For tax credit purposes, is the Mach E an SUV? I'm not so sure...

[veronicablack]

I was lurking on the Tesla subreddit talking about the new EV credit coming back to Tesla. Two users got into a convo about whether the Y is an SUV or not and whether it will fall under the price threshold due to classification. One user mentioned that all that matters is what fueleconomy.gov says and they say the Y is an SUV even if it's marketed as a "CUV".

So off I went to that site and compared the Mach E side by side to the Model Y. Aaaaand apparently the Mach E is considered a "small station wagon" which falls under the car category.

Now, based on these categories, if the Mach E is considered a sedan, wouldn't something like the AWD ER Mach E not be eligible for the credit? I also heard talk of making this retroactively applicable. So is it possible I take delivery of my car in November or December, expecting to get a tax credit come April, and end up getting screwed out of $7500? Despite the fact that I ordered this car months and months ago with the expectation of a tax credit? Or even get pushed into January delivery and then any retroactive worry doesn't even matter and I still get screwed?

I want this car but I don't know if I love it enough to give up an extra $7500.

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[BrimstoneNJ]

In New Jersey, they registered mine as a station wagon. But for tax purposes it would be what the authority involved thinks it is.

 

[alexgorod]

You worry too much...

 

[veronicablack]

You worry too much...

This is definitely true. But this car is already on the outer edge of what I'd like to spend on a vehicle and losing the tax credit would be a hit I wasn't planning on.

 

[alexgorod]

I don't see any reason to consider MME a "sedan". It might be a hatchback, a wagon, an SUV, and AAA even categorizes it as a truck.

It's impossible to predict what politicians will end up doing, but the whole spirit of BBB is to increase incentives for electrical vehicles. So try to concentrate on something that you can control... and read only happy threads

 

[veronicablack]

I don't see any reason to consider MME a "sedan". It might be a hatchback, a wagon, an SUV, and AAA even categorizes it as a truck.

It's impossible to predict what politicians will end up doing, but the whole spirit of BBB is to increase incentives for electrical vehicles. So try to concentrate on something that you can control... and read only happy threads

I mean I'd agree that it's definitely more SUV than sedan to me. Especially when compared to the ICE Mustang. But I was surprised to see the Y and MME classed differently by that site considering they're usually considered direct competitors.

And yea I'm 200% a worrier. I should really ban myself from this site for a while just so I don't fall into more doom and gloom lol.

 

[generaltso]

So is it possible I take delivery of my car in November or December, expecting to get a tax credit come April, and end up getting screwed out of $7500?

No.

 

[BalsaDust]

I was lurking on the Tesla subreddit talking about the new EV credit coming back to Tesla. Two users got into a convo about whether the Y is an SUV or not and whether it will fall under the price threshold due to classification. One user mentioned that all that matters is what fueleconomy.gov says and they say the Y is an SUV even if it's marketed as a "CUV".

So off I went to that site and compared the Mach E side by side to the Model Y. Aaaaand apparently the Mach E is considered a "small station wagon" which falls under the car category.

Now, based on these categories, if the Mach E is considered a sedan, wouldn't something like the AWD ER Mach E not be eligible for the credit? I also heard talk of making this retroactively applicable. So is it possible I take delivery of my car in November or December, expecting to get a tax credit come April, and end up getting screwed out of $7500? Despite the fact that I ordered this car months and months ago with the expectation of a tax credit? Or even get pushed into January delivery and then any retroactive worry doesn't even matter and I still get screwed?

I want this car but I don't know if I love it enough to give up an extra $7500.

The interesting thing is that you linked a news article stating what might happen. If you go to the source, the fueleconomy.gov web site you will see that all the versions of the Mach-E are still eligible up until its phased out but then you still have six months of 50% credit and then an additional six months of 25% credit.
With the Lightning not hitting customers until late Spring/early Summer we should all have our MME's by thenso I am confident and still hoping it will be the full (up to)$7500

Tony

 

[RMoore]

I've not seen an official definition of an SUV but maybe there is one that the IRS uses. That said, Ford refers to it as an SUV and goes so far as to say that it is eligible for the tax credit. I would think they wouldn't want to open themselves up to false advertising claims if they weren't confident that this was the case.

Here are snapshots from Ford's site--the lower one has the statement about the $7,500 credit:

 

[veronicablack]

The interesting thing is that you linked a news article stating what might happen. If you go to the source, the fueleconomy.gov web site you will see that all the versions of the Mach-E are still eligible up until its phased out but then you still have six months of 50% credit and then an additional six months of 25% credit.
With the Lightning not hitting customers until late Spring/early Summer we should all have our MME's by thenso I am confident and still hoping it will be the full (up to)$7500

Tony

That's true for the way the current credit is set up. But the bill congress is going back and forth on right now has some new rules as explained in the electrek link in my post. https://electrek.co/2021/10/28/1250...idens-updated-build-back-better-proposal/amp/

Look at the second to last bullet:

• They introduce price limits on the EVs eligible for the incentives:
  • Sedans under $55,000
  • SUVs under $69,000
  • Pickup trucks under $74,000
  • Vans under $54,000

So depending on if the MME is classed for tax purposes as a sedan or an SUV can make a difference on whether or not my Premium AWD ER MME with an MSRP of $56,640 would be eligible or not.

 

[BalsaDust]

oops again, also the official IRS website does not differentiate between suv, cuv, sedan, or wagon, it even includes light trucks! One link Here shows the form needed and it only asks for make model year and of course the vin number

Tony

 

[veronicablack]

oops again, also the official IRS website does not differentiate between suv, cuv, sedan, or wagon, it even includes light trucks! One link Here shows the form needed and it only asks for make model year and of course the vin number

Tony

Yea this current bill isn't finalized yet and is still up in the air (who knows, we can wake up tomorrow and the EV credit can be gone from the bill). So we're probably not going to find any official sites or forms yet. But if the people in the Tesla subreddit were right (big if?) then it's a bit worrying that the MME is classed as a station wagon and the MY is an SUV.

 

[BalsaDust]

That's true for the way the current credit is set up. But the bill congress is going back and forth on right now has some new rules as explained in the electrek link in my post. https://electrek.co/2021/10/28/1250...idens-updated-build-back-better-proposal/amp/

Look at the second to last bullet:

• They introduce price limits on the EVs eligible for the incentives:
  • Sedans under $55,000
  • SUVs under $69,000
  • Pickup trucks under $74,000
  • Vans under $54,000

So depending on if the MME is classed for tax purposes as a sedan or an SUV can make a difference on whether or not my Premium AWD ER MME with an MSRP of $56,640 would be eligible or not.

Yes I have seen that listed as well as reading through the entire proposal and I for one do not see the Mach -E ever being considered a sedan just because it has four doors. As others have mentioned several sources have it listed as an SUV, so it would in all respects be an SUV as sold by FORD.

Now I fully understand your concerns, this is not an inexpensive vehicle by any means and the more incentives we can take advantage of the better. I for one am not worried about the credit changes if they go into effect, I can always cancel the order and get my deposit back but I want my Mach-E, its looking to be the last vehicle I ever purchase.

Think positive, and hopefully this will all end AFTER we all get our cars,

Tony

 

[capnhowdy21]

i am of the opinion if you need the tax credit to max it affordable, then I wouldn’t buy the car. This is in no way a comment on the likely hood of getting that tax break as much as the way I financially plan. Too many variables and things can happen that can cause you not to get the tax credit, so I personally plan as if I’m not getting it. Again though this is just the way I financially plan, I’d rather be surpsied by something being cheaper then more expensive.

 

[RMoore]

So off I went to that site and compared the Mach E side by side to the Model Y. Aaaaand apparently the Mach E is considered a "small station wagon" which falls under the car category.

I don't think you will have an issue frankly, but curious why you say that a small station wagon is classified as a sedan--I didn't see that anywhere but may have missed it.

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