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Nak

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Probably; like Tesla, Audi, etc the brake pedal will likely engage the regenerative system up to some limit after which the friction brakes will join. There would be little reason to do it otherwise.
Actually Tesla does not have brake by wire. When you push on the brake pedal you are mechanically actuating the brake master cylinder. When you take your foot off the accelerator pedal regen does begin, but pressing on the brake pedal does not activate regen. At least it is that way with the 3 and the Y, I have no idea about the S and the X.
 

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You're clearly on the wrong Forum 🤣
Actually not. The conversation started with me wondering if Ford would implement the same strategy with the Mach-e.
 

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Actually Tesla does not have brake by wire. When you push on the brake pedal you are mechanically actuating the brake master cylinder. When you take your foot off the accelerator pedal regen does begin, but pressing on the brake pedal does not activate regen. At least it is that way with the 3 and the Y, I have no idea about the S and the X.
interesting; I guess I was fooled by the “foot off the accelerator” trigger, because you still see the regenerative level displayed when pressing the

It’s a little odd, they certainly could trigger regen using the pedal, the sensor is there to display the brake lights and is passed along the canbus.

Thanks for the info!
 

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It takes way more energie to get out of your driveway than regen brake can get at your first stop. It is impossible to start from somewhere and have more battery energie at your arrival. (Except if you start on a hill and let the car go...)
Duh. You mean there are no perpetual motion machines?

We’ll see how the regen works at full charge in the MME.

Plenty of contrary opinions with Tesla at 100% charge. Here’s one:
https://in.mashable.com/tech/3008/elon-musk-tells-us-why-we-shouldnt-charge-our-tesla-battery-to-100
 

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Actually Tesla does not have brake by wire. When you push on the brake pedal you are mechanically actuating the brake master cylinder. When you take your foot off the accelerator pedal regen does begin, but pressing on the brake pedal does not activate regen. At least it is that way with the 3 and the Y, I have no idea about the S and the X.
Interesting. And weird. No wonder driving a Tesla felt so different to me. I think you should prepare for a very different driving experience compared to what you are used to. With luck, maybe the Mach E will have the best of both worlds. It will be interesting to read the comments when people start getting their cars.

The Mach e brake pedal should be just like many other EVs in that it has a special spring that replicates the resistance of a hydraulic system but really just measures travel for the computer to increase/decrease regen. There is a point in the travel where a cam is engaged and the hydraulic system begins to apply the friction brakes.

Dragging the brakes at speed seems like a waste for no real benefit. The disk brakes don't need to be cleaned in rainy conditions. ICE vehicles dont have any issues in the rain even if they cruise at highway speeds for several hours at a time. Maybe the Tesla braking system is different.....wouldn't surprise me.

If they wanted to clean the brake disks periodically then they can just apply the friction brakes for the last 5 km before coming to a full stop. The energy required to keep the field windings energized at that slow of an RPM is offset by regen gain at that speed anyway so why not use the friction brakes to complete the stop? Brake pad wear under those conditions is basically non existent so it seems like the most practical solution to me.

That being said....it is cool to see and hear about "out of the box" thinking. Usually something useful is learned by blazing a new path. Both for Ford and others.
 

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interesting; I guess I was fooled by the “foot off the accelerator” trigger, because you still see the regenerative level displayed when pressing the

It’s a little odd, they certainly could trigger regen using the pedal, the sensor is there to display the brake lights and is passed along the canbus.

Thanks for the info!
I read that they did it this way for brake feel. Also, the iBosch brake controller/master cylinder is probably cheaper than a true drive-by-wire brake controller like the Audi E-tron uses. According to this story, Audi , the Audi was the first EV to incorporate brake-by-wire. I think the Taycan uses it too? But I'm not sure about that. Researching this I found something interesting: if you brake enough to activate ABS, regen is killed. Here's something I haven't tried: switch to low regen and see if pressing the brake pedal increases regen? (It doesn't for sure with standard regen...) The iBosch can blend regen with friction brakes, so maybe it does? I'll try that tomorrow. Speaking of the iBosch, do we know yet what brake controller the Mach-e uses?
 

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Dragging the brakes at speed seems like a waste for no real benefit. The disk brakes don't need to be cleaned in rainy conditions. ICE vehicles dont have any issues in the rain even if they cruise at highway speeds for several hours at a time.
Having grown up in the PNW, I'm pretty familiar with driving in the rain, LOL. (I lived in Phoenix for three years too, so I know about monsoon season as well. :D )

I have had to "wipe" my brakes on a number of occasions in previous vehicles. Some are worse than others, but when I notice my brakes are less effective than normal during heavy rain I release and re-apply the brakes. (When you drive through standing water the odds that you need to wipe your brakes approaches 100%.) This always restores full braking capability. This situation is different than hydroplaning, but many drivers confuse wet brakes for hydroplaning. Both situations require different reactions to correct. I've never had to wipe the brakes in a Tesla, so the system seems to work well. (Which is why I'm hoping Ford implements it as well.)

it's very possible, even likely, that many people don't experience the need to wipe their brakes because they don't end up with cause to apply the brakes before centrifugal force cleans the rotor. To verify this, apply your brakes after driving through standing water; they won't be very effective. If you apply light brake pressure, release and then reapply the brakes you'll find your brakes are effective again. Folks that ride bikes become very familiar with this.
 

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It is NOT about peak power but about average...
3E6A2D4C-DA64-4E54-B819-A0F22451E86B.png


C4A3A985-C974-4169-A6EC-426A88EEB63C.jpeg
That graph really bothered me, It just didn't make sense. So I did a little research. Look closely at Audi's battery warranty. Just about every other manufacturer warranties the battery for the same time and mileage, but they also include a performance warranty. The warranty for most everyone else covers the battery if it drops below 70% capacity. The Audi warranty makes no such claim. If the battery fails completely, you get a new one. If it drops to 25% capacity, too bad so sad. IMHO, that's precisely why they can implement a charging curve like that; they aren't on the hook financially when that charge curve massively degrades your battery. There is a reason everyone else tapers the charge, and it's a good reason.
 

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So I did a little research. Look closely at Audi's battery warranty. Just about every other manufacturer warranties the battery for the same time and mileage, but they also include a performance warranty. The warranty for most everyone else covers the battery if it drops below 70% capacity. The Audi warranty makes no such claim.
Where did you find Audi's HV battery warranty details? I've been looking but can't find it. But this guy at Roadshow claims it covers at least 70% capacity for 8 years, 100,000 miles.

Hyundai tapers charge, but does not indicate a performance threshold in its warranty as far as I can tell.

They just state that when there is a failure warranting repair at their cost, they will install replacement parts that provide at least 70% of the vehicle's original capacity. That's not a very strong warranty.

It might be incorrectly worded... I see some grammatical issues in the same paragraph or just above it.
 

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That graph really bothered me, It just didn't make sense. So I did a little research. Look closely at Audi's battery warranty. Just about every other manufacturer warranties the battery for the same time and mileage, but they also include a performance warranty. The warranty for most everyone else covers the battery if it drops below 70% capacity. The Audi warranty makes no such claim. If the battery fails completely, you get a new one. If it drops to 25% capacity, too bad so sad. IMHO, that's precisely why they can implement a charging curve like that; they aren't on the hook financially when that charge curve massively degrades your battery. There is a reason everyone else tapers the charge, and it's a good reason.
I Just picked the Audi graph because it is a big difference, but there are more who have a more of less lineair graph until 80%, the BMW I3, Mercedes EQC, Mini electrick. A court in the EU would not defend Audi if the battery was down to 50% and they would not replace your battery under warranty.
Tesla starts very high (they advertise with these values) then starts tapering immediatly, so what i claim is that it's average that you want to know instead of peak power.
 
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Nak

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Here's an article, scroll about halfway down:
Audi review

Other than that, Audi's website doesn't mention a performance warranty anywhere. I can't find the fine print, so I'm trusting that article. But if Audi doesn't explicitly give a percentage of capacity left, then the only thing they're covering is that the battery works. That gybes with the charge curve, because that charge curve is going to degrade your battery. It's very nice for owners who sell their car in two years, but the next owner is going to be in for a rude awakening.
 

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so what i claim is that it's average that you want to know instead of peak power.
You're absolutely correct. Higher average charge power should result in shorter charge times. IMHO, It will also be more expensive because charging will be less efficient due to more waste heat being produced. Time will tell how well the batteries hold up, perhaps they have a revolutionary battery chemistry. Myself, I wouldn't buy one. But that's just me.
 

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Long story, but the main message is correct. I have owned a Zoë, and now 3 years a e-Golf and have been on 1200km trips with it. (Range 100-140km for the Zoë, range 150-200km for the Golf)
With a MME range of 300km your safe driving time is up when you need to charge ;)
 

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Actually Tesla does not have brake by wire. When you push on the brake pedal you are mechanically actuating the brake master cylinder. When you take your foot off the accelerator pedal regen does begin, but pressing on the brake pedal does not activate regen. At least it is that way with the 3 and the Y, I have no idea about the S and the X.
Hmmm... I have never looked at Tesla's braking strategy, now I am curious. This would be an extremely low tech system, and it would surprise me if Tesla's regen strategy was so poor.
 



 









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