buzznwood

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They must have been driving like turtles, my recent trip suggests they need to cut that range in half for highway driving.
At a guess they would be sticking to the speed limits which in Norway are very low. While I think it is good that the mach-e managed to achieve a good result and a long range I am starting to see these range tests informative but also all rather useless .

If you live in an apartment and have limited charging options knowing maximum range is useful as you can see what works for you and how often you would need to make a trip to a charge station. For most the real time that the maximum range comes into play is when you decied to go on a road trip and that is where you also need to take charging into account not just the range, if a manufacture makes a gas guzzler ICE they can offset it by adding a larger fuel tank so while using a large battery pack helps do the same unlike the ICE that extra fill up time is significant especially on the mach-e with the abysmal DCFC charge curve above 80%.

Ford really needs to work on either improving over all efficiency (probably only a small amount that can be done) or the DCFC charging curve (needs serious improvement IMO). As based on the the test results some of the competition vehicles are not that far behind on range despite using a much smaller battery that can be charged up to maximum range and have the driver back on the road much faster. As more people transition over to BEVS this is an area where Ford could easily start to lag behind the competition.
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At a guess they would be sticking to the speed limits which in Norway are very low. While I think it is good that the mach-e managed to achieve a good result and a long range I am starting to see these range tests informative but also all rather useless .

If you live in an apartment and have limited charging options knowing maximum range is useful as you can see what works for you and how often you would need to make a trip to a charge station. For most the real time that the maximum range comes into play is when you decied to go on a road trip and that is where you also need to take charging into account not just the range, if a manufacture makes a gas guzzler ICE they can offset it by adding a larger fuel tank so while using a large battery pack helps do the same unlike the ICE that extra fill up time is significant especially on the mach-e with the abysmal DCFC charge curve above 80%.

Ford really needs to work on either improving over all efficiency (probably only a small amount that can be done) or the DCFC charging curve (needs serious improvement IMO). As based on the the test results some of the competition vehicles are not that far behind on range despite using a much smaller battery that can be charged up to maximum range and have the driver back on the road much faster. As more people transition over to BEVS this is an area where Ford could easily start to lag behind the competition.
The News article from NAF is stating that the Tesla Model 3 LR 2021 was the winner, but in the list it's showing the 2020 version, so it can seem like the MME LR won the range test.. I sent a notification on their website about it, hope they fix.

Yup, you are right about max range in real life. I bought the standard range because it will get me to my home town from Oslo even on a cold winter day, and that was my minimum requirement when looking for an EV. I bought the MME because it gives me that + because of reviews & price. I also like that Ford engineered it as an EV from scratch.

BTW: Tesla Model 3 is a small car in comparison, not an SUV / family car like MME is.
 
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RonTCat

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I would expect most of it has to do with cost and weight. The efficiency of electrical motors is high, 95%+. In fact the government research labs tests various hybrid and EV drive systems and the efficiency of power coming out of the battery and from the motor is around 95%+ in the best designs.

Improving aerodynamics and weight reduction will result in better improvements than chasing 2 or 3 percent system gains. Of course the electric motor suppliers are going to keep improving, but you could get 5%+ more range from aerodynamics and weight savings.

That is really where the difference is between Tesla and other designs, they reduce weight and have lower aerodynamic drag. That does affect their styling and lack of features (weight). The upcoming Mercedes EQS is going to be among the first to have lower drag Cd than Tesla, so its real world range and efficiency could be higher.
Agree with all of this. Motor efficiency improvement is not worth the effort, it is so high already. The Mach-E motors are likely more efficient than Teslas.

There are likely some gains still to be had with the motor controls, where Tesla is likely more efficient.

If the EQS has better aero numbers than Tesla, it will get better overall vehicle efficiency rates, unless the tires are stupid wide or sticky. It's all about the aero.
 

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Sandy Munro has discussed the relative inefficiency of Ford's EV tech in the MME. These numbers demonstrate just how far off the pace they are compared to other vehicles. Only a handful are worse.
I drove an electric vehicle just the other day that was more than twice as efficient as a Tesla or Mach-E. I'm sending Ford and Tesla the results as soon as I take my golf clubs off the back. Maybe they can both improve their awful efficiency numbers.
 

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Yup, and I'm expecting some software upgrades to make it a bit better...

Price vs range; MME looks pretty good, and if some think that range doesn't matter in Europe, o_O

The route they drive in the test doesn't have too much highway (110 km/h), but some. It has a good amount of elevation though, as the cars that has the longest range climb 1600 (altitude) meters. I believe most part of the route is driven at a speed of approx. 80 – 90 km/h.

You can see the test results at NAF's site here (Norwegian): https://nye.naf.no/elbil/bruke-elbil/test-rekkevidde-sommer-2021

I'm a bit disappointed that they didn't test the standard range MMEs. In the winter test NAF said that they wanted to test them, but Ford Norway didn't give them the opportunity :(
Easy guess that it is the 80 to 90 km/hr run based on the results.

The link is titled The family SUVs deliver on range in the summer and then goes on to talk quite a bit about a model 3 which is not even close to an SUV. Bit strange and misleading. Trucks and vans are not as efficient at tiny compact sedans either.

Ford Mustang Mach-E Mach-E wins again - massive range test against 11 rivals ford-mach-e-vs-tesla-model-3
 

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Easy guess that it is the 80 to 90 km/hr run based on the results.

The link is titled The family SUVs deliver on range in the summer and then goes on to talk quite a bit about a model 3 which is not even close to an SUV. Bit strange and misleading. Trucks and vans are not as efficient at tiny compact sedans either.

Ford Mustang Mach-E Mach-E wins again - massive range test against 11 rivals ford-mach-e-vs-tesla-model-3
Yes, you're right, but the test is for all new EVs – doesn't matter what type as long as it's fully electrical. They only include last years models if they've had a major upgrade (like Tesla Model 3).

The test helps potential buyers compare all the EVs in the test, and decide wether to buy one or not based on requirements and desires.
 

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These numbers demonstrate just how far off the pace they are compared to other vehicles.
What are you talking about??? The compact cars on that list are better by 10% to 15%, but the other CUV/SUV's are all in the same ballpark. That same relationship exists in ICE cars, too.

If the Model Y were in that test it would be in the same group as the MME and others, although it would be lower on the list than either Mach E because its range is less in reality.

Also, just think, if Ford can get their Average Consumption into the 12.2 - 12.4 kWt/100 range like Tesla
Only if they change the shape and shrink the size and weight. An electric coupe that looks more like a mustang will get there, but I am not sure we'll see that this decade.

The M3 and the MachE are simply not comparable. The M3 is closer to the ID3, really a sub-compact these days, the ID3 is in fact taller. I wonder how driving characteristics affect the efficiency numbers. I know just a subtle change in how I accelerate can make a 5%-10% change in efficiency. The MachE does have a tendency to lunge when you hit the accelerator. Kinda the old ICE mustang feel.

Ford should just build attractive capable cars, don't let some silly range measuring stuff dictate your approach. The Mach-E and the ID4 are more comparable. 15 to 14.5.
EXACTLY.
 

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What are you talking about??? The compact cars on that list are better by 10% to 15%, but the other CUV/SUV's are all in the same ballpark. That same relationship exists in ICE cars, too.

If the Model Y were in that test it would be in the same group as the MME and others, although it would be lower on the list than either Mach E because its range is less in reality.


Only if they change the shape and shrink the size and weight. An electric coupe that looks more like a mustang will get there, but I am not sure we'll see that this decade.


EXACTLY.
Range does matter, and right now MME is ruling compared to size. ?
 

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What are you talking about??? The compact cars on that list are better by 10% to 15%, but the other CUV/SUV's are all in the same ballpark. That same relationship exists in ICE cars, too.

If the Model Y were in that test it would be in the same group as the MME and others, although it would be lower on the list than either Mach E because its range is less in reality.


Only if they change the shape and shrink the size and weight. An electric coupe that looks more like a mustang will get there, but I am not sure we'll see that this decade.


EXACTLY.
Well, the Model Y wasn't in the test because it's not delivered to the Norwegian market yet. It will come in next years tests, first in the winter test, then in the summer test.
 

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Well, the Model Y wasn't in the test because it's not delivered to the Norwegian market yet. It will come in next years tests, first in the winter test, then in the summer test.
Probably don't need an official test to see the Y not hitting the estimated range.
 

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Probably don't need an official test to see the Y not hitting the estimated range.
Official tests are always the best over here. Unlike tests in the USA, the range tests here are not supported/payed by any companies other than NAF, which is about cars in general.

EDIT: Well this one was anyways, can't talk about future strange fruit …
 
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Official tests are always the best over here. Unlike tests in the USA, the range tests here are not supported/payed by any companies other than NAF, which is about cars in general.

EDIT: Well this one was anyways, can't talk about future strange fruit …
I prefer the car companies to pay for their own tests, and if they provide bad test results, their reputation is damaged and their sales negatively impacted. That is the way it should be IMO. And there are lots of independent testers out there that are reliable and can help hold the car companies accountable.

The EPA testing car companies do appears to be pretty good, mostly. There are a few outliers from other car manufacturers, but consistently MME owners are achieving Ford's published EPA range. Highway range at 75 mph is what I am most interested in, which is not part of the EPA range testing. But others do it, and there has been enough testing posted in this forum to get a good idea what to expect when driving for two hours with the cruise set at 75 mph.
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