ID.4 Charging Curve: Lessons for Mach E Software Team

[BadgerGreg]

Kyle from Out of Spec has done some great reviews of the ID.4 during the last couple of days. After watching his videos and comparing them to videos on Mach E charging, let's hope that Ford's software team is hard at work to address the DCFC charging curve and eliminate all of the annoying bugs causing charging errors (especially with Electrify America's system). VW appears to have nailed it on the charging characteristics.

(4) DC Fast Charging Volkswagen ID.4 From 0-100% - YouTube

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[silverelan]

Mach-E's DC charge speed has so much room for improvement. I'm just not sure Ford is motivated to improve it. I mean, it's already ~5 minutes faster than targeted to 80%.

 

[BadgerGreg]

Mach-E's DC charge speed has so much room for improvement. I'm just not sure Ford is motivated to improve it. I mean, it's already ~5 minutes faster than targeted to 80%.

All I really want are two simple things:

1. No more charging errors (I'd like to plug my car in and leave for 20-30 minutes for a coffee/snack without worrying about tending to a fickle connection).
2. Sustained 120+ kW charging, at least through 60% SOC.

I don't even care so much about the 80% cliff (when road-tripping, I probably won't need to top up en route...I'll wait for destination charging for that). Just give me the two items above and I'll be a happy camper.

 

[SteelMach]

Yes, please! This is OTA Priority #1, IMO. The DCFC charging performance we've received is unacceptable. Error-prone, slow, and falls flat on its face at 80% for no reason.

 

[DBC]

All I really want are two simple things:

1. No more charging errors (I'd like to plug my car in and leave for 20-30 minutes for a coffee/snack without worrying about tending to a fickle connection).
2. Sustained 120+ kW charging, at least through 60% SOC.

First one for sure. However we don't know if the problem is on the EA side or the Ford side. Could be either. Given Ford engineers went around the country and tested these connections, I'm thinking an update on one side or the other after some point. On the other hand, even home charging for the MME isn't nearly as smooth as you'd expect.

As for the second, the MME hits or exceeds the promised charging times. Hard to complain about that.

 

[DBC]

Yes, please! This is OTA Priority #1, IMO. The DCFC charging performance we've received is unacceptable. Error-prone, slow, and falls flat on its face at 80% for no reason.

IMO it should be more like #127. Seriously. I will take the MME on longer trips if I think that would work, but this is hardly a priority. Owners who want to road trip are a small percentage. Much more important to fix a lot of the other issues -- like PAAK or home charging -- which are an everyday issue for the vast majority of owners.

 

[Marcel]

Mach-E's DC charge speed has so much room for improvement. I'm just not sure Ford is motivated to improve it. I mean, it's already ~5 minutes faster than targeted to 80%.

The to 80% time is not that different between the 2 cars...I think the main difference is the curve at low temperatures in wich the ID4 is better but also using energy to do this regardless your charging plans.
In the EU a comparable ID4 to the Mach E is 15% more expensive, I have driven both and prefer the Mach E, driven VW for >30 years!

 

[SteelMach]

The to 80% time is not that different between the 2 cars...I think the main difference is the curve at low temperatures in wich the ID4 is better but also using energy to do this regardless your charging plans.
In the EU a comparable ID4 to the Mach E is 15% more expensive, I have driven both and prefer the Mach E, driven VW for >30 years!

I haven't had the chance to drive an ID.4 yet but I will as soon as I can. I feel like I'm at risk of wanting to buy one if I do, though. The ride on the Mach-E is so disappointing, I suspect the ID.4 will win me over, too late to do anything about it.

 

[silverelan]

The 80% cliff isn't a huge deal, imo. Could it be softened? Sure, but I don't think it's a huge barrier to road trips.

Reducing the time to 80% would have the most meaningful/practical impact, especially since we're about to see next-gen EVs hitting the market with comparable range to the MME but with half the charge time.

 

[BadgerGreg]

The 80% cliff isn't a huge deal, imo. Could it be softened? Sure, but I don't think it's a huge barrier to road trips.

Reducing the time to 80% would have the most meaningful/practical impact, especially since we're about to see next-gen EVs hitting the market with comparable range to the MME but with half the charge time.

I agree; I honestly couldn't care less about charging speed past 80%, because the important part of the charge curve is between 0% and 60%. If on a road trip, I would probably drive to 5%-10% and charge to 50%-60%. Give me reliable, consistent charging speeds in that range and I'll be very happy.

 

[Marcel]

I haven't had the chance to drive an ID.4 yet but I will as soon as I can. I feel like I'm at risk of wanting to buy one if I do, though. The ride on the Mach-E is so disappointing, I suspect the ID.4 will win me over, too late to do anything about it.

A few short observations:

ID4 slower, smoother, Auto-Hold irritating when riding again, dull interior, digital buttons don't work properly when your are not paying attention, no OPD.

Mach E, rear wheel drive feel, possible to slide a bit, good OPD options, nice interior.

 

[SteelMach]

A few short observations:

ID4 slower, smoother, Auto-Hold irritating when riding again, dull interior, digital buttons don't work properly when your are not paying attention, no OPD.

Mach E, rear wheel drive feel, possible to slide a bit, good OPD options, nice interior.

I love the Mach-E except the truckish ride and limited grip. I've heard the ID.4 is the better drivers' car from multiple reviewers. The EU Mach-E has a better suspension than we get in the US.

 

[Marcel]

I agree; I honestly couldn't care less about charging speed past 80%, because the important part of the charge curve is between 0% and 60%. If on a road trip, I would probably drive to 5%-10% and charge to 50%-60%. Give me reliable, consistent charging speeds in that range and I'll be very happy.

Have done 1200km road trips, won't go to 5%, what if chargers are occupied or broken? Always try to have enough left for the next charger...so more likely to do 80-15% stretches. Have been in the broken chargers situation too often.

 

[Marcel]

I love the Mach-E except the truckish ride and limited grip. I've heard the ID.4 is the better drivers' car from multiple reviewers. The EU Mach-E has a better suspension than we get in the US.

Agree, if you want a car that feels like on rails, go with the VW.

 

[SnBGC]

Yes, please! This is OTA Priority #1, IMO. The DCFC charging performance we've received is unacceptable. Error-prone, slow, and falls flat on its face at 80% for no reason.

Not sure if I would say priority #1 but it sounds like a major issue based on the comments I am reading. I hope it gets resolved sometime in the next 18-24 months because it is possible I may need to DCFC eventually. Right now it's a chore to get the charge percentage below 50% so I haven't had the opportunity to try out DCFC and see if it even works. ?

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