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[ElectrikPony]

My system will be composed of a 3-way "active crossover" in the front (tweeter/Mid/mid-bass). The Rear will be a 2-way "active crossover system. This means that each speaker (8 speakers total) will all receive a dedicated channel of amplification.

Tweeters typically don't use more than 10-20 watts RMS. Most multi-channel amps start at 50+ watts RMS. Using an amp that puts out this many watts is a waste of an amp. What I have done instead is using two dedicated class AA 2 channel amps. Really hard to find class AA amps these days. Everyone wants smaller more efficient amps and the trend is now class D amps. My personal opinion is when you're using the upper echelon of speakers it warrants a class A amp. Most folks however will never install speakers that warrant this. So in those scenarios just find a nice little class D amp that fits your budget. (Alpine, JL Audio, Rockford Fosgate all offer products)



Front Tweeter amplifier. Class AA 20x2 RMS Vintage circa 1994. Japanese made with huge caps and the kind of quality you just don't find in todays china manufactured amps.

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[Woeo]

I'd argue that the quality of these speakers just aren't acceptable for a $60k car

I paid ~ 55,500 for my x-plan AWD ER Premium in 2021. Took a 7,500 fed credit & expected to save 8,000 on fuel over 100k miles, making my cost ~ 40,000.

Are the B&O speakers acceptable for a $40k car?

[Of course gas is a bit more now, about 75 cents per gallon for regular, so can expect to save an additional 3,000 dollars on the next 80k miles. YMMV.]

 

[ElectrikPony]

I paid ~ 55,500 for my x-plan AWD ER Premium in 2021. Took a 7,500 fed credit & expected to save 8,000 on fuel over 100k miles, making my cost ~ 40,000.

Are the B&O speakers acceptable for a $40k car?

The sound system is from the European Ford Kuga, which is an escape for the US market. The current # to US dollar is $1.25. This prices the kuga at $29,993.75 .

The real problem here is a sub $30,000 dollar suv b&o sound system was placed in the Mustang Mach-e as a cost saving measure by Ford.

If the Mach-E cost 30k then I would say the quality of the audio system is appropriate given the price point. The sound system is not up to par for a car starting at 50k.

 

[ElectrikPony]

@markboris one thing I am looking into right now is the gauge of wire between the dc to dc converter that goes to the factory AGM 12v. I don’t have the car in front of me, and am wondering what gauge wire it is ? About how long is the run?

I need to see how many amps can flow through that wire since I will be running a 0 gauge wire from the factory AGM battery to the trunks stereo components.

 

[markboris]

@markboris one thing I am looking into right now is the gauge of wire between the dc to dc converter that goes to the factory AGM 12v. I don’t have the car in front of me, and am wondering what gauge wire it is ? About how long is the run?

I need to see how many amps can flow through that wire since I will be running a 0 gauge wire from the factory AGM battery to the trunks stereo components.

I don't have my car either. It's at my parents house in the Bay Area. When I bring them to my home, I use their car as it is much larger and can handle wheel chairs, etc. I will get back to you on that.

Have you thought about adding a second battery in the rear? I've done this a few times and know of some Mach-E members that are doing this. Run that 0 ga wire from the LVB to the a small AGM battery in the rear and run the amps off of that. This is what others are using in the Mach-E:
https://www.crutchfield.com/p_122XP750CK/XS-Power-XP750CK.html?tp=101019.
You can also go with the slightly larger 950 model which is what I used in my Escape.

 

[leeman]

I'd argue that the quality of these speakers just aren't acceptable for a $60k car, but all manufacturers across the board seem to use this as one area to cut costs since most of the time the sound is good enough for most customers, especially when they badge the systems and the components are unseen. The Burmeister MB setup and B&W Volvo might be exceptions, but I'm almost sure the speakers included there aren't up to the actual components in what you would purchase from B&W or Bur. I plan on replacing some of these speakers at some point as all the other cars I've done sound much better with better quality components- they don't have to be expensive ones (I don't think it's just me convincing myself.) As others have said, a quality sub may take care of most of the shortcomings (and easier than replacing the other speakers.)

If we are only younger and really cared about all the stuff honestly I put all my money into my home system where I can actually enjoy music without a bunch of external noises for generally puts a decent sound system in their cars. Unfortunately putting third-party systems in these cars it's gotta be an absolute nightmare.

 

[markboris]

If we are only younger and really cared about all the stuff honestly I put all my money into my home system where I can actually enjoy music without a bunch of external noises for generally puts a decent sound system in their cars. Unfortunately putting third-party systems in these cars it's gotta be an absolute nightmare.

Agree. These days, my money also goes into my two home systems instead of the cars. While I did do a slight upgrade on theMach-E, added a simple 50w x4 amp for door speakers and sub with amp, it's nothing like I did when I was much younger. I now like to watch and see what others do. Reminds me of the old days.

 

[Mach1E]

The sound system is from the European Ford Kuga, which is an escape for the US market. The current # to US dollar is $1.25. This prices the kuga at $29,993.75 .

The real problem here is a sub $30,000 dollar suv b&o sound system was placed in the Mustang Mach-e as a cost saving measure by Ford.

If the Mach-E cost 30k then I would say the quality of the audio system is appropriate given the price point. The sound system is not up to par for a car starting at 50k.

Similar arguments like this pop up all the time in the auto world.

A similar one complains about the interior quality in a Corvette “for a $70k car.”

For me, both the corvette interior and the Mach E stereo are exactly what I expect “for the money.”

Why? Just like the Corvette, the $$ went into the drivetrain, not the stereo or interior.

If we paid a $3500 to $7000 premium for the stereo (like some people do with luxury cars) I for sure would expect more.

But we don’t.

The B&O maybe costs $1k more (not sure since it’s a part of a $4k upgrade to premium). And $1k doesn’t buy you much in terms of a factory stereo upgrade these days.

Like many I added a JL sub to the factory system and am happy.

On my last car (Chevy SS sedan) I added a sub and replaced the factory Bose speakers with Infinity. I was disappointed with the speaker swap. Added some high range clarity, but lost mid bass. At most it was a lateral move.

Stock paper speakers aren’t the best, but they’re cheap and efficient.

 

[ElectrikPony]

I don't have my car either. It's at my parents house in the Bay Area. When I bring them to my home, I use their car as it is much larger and can handle wheel chairs, etc. I will get back to you on that.

Have you thought about adding a second battery in the rear? I've done this a few times and know of some MME members that are doing this. Run that 0 ga wire from the LVB to the a small AGM battery in the rear and run the amps off of that. This is what others are using in the MME:
https://www.crutchfield.com/p_122XP750CK/XS-Power-XP750CK.html?tp=101019.
You can also go with the slightly larger 950 model which is what I used in my Escape.

Thanks Mark,
I was reading over the shop manual and I found this line intriguing .

"The DCDC steps the high-voltage down to a low-voltage (between 12.0 and 15.5 volts, depending on-vehicle needs), providing power to the vehicle low-voltage battery systems. Depending on the vehicle and environmental conditions, the DCDC is capable of outputting up to 160 amps to the 12-volt battery."

That's a lot of amps! Depending on wire length from the DC-to-DC Converter Control Module to the 12v battery it would have to be at-least 4 gauge and under 4 feet to support 160 amps.

If this is a true statement from the shop manual than you can run a 0 gauge wire from the battery terminal on the 12v battery to the back of the car and have 160 amps available on tap. That's incredible!

I however am skeptical that the wire Ford choose is large enough to support 160 amps. I know how they love to cut corners.

I have been "thinking" about an auxiliary battery as you mentioned above, however if the DC-DC Converter module constantly supplies 160 amps and is attached to a huge battery pack that powers the car. What's the point of getting an auxiliary battery at this point?

What I do think I need is a "stiffening Cap" just to ensure that there is a little stored energy at the rear of the car. Most car audio amplifiers do not have regulated power supplies. A voltage drop can lead to a massive power output difference.

 

[ElectrikPony]

Agree. These days, my money also goes into my two home systems instead of the cars. While I did do a slight upgrade on the MME, added a simple 50w x4 amp for door speakers and sub with amp, it's nothing like I did when I was much younger. I now like to watch and see what others do. Reminds me of the old days.

I spend a considerable amount of time traveling in the car. I would say it's where I do most of my listening to music. I'm not trying to build a bass heavy "system". This is all about sound quality and seeing just how close to studio sound we can obtain in a Mach-E with quality components. This build isn't going to be for everyone. The basic principals of the build will help others to choose the components of their choice. Long after the mach-e is gone I will roll-over the stereo system to another car. This is it for me.

 

[markboris]

Thanks Mark,
I was reading over the shop manual and I found this line intriguing .

"The DCDC steps the high-voltage down to a low-voltage (between 12.0 and 15.5 volts, depending on-vehicle needs), providing power to the vehicle low-voltage battery systems. Depending on the vehicle and environmental conditions, the DCDC is capable of outputting up to 160 amps to the 12-volt battery."

That's a lot of amps! Depending on wire length from the DC-to-DC Converter Control Module to the 12v battery it would have to be at-least 4 gauge and under 4 feet to support 160 amps.

If this is a true statement from the shop manual than you can run a 0 gauge wire from the battery terminal on the 12v battery to the back of the car and have 160 amps available on tap. That's incredible!

I however am skeptical that the wire Ford choose is large enough to support 160 amps. I know how they love to cut corners.

I have been "thinking" about an auxiliary battery as you mentioned above, however if the DC-DC Converter module constantly supplies 160 amps and is attached to a huge battery pack that powers the car. What's the point of getting an auxiliary battery at this point?

What I do think I need is a "stiffening Cap" just to ensure that there is a little stored energy at the rear of the car. Most car audio amplifiers do not have regulated power supplies. A voltage drop can lead to a massive power output difference.

This is the main reason I add a second battery in the rear close to the amps is so there is no voltage drop to the amps when they instantly need the extra power. I've never used a stiffening Capacitor to do that.

 

[Sillybibbles]

I agree w others that weight was probably a factor in deciding to put in such a mediocre sound system. My Select had really paultry speakers that weighed less than half of the replacement 6 and 1/4 in rear door speakers I put in.

 

[markboris]

I spend a considerable amount of time traveling in the car. I would say it's where I do most of my listening to music. I'm not trying to build a bass heavy "system". This is all about sound quality and seeing just how close to studio sound we can obtain in a Mach-E with quality components. This build isn't going to be for everyone. The basic principals of the build will help others to choose the components of there choice. I want the best.

When I worked, I was in and out of my casr/trucks at least 10 hours a day so I too spent a lot of time listening to music and built systems from the ground up like you are doing. It was a lot of fun for me as each vehicle was different and a challenge which I like. I stopped in 2020 when I got the GT500 and now just add an amp to the existing speakers for more volume and change out the sub with a higher quality powered one. Easy, way less time and usually just under $1000. Like I said before, I do like seeing what others are doing as it reminds me of my younger days.....

 

[ElectrikPony]

When I worked, I was in and out of my casr/trucks at least 10 hours a day so I too spent a lot of time listening to music and built systems from the ground up like you are doing. It was a lot of fun for me as each vehicle was different and a challenge which I like. I stopped in 2020 when I got the GT500 and now just add an amp to the existing speakers for more volume and change out the sub with a higher quality powered one. Easy, way less time and usually just under $1000. Like I said before, I do like seeing what others are doing as it reminds me of my younger days.....

As a side note there are other factory audio options I have owned in which I wouldn't totally "gut". For instance the Mark Levinson system in the Lexus was incredible. Audi Factory system with Scan Speak Illuminator tweeter (considered to be one the finest tweeters pic below). Unfortunately ford well they just used cheap shit. Cheap paper speakers and an underpowered amp. Sacrifices had to be made to keep the cost of the car what it is. The audio system was one of those.

- Randy

 

[markboris]

It might be like when I go into the showroom and see a car I was not expecting to buy and drive home with it. Not sure if I should keep reading this post. ?

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