high as in how full do i want to go vs keeping battery longevity as i don't currently plan to trade the car in and thus want to be as kind to the battery as possible while not making more work or requiring more stops to charge then required.

If i didn't have to think about battery quality and could recharge in almost no time then all of this would go away, then again i'd almost be back to where i am with my '11 gt that gets about 230 miles to a tank of fuel.

 

[SnBGC]

My first BEV had 120 miles of range and I did have Range Anxiety but no Charge Anxiety because I never attempted to drive it very far from home. I took it to Tucson once and never attempted it again in that car.

My current BEV has almost 300 miles of range so no Range Anxiety there. No Charge Anxiety on L2 either. I do have PLENTY of Charge Anxiety related to DCFC though.

 

[AZBill]

The other anxiety is, will the next charger work and will it give me full power. You can end up wasting minutes if a charger will not initiate and also if it starts delivering low power, for example due to the cable chillers not working, then you have a much longer time to charge. Just look at examples of this on Plugshare, it happens too frequently right now.

I have a Hummer EV reservation, and one of the attractions of that is the 800V/350KW charging. GM is advertising 100 miles added in 10 minutes. Yet the F-150 remains at 400V and will be lucky to get 200KW charging, if that much.

 

[AZBill]

My first BEV had 120 miles of range and I did have Range Anxiety but no Charge Anxiety because I never attempted to drive it very far from home. I took it to Tucson once and never attempted it again in that car.

My current BEV has almost 300 miles of range so no Range Anxiety there. No Charge Anxiety on L2 either. I do have PLENTY of Charge Anxiety related to DCFC though.

You must have been typing at the same time as me. ?

 

[alexgorod]

Time is only a part of the problem, another problem - availability and reliability of charging stations. If I new that I can find one on every freeway exit, I wouldn't worry about where and when to stop and needs for planning the trips and what to do if the only available 150 KW on my way is not working.

 

[pt19713]

Charge time doesn't matter if a full charge won't get you from point A to point B if there's a lack of chargers en route. That's range anxiety. There are gray areas in many parts of the country, when the temperatures drop, a BEV may not make it on a direct route due to the lack of an L3 charger, requiring a detour. Charge time is an indirect result due to lack of a viable L3 charging solution.

 

[RockwallRick]

My first road trip charging experience resulted in Charger anxiety! It was at the Gainesville Florida EA. Both of the 350Kw chargers were down and the 150Kw chargers would start up but then shut down right away. I got NO charge there so kept on going and was able to successfully charge at the Lake City EA!

 

[sotek2345]

It occurred to me a few months ago that the term "Range Anxiety" really isn't about range at all. Sure, most everyone asks "How far can it go on a single charge?" But the question isn't really about range-per-charge, or having anxiety about a vehicle not being able to go far enough on a single charge. Rather, it's a question that's in search of a solution for Charging Anxiety - "How long does it take to charge?" We all know the answer is simply too long. So we work around it, and that workaround is to find how how far, how long one can drive, and avoid charging again.

The anxiety is really about the charge times. After all, once one learns the range of a single charge, the next question is the true question "How long does it take to charge up?" THAT is the heart of the matter. The "How far on a single charge" is really talking about the effect, not the cause.

If I told you a MME (pick your flavor) could fully charge in 10 minutes, sure, you'd be shocked, but your next question - reflexively - would be "How far on a single charge?" To which I would then answer - "Does it matter? I mean, it takes 10 minutes to charge at any charging station, just like a gas vehicle at a station (longer at Costco). It's like a gas car at this point. Range is no big deal. Oh, and BTW, it gets about 250 miles a charge. But does the questioner care anymore if it's 300 miles or 250 miles per charge if they can just charge up in 10 minutes? Not really. Because the true question is about the cause - the 2, 4 or 6 hours of charging time. Since that's eliminated, range doesn't matter nearly at all. Certainly no more than a gas vehicle.

Do I even have a clue how much my Stinger GT gets per fill? I really don't. Is it 300 miles or 425 miles? I absolutely don't care. I don't care because I fuel up when it needs fuel - again who cares because filling takes 10 minutes at best.

And thus, the EV company that can get to a full charge in 10-15 minutes – virtually anywhere - that's when these companies can sell en mass, and they won't need to go 400 miles a charge or even 300 miles a charge. Rather, car makers could reduce the batteries needed, greatly reducing cost. Fewer cobalt needed, fewer batteries needed across the board is going to be a huge deal moving forward to keep a supply / demand ratio working in favor of price reduction instead of batteries shifting north in cost (another topic, and kinda scary when looking at what predictions are vs reality of raw material availability, but I digress...).

Hyundai/KIA are laser focused on charging speeds. Having an 800v charger on the EV6 (in best conditions of course) that charges 210 miles in as short as 18 minutes... Specs like that start getting the wheels spinning on EV's moving beyond commuting vehicles and being an anywhere, anytime vehicle that requires little or no planning to go places, road trips, sales ventures, on and on...

Range Anxiety? It's not a thing. Charging Anxiety, that's real – and I hope Ford hugely tackles that issue moving forward.

I agree with everything you have written with 1 caveat. It requires a certain minimum range before the charging time becomes the issue. 250+ miles is easily over that (at least in my opinion, provided a decent charging network), but lower range cars can still absolutely give range anxiety, especially in cold weather. Would you jump at that 10 minute charge time if the cars maximum range was 50 miles? 75 miles? Heck, you can basically already do that with a MME - just only charge for 10 minutes and use what range you get.

We looked at the Mini electric as an alternative to the Mach-e (wife has a ICE mini countryman now we will be trading for the Mach-e) and the range killed it for us. In the winter it would have far to little of a buffer for her commute once you factor in cold weather range reduction.(about 65 miles of range vs a 50 mile commute). One good snow storm (taking more energy to drive through) and she couldn't make it home even starting the day at 100 percent. That is simply not acceptable for us and many other people.

 

[silverelan]

The other anxiety is, will the next charger work and will it give me full power. You can end up wasting minutes if a charger will not initiate and also if it starts delivering low power, for example due to the cable chillers not working, then you have a much longer time to charge. Just look at examples of this on Plugshare, it happens too frequently right now.

I have a Hummer EV reservation, and one of the attractions of that is the 800V/350KW charging. GM is advertising 100 miles added in 10 minutes. Yet the F-150 remains at 400V and will be lucky to get 200KW charging, if that much.

Charging anxiety is what makes me obsess over Plugshare. Finding new stations, checking reliability of current stations, and making internal wishlists of where I want to see future stations. Once 150kW+ stations with 4 working chargers are spaced about 50 miles apart (down from around 75-80), a lot of us will stop fretting about it.

Lucid seems to have it figured out. 500+ miles of EPA range and 300 miles of range back in 20 minutes.

 

[JSeis]

The infrastructure for 800V charging way more costly. My greatest savings are charge at home for .0634 per KWh. Not charging on the road for 5x that.

I see issues with lots of fully charged batteries packing unnecessary potential energy much like cars did with full gas tanks during the “energy crisis”. There was enough energy, just poorly stored-distributed.

 

[Rapid Ed]

Not charging anxiety. ChargER anxiety. Will the charger work? Will it deliver the right charging speeds? Will it be iced out? Will there be a line of cars waiting?

It's an infrastructure problem.

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