Help me decide: Mach-E or Model Y

[timbop]

I would love to hear from people who have had no major issues with their MME. It seems most of the people posting have had issues.

There's an old thread for "happy people who've had no problems" with plenty of such posts. I for one have had my car for 10 months and put 9000 miles on it without issue. I gave up on PaaK very early and don't really feel it is very important. I've never had low voltage battery issues or had problems on the road other than once or twice having the driving directions on the instrument panel stop updating.

As for OTA, yes Ford is where Tesla was 10 years ago (and thus behind in that aspect). It doesn't really bother me; I know they'll straighten it out just like Tesla did. In general Tesla has no "magic bullets"; their cars are more efficient because they are lighter and more aerodynamic. It has nothing to do with "super" inverters or software, particularly since every head-to-head test against the Model Y has the Mach E going FURTHER.

I for one was intent on getting a Model 3 since it was announced, but liked what the Mach E offered as well. After watching Musk's selfish, dangerous, and disingenuous behavior over the last year and a half there is no way in hell I will ever buy a Tesla. I also spent an hour on a Tesla forum and realized that I had no interest in becoming a personality cult member.

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[ARK]

A few things that are advantages that you did not list.

Tesla actually does frequent OTA updates. Ford says they will do this but may not actually follow through on it.

Heat pump, this is an advantage in locations where winter is mild such as California. It will provide a lower reduction in range due to cabin heat in the cold months. It may not be a big advantage in Michigan, but that's not where I live.

Charge time on level 3. Charge time is lower because the batteries have better thermal management. They can keep the charge wattage higher for longer periods of time. The Mache drives high wattage but not for very long.

I know you mentioned performance but it is actually more profound than that. Performance is considerably better on the Y performance version. This is because the Tesla has better thermal management of the battery.

The batteries have better thermal management. This may lead to better longevity; this is not known at this time, but it is a logical conclusion.

A pro for the Mach-e is Magneride suspension, but it's only available on the highest trim making it unreachable for many.

You are correct about the OTA updates, so far at least.

The addition of a heat pump would be a net loss for many (most?) people, especially in California, because it does not replace the resistive heater. It’s extra engineering on the car that adds cost. I think BMW used to charge as little as $150 for the heat pump option on the i3 (before it used to be a standard feature).

If energy costs around $0.15 per kWh, you are looking at having to save 1,000 kWh in energy to break even assuming it adds just $150 to the price of a MY. At least in Southern California, I can tell you, it’s not happening. Or at least, the breakeven point would come sometime around the opening ceremony of the 2028 Los Angeles Olympics.

You are also correct that L3 charging time is better on Tesla, however, if we are talking about California, then I think it’s also fair to point out that CCS coverage has matched (and eclipsed?) supercharger coverage at this point in this state, and if you take any random holiday weekend, you are much more likely to encounter a wait at a Tesla Supercharger in California versus a Electrify America CCS charger. Faster charging is certainly better, but if you have to wait in a longer line before you reach the charger and you spend more overall downtime as a result, is it really still an advantage?

That thermal management thing is overblown. How much time is really spent at 100% throttle? On a vehicle like this, in real usage, I bet the vast majority of owners could count that in seconds, not minutes let alone hours, over the course of their years of ownership. On the other hand, as far as the performance discussion goes, how it rides is something anyone can appreciate, and I think reviewers and owners as a group have been more critical of the MY’s ride (too harsh for small SUV).

 

[RockwallRick]

There's an old thread for "happy people who've had no problems" with plenty of such posts. I for one have had my car for 10 months and put 9000 miles on it without issue. I gave up on PaaK very early and don't really feel it is very important. I've never had low voltage battery issues or had problems on the road other than once or twice having the driving directions on the instrument panel stop updating.

As for OTA, yes Ford is where Tesla was 10 years ago (and thus behind in that aspect). It doesn't really bother me; I know they'll straighten it out just like Tesla did. In general Tesla has no "magic bullets"; their cars are more efficient because they are lighter and more aerodynamic. It has nothing to do with "super" inverters or software, particularly since every head-to-head test against the Model Y has the Mach E going FURTHER.

I for one was intent on getting a Model 3 since it was announced, but liked what the Mach E offered as well. After watching Musk's selfish, dangerous, and disingenuous behavior over the last year and a half there is no way in hell I will ever buy a Tesla. I also spent an hour on a Tesla forum and realized that I had no interest in becoming a personality cult member.

My Wife gave up on PAAK after trying it for less than a week! Not an issue for me since I never intended to use my phone for that purpose. I was determined to buy a EV this time after 7 years with the CMax hybrid. On the flip side I am still not ready to give up my Ram either even though my Wife has been trying for years for me to get rid of it!! Truck comes in handy for hauling our electric bikes!
Even with the software quirks and recalls no regrets about choosing the MME over the MY!!

 

[Whatstreet]

You are correct about the OTA updates, so far at least.

The addition of a heat pump would be a net loss for many (most?) people, especially in California, because it does not replace the resistive heater. It’s extra engineering on the car that adds cost. I think BMW used to charge as little as $150 for the heat pump option on the i3 (before it used to be a standard feature).

The heat pump provides more BTU's per watt. Ford didn't put it in because they wanted to reduce cost. The heat pump will improve range when in temperatures above freezing but still cold enough that cabin heat will be used. That happens everywhere part of the year and some places all winter. The result is better range in cold weather.

If energy costs around $0.15 per kWh, you are looking at having to save 1,000 kWh in energy to break even assuming it adds just $150 to the price of a MY. At least in Southern California, I can tell you, it’s not happening. Or at least, the breakeven point would come sometime around the opening ceremony of the 2028 Los Angeles Olympics.

Not about cost, it's about comfort while maintaining driving range. You get what you pay for.

You are also correct that L3 charging time is better on Tesla, however, if we are talking about California, then I think it’s also fair to point out that CCS coverage has matched (and eclipsed?) supercharger coverage at this point in this state, and if you take any random holiday weekend, you are much more likely to encounter a wait at a Tesla Supercharger in California versus a Electrify America CCS charger. Faster charging is certainly better, but if you have to wait in a longer line before you reach the charger and you spend more overall downtime as a result, is it really still an advantage?

Charge time is charge time not charger availability, and yes the Tesla charges faster.

As to charger availability, a Tesla can be charged at CCS chargers in some parts of the world and will be available to Tesla's in north America after they open up the Supercharger network to other EV mfg cars.

That thermal management thing is overblown. How much time is really spent at 100% throttle? On a vehicle like this, in real usage, I bet the vast majority of owners could count that in seconds, not minutes let alone hours, over the course of their years of ownership. On the other hand, as far as the performance discussion goes, how it rides is something anyone can appreciate, and I think reviewers and owners as a group have been more critical of the MY’s ride (too harsh for small SUV).

The E battery heats up four time faster than the Y battery. This limits performance of acceleration and charge time. Heat permanently degrades the chemistry of the battery and performance which may cause decreased mean time to failure.

 

[Falcon73]

I am looking at selling our MYLR now. My MME is due for production in a month.

For me the Tesla has not lived up to my expectations, but absent the seat/backpain problem I could have probably got used to it.

I've mentioned most of my concerns above, so I won't go over those again.

The lack of a CCS charger is a problem I can see many having locally but an adapter is supposedly coming soon.

I had thought the supercharger network was going to be an advantage, but it's not, at least for my driving. The wait to charge is so long in most cases that I don't usually bother to try. And charging at home is a pain having to use an adapter or the very slow included L1 charger.

Also Superchargers cost more now than the other DCFCs I like to use such as EVGo.

A funny short is that yesterday at Mission Viejo Mall the SCs had the usual line even though the Tesla EVGo charger was available on the same parking lot area. So, I used that one as it cost me less in money and time. The Tesla's over to the right looked like lemmings, just following the same tired path.

At about 48kW Max the EVGo adapter was still plenty fast. I took about 50 minutes to eat lunch in the mall and I wasn't rushed. Also the EVGo Tesla cable is much longer than the Supercharger ones. The parking space was larger as well, so it was a better experience.

I won't argue that Tesla has the advantage on long distance trips as re Superchargers being available but in South Orange County they don't. If Tesla's get the CCS adapters we will likely see this level out, however.

 

[ARK]

The heat pump provides more BTU's per watt. Ford didn't put it in because they wanted to reduce cost. The heat pump will improve range when in temperatures above freezing but still cold enough that cabin heat will be used. That happens everywhere part of the year and some places all winter. The result is better range in cold weather.


Not about cost, it's about comfort while maintaining driving range. You get what you pay for.


Charge time is charge time not charger availability, and yes the Tesla charges faster.

As to charger availability, a Tesla can be charged at CCS chargers in some parts of the world and will be available to Tesla's in north America after they open up the Supercharger network to other EV mfg cars.



The E battery heats up four time faster than the Y battery. This limits performance of acceleration and charge time. Heat permanently degrades the chemistry of the battery and performance which may cause decreased mean time to failure.

My point about the heat pump in California is the more efficient heating isn’t worth the extra cost (and weight?) that gets cooked into the vehicle. Someone on this forum started a thread a while back saying they lived near Seattle and had a long commute. That’s the sweet spot to get the most out of a heat pump - long drive with cold but not freezing weather for a big part of the year. A normal or short commute in California isn’t it.

Charging time should be considered with charger availability and waiting time to use the charger. In parts of the country, Tesla still has superior coverage. Not so in California. It’s not 2016 forever as far as CCS coverage goes.

Ideally, you’d get the fastest charging time with no wait to charge. But if I had to pick between the two, I’d rather get to the charger first and let it take a longer time to charge while I go eat or stretch my legs or whatever, as opposed to sit in a 20 minute line in my car before reaching the charger before I can leave the vehicle to do whatever, which just sounds miserable to be honest.

 

[Jimrpa]

I would love to hear from people who have had no major issues with their MME. It seems most of the people posting have had issues.

Please define “major issue”? Remember, you’re seeing a subset of Mustang Mach E owners here, and likely the most demanding. Would I recommend a Mustang Mach E for my neighbors in their 70s who aren’t very technically literate? Nah, otherwise, of course I would!

 

[Jimrpa]

I would strongly encourage anyone who can’t decide between a Tesla and a Mustang Mach E to get a Tesla. That way, there will be more Mustang Mach Es for people who really want them ?

 

[Falcon73]

One thing I forgot to add is that Tesla still hasn't rolled out a single update to our MYLR. I've heard it takes longer at first but it's 5+ weeks now... And I can do nothing to accelerate the process.

 

[Whatstreet]

I would strongly encourage anyone who can’t decide between a Tesla and a Mustang Mach E to get a Tesla. That way, there will be more Mustang Mach Es for people who really want them ?

The best choice really depends on the trim level. If you are interested in RWD with either battery the E is the winner at current prices against any mfg. Not just Tesla.

 

[Falcon73]

Ideally, you’d get the fastest charging time with no wait to charge. But if I had to pick between the two, I’d rather get to the charger first and let it take a longer time to charge while I go eat or stretch my legs or whatever, as opposed to sit in a 20 minute line in my car before reaching the charger before I can leave the vehicle to do whatever, which just sounds miserable to be honest.

Awesome post! Two ??

Like my post above I was in the mall vs sitting in my Tesla waiting for a charger. Slower won the race.

 

[Whatstreet]

Awesome post! Two ??

Like my post above I was in the mall vs sitting in my Tesla waiting for a charger. Slower won the race.

Charger availability will vary with location, time of day and other factors such as increased number of CCS charged cars. CCS charges may not always be more available.

A shortage of chargers of any kind is on the horizon. I have invested in EVGO for that reason. It has already made large gains. You can too. Do your own due diligence.

 

[fightinag]

I'm on 8 months and still not built .
My son got his new Tesla from order to delivery in 6 weeks

 

[Bobcat17]

I'm on 8 months and still not built .
My son got his new Tesla from order to delivery in 6 weeks

Good things are worth waiting for. You are going to love it.

 

[voxel]

I am looking at selling our MYLR now. My MME is due for production in a month.

For me the Tesla has not lived up to my expectations, but absent the seat/backpain problem I could have probably got used to it.

If you are looking for comfort, I honestly think you picked the worst two.

I'm buying a RAV4 Prime for road trips (keeping the Mach-E though) and will trade that in for a Ioniq 5 because I like what I'm hearing about the ride comfort without the major compromises of the ID.4

The MME is a BLAST to drive but the suspension is firm and the seat is thin and I developed butt/back pain driving longer than 20 mins and I never had back pain in my life. Somewhat fixed using a cushion recommended by somebody on FB. The Model Y has harsh suspension too but honestly it's about the same as the MME.

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