For EVs to become “No-Brainers” over ICE.

[Jferrari427]

EVs need a slam dunk reason for ICE buyers to convert over. IMO 3 things need to happen for EVs to become no-brainers over ICE vehicles for mass adoption.

1. 0-90% SOC in under 10 min on public charging networks.

2. Much greater range than ICE vehicles…think 400/500+ miles on a full charge.

3. Lower price of entry.

Competition is a great thing, I could see this happening in 5 years (maybe).

what are your thoughts?

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[Pioneer74]

 

[hybrid2bev]

Replace #2 with chargers every 50 miles on the interstates and I’d agree. Don’t need more than 300 miles of range if charging is plentiful.

On our long road trips we’ve found that we have max 250 mile bladders.

 

[Jferrari427]

 

[Jferrari427]

Valid point.

 

[ChasingCoral]

EVs need a slam dunk reason for ICE buyers to convert over. IMO 3 things need to happen for EVs to become no-brainers over ICE vehicles for mass adoption.

1. 0-90% SOC in under 10 min on public charging networks.

Not necessary. In real life it's hard to get out of a gas station in under 10 minutes. 15-20 is more normal when on road trips.

2. Much greater range than ICE vehicles…think 400/500+ miles on a full charge.

I don't have a 400/500 mile bladder. Besides, driving more than a few hours results in road-weariness and reduced attention. The issue isn't more range than ICE cars. The issue is having enough chargers to not worry about finding one. The infrastructure law is bringing $5B to the table to solve this issue.

3. Lower price of entry.

No, we need better communication. So what if the cost on the sticker is a bit higher? The cost of ownership is the monthly payment + fuel + maintenance + insurance (a lot higher sticker cost is a problem though). There is already a comparable cost of ownership and dealers need to be pushing home the fact that most EVs already have a lower cost of ownership when compared to their ICE equivalents.

 

[GreaseMonkey]

Personally, sweet spot is the following:

1. Range: 300 mile city & summer; 275 mile city & winter and highway & summer; 250 highway & winter
2. Charge speed: ~30 min DCFC 10-90% + no adverse impact with consistent DCFC
3. Cost: parity with ICE.

When cost improves, better battery tech. When battery tech improves, smaller battery, not longer range. Less weight equals more fun. My MME has same 0-60 than a C5 corvette I had 21 years ago, but nowhere near the fun. It’s just too heavy (and I am too, but we won’t talk about that).

 

[Mach1E]

EVs need a slam dunk reason for ICE buyers to convert over. IMO 3 things need to happen for EVs to become no-brainers over ICE vehicles for mass adoption.

1. 0-90% SOC in under 10 min on public charging networks.

2. Much greater range than ICE vehicles…think 400/500+ miles on a full charge.

3. Lower price of entry.

Competition is a great thing, I could see this happening in 5 years (maybe).

what are your thoughts?

All are overkill, but yes it’s about cost, range and charging.

Unfortunately these are the same issues we had with electric cars……. 100 years ago.

Fun fact- there was a fleet of electric taxis running in NYC in the 1920s.

All the “issues“ could be solved by better battery tech. But we have been chasing that miracle pill for over 100 years. Is it 5 years away? Doubtful.

In reality, the ACTUAL solution was found a while ago- electric car with a backup generator. The Chevy Volt or BMW i8.

But we abandoned that solution due to no profit and low sales.

 

[Gullwingdmc]

3. Lower price of entry.

I’ll give you number 3, the other two are like arguing against cars because the horse knows it’s way home.

 

[Mach1E]

I’ll give you number 3, the other two are like arguing against cars because the horse knows it’s way home.

Not sure why people try to make the cars vs horses analogy…….. more like VHS vs Betamax or Blu-ray vs HDDVD.

Electric have just as many cons as pros when comparing to ICE. Range, cost and charging (as being discussed here) the big ones.

 

[AKgrampy]

Fast charging is fine but to me it is the inability for many to charge at home. 15 months in and zero DCFC for myself. I do not care how fast charging is there is an issue when some can charge at home for 15 cents per kWh and those who have to DCFC will be charged 35 - 60 cents. Also as a cold weather state I hope gas is always an option (quite sure it will for my lifetime) even though I did drive my GT all winter.

 

[Gullwingdmc]

Not sure why people try to make the cars vs horses analogy…….. more like VHS vs Betamax or Blu-ray vs HDDVD.

Electric have just as many cons as pros when comparing to ICE. Range, cost and charging (as being discussed here) the big ones.

My point is, with every big industry shift, there are going to be changes people have to get used to. You shouldn’t try to one to one compare the new to the old.

For me, having an EV has been a huge timesaver. In the 2 years and 30+ thousand miles do you know how much time I have spent charging my car? 0 minutes.

 

[dmastro]

All you really need for mass adoption is for EVs to perform similarly to ICE... time to charge with a sufficient number of convenient chargers, similar range, similar price. They don’t need to be superior.

 

[DevSecOps]

I agree 100% with the OPs assessment for some people to adopt EVs.

The problem with this topic is that everyone here has a different opinion and different requirement for a vehicle. They forget that anywhere from 1%-99% of the potential purchasers agree/disagree with them.

I personally, would never spend 20 minutes at a gas station. I would much rather drive, not stop and get to my destination as quick as possible. I've owned multiple EVs (and yes, I do complain about #s 1-3) ... So, I think the list is accurate for some amount of people. I also think that people have blinders on if they think it doesn't matter at all. I really don't understand the "EVs are perfect as they are" mentality.

Where I think range matters the most for people is when they have regular commutes near the EPA range. This is where an ICE vehicle makes it easy and an EV can take an extra hour each way. There's significant time loss in an EV when you have this situation.

 

[Mach1E]

My point is, with every big industry shift, there are going to be changes people have to get used to. You shouldn’t try to one to one compare the new to the old.

For me, having an EV has been a huge timesaver. In the 2 years and 30+ thousand miles do you know how much time I have spent charging my car? 0 minutes.

This shift is quite different though.

For one, these technologies have co-existed for over 100 years.

And despite the government forced intervention, it’s not a 100% shift (or at least it wouldn’t be unless forced).

Gas, diesel, hybrid and BEV are likely to co-exist for many years to come. And for good reason, there isn’t a “no brainer” among them.

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