Ford gives dealers 2 months to accept new rules or stop selling EVs.

[ChasingCoral]

Federal Interstates have a pretty nice program in place (NEVI) that should result in charge stations going in of the next 18 months.... but Ford Dealerships in rural Southwest are few and far between.

Rural anywhere! The real boon here is not the myriad Ford dealers in cities. It's all those small town Ford dealerships. This will really help provide that off-interstate network that is needed. It would be great to see every car company do this in rural areas.

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[dbsb3233]

Rural anywhere! The real boon here is not the myriad Ford dealers in cities. It's all those small town Ford dealerships. This will really help provide that off-interstate network that is needed. It would be great to see every car company do this in rural areas.

If any/many of them sign on for it.

If Ford pays for it, they probably will. But if not, I'm doubtful many will.

 

[dtbaker61]

Rural anywhere! The real boon here is not the myriad Ford dealers in cities. It's all those small town Ford dealerships. This will really help provide that off-interstate network that is needed. It would be great to see every car company do this in rural areas.

agreed that Dealerships are an obvious prime site for DCFC.... they are usually on main streets passing thru rural towns.

But this doesn't help states like NM that have big chunks of area that do not have nearby interstates, or even 'major highways', and tiny towns less than 5000 people that are too small to have a Dealership.

Fortunately there ARE some companies looking at installing DCFC along high-traffic rural roads.... but there are significant challanges with finding 3-phase nearby, buying and installing a dedicated transformer, and physical siting that requires some acquisition or long term lease/easements of property.... but we'll probably see progress there within 24 months

 

[Fixbear]

Dunno. The local dealer here has sold about 30 mach-e's in two years. Have no clue about Lightnings (if any). I also am aware of what they make (absent adm) on the cars. Most dealers are going to have to do both ICE and EV as EV only won't pay the bills imo.

Only the super large dealers will be able to do that. Farley said that they have to select EV, ICE, or truck. EV will be a $900k to 1.2M investment. I think that may be part of the large price increase. I'm certain that all the feedback from this site is part of the decision with the horror stories we have heard about with bad service and ADM's.

 

[dtbaker61]

Only the super large dealers will be able to do that. Farley said that they have to select EV, ICE, or truck. EV will be a $900k to 1.2M investment. I think that may be part of the large price increase. I'm certain that all the feedback from this site is part of the decision with the horror stories we have heard about with bad service and ADM's.

The Dealers most likely would not have to put up their own capital. There are plenty of DCFC installers would will install, own, and operate stations. They'll want to network and probably charge $.35/kWhr for DCFC to pay for the install though, even if they give away the L2 station for Dealer use.

 

[Kamuelaflyer]

Only the super large dealers will be able to do that. Farley said that they have to select EV, ICE, or truck. EV will be a $900k to 1.2M investment. I think that may be part of the large price increase. I'm certain that all the feedback from this site is part of the decision with the horror stories we have heard about with bad service and ADM's.

If they make them be one or the other, Ford is going to be scrambling. Not a single dealer in the state will go for EV. Zero. That'll be repeated in a majority of locations throughout the country.

 

[dtbaker61]

If they make them be one or the other, Ford is going to be scrambling. Not a single dealer in the state will go for EV. Zero. That'll be repeated in a majority of locations throughout the country.

maybe that's what they want.....
Then they can set up NEW dealer/service centers that are EV only

 

[Kamuelaflyer]

maybe that's what they want.....
Then they can set up NEW dealer/service centers that are EV only

Could be. If they do though, they'll strand a lot of people out here without a dealer. Setting up new dealerships is expensive. Even more so when the ev has a minuscule profit for the dealer on it.

Beyond my pay grade.

 

[Fixbear]

There are 15 Ford dealers within 50 miles of my location. One in Albany is the oldest Ford dealer in the nation (Orange Ford) in Albany and until last year was owned by the same family and the 4th generation just sold it to the largest Chevy dealer across the street. They celebrated their 100th anniversary some years ago. The Capital district has 3 large dealers. Two of them sell a lot of trucks. The rest are small to medium in size but provide better service. But during Covid, Ford wasn't shipping to the smaller dealers. Now I'm starting to see Lightening's Lariat at the smaller EV certified ones, but they are not allowed to sell them. Only for demo and order enticement. Is this part of the enticement? Many of the north country dealers do not have access to 3 phase. And there are large areas of the Adirondack Park that don't even have good phone lines. Let alone 3 phase. I guess I don't understand why so many dealers are resistant to making sure that their techs are not trained to the highest level possible. Other than they have to pay for them to go. Online is not the same as a regional training center.

 

[Mike G]

What's next, requiring that they cure cancer too? ?

It's looking more and more like Farley WANTS dealerships to drop out. Which was probably the plan all along... to copy Tesla. Sounding more and more Tesla-obsessed by the day.

I had this discussion with my dealership folks today. Apparently the buy-in is something like a half-mil investment in infrastructure (showroom, shops, etc.) and they are concerned with fixed pricing they will never recoup the money spent. They sold 5 EVs total (due to limited allocations) and I own two of them. And apparently they were told that of the 40 or so reservations they still have on the books from prospective customers...they will be getting zero 2023 Lightning allocations.

So they have a point, Ford can't promise them they will give them more allocations or any stock vehicles if they make the investment, but they can promise that they won't if they don't pony up.

So again, if they do make the investment and then are having to sell EVs at a fixed price. When do they recoup their investment?

I guess they want only "Super-Dealers" to stay in business. You know, the ones where the dealership takes up a couple of city blocks and has 6 drive through service bays.

 

[dbsb3233]

The Dealers most likely would not have to put up their own capital. There are plenty of DCFC installers would will install, own, and operate stations. They'll want to network and probably charge $.35/kWhr for DCFC to pay for the install though, even if they give away the L2 station for Dealer use.

Not so sure about that. Without huge subsidies from somewhere (taxpayers, VW fines, etc), pretty sure DCFC is a big money loser, especially in these early years.

No doubt there's installers that would love to do it if someone cuts them a check for 6-digits though.

 

[MachE Mach]

It’s a fixed price but it’s still set by the dealer. Prices have to be posted by the dealers on the Ford site so that buyers can compare one dealership’s price to another. Once an order is placed online, through the selected dealership, the price cannot change. So no re-negotiating by the dealers at delivery time.

 

[MachE Mach]

Also, I don’t think dealerships are going to be limited to ICE, EV or trucks. They just have to opt in to sell EVs. Probably no additional requirements to continue to sell ICE vehicles.

 

[RedStallion]

I just sold my GT to Carvana, used, 5000 miles, they sold it $10k above MSRP in 4 days, whoever bought that car, could've walked into any dealer and paid that ADM the dealer was asking and the car would cost him less, they not only paid $10k above, they lost $7500 Federal, 750 clean air board resource and 2000 from California, a total of $10750 on top of that $10000 above MSRP, on a used vehicle!

Carmax is doing the exact same thing, my cousin just got a GT for $5k above MSRP, brand new delivery miles only! who you think was fair? that "Stealership" or Carmax/Carvana?

Carvana uses algorithm buying and selling cars. Sometimes they make profit sometimes they incur losses. It works on average and they removed human appraisal and everything associated with it. Here is an interesting article about Carvana paying for 7yo car more than the price of new: https://www.theverge.com/22923871/carvana-pandemic-used-car-prices-sold-online-chip-shortage

 

[Kamuelaflyer]

Also, I don’t think dealerships are going to be limited to ICE, EV or trucks. They just have to opt in to sell EVs. Probably no additional requirements to continue to sell ICE vehicles.

Hopefully. A dealers no adm profit on a Mach-e won’t pay the bills.

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