New Ford Dealer DCFC Incentive Program

[SonicBlue]

Having chargers for public consumption, like at ‘hamburger joints, Target, and other non-automotive locations, for instance, is all about driving more retail ’traffic’ to the retail locations. Especially consumers who otherwise may pass up or drive pass that specific retail store.

Similarly, Installing the same, for public consumption at a dealership, is also about driving more ‘traffic’, especially, ‘new’ non-‘on brand’ traffic, to the dealership retail stores. Natural extension of ‘elevated’ automotive service outreach.

Comes under the heading, “It takes money to make money”…good ‘ole capitalism, love it or leave it!

Generally speaking, you’re right. More foot traffic is better for business.

But cars are not hamburgers or a quick run to Target. The folks who show up to a dealership to charge want to charge and get on their way without having to interact with a salesman. Hell, many EV owners are a younger demo that hate the dealership model.

Which means that installing DCFC is a very expensive way to get a few more people on your lot who are not in the market for a new car.

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[dbsb3233]

So, this incentive doesn’t cover installation costs or ongoing maintenance? As a dealer I’d say “pass” to that.

Basically, here is Ford’s offer as I read it: If you install a Level 3 charger, we’ll reimburse you up to $80,000 for the hardware, with the following conditions:

• You have to sell 35 EVs to get to full $80k, at a time when EV demand is plummeting.
• You can’t use the $80k for installation costs. Hardware only.
• You’re on the hook for 100% of ongoing maintenance.
• You incur the extra liability of a bunch of yahoos who aren’t there to buy a car and only cruising your lot looking for your charger, which is probably gonna be right next to your building.
• On the flip side, you’ll get to pocket $2,000 for every EV you sell beyond the first 35 - but that ends on December 31, 2026.

I dunno what my break even would need to be to make that a worthwhile bargain. 200 EVs?

If I read the details right, it's still capped at $80k, meaning no "flip side". So yes, it only covers part of the overall costs. Although I presume the dealership gets whatever (scant) revenue is generated to help cover some of that cost.

And I do expect revenue to be scant, because I expect usage to be scant (and most of that internal, for their own fleets, or doing service). I would bet most of the takers will be in cities, where there's a bigger market for EVs (but usually lots more DCFC already). And not rural dealerships with little EV demand, but where travelers actually need them.

My suburban dealership put them in under the original mandate. Never seen anyone using them (although I'm rarely there). And I don't expect I'll ever use them. Zero reason to. I charge at home. And even if I didn't have home charging and needed to scrounge for DCFC every week, the dealership would be one of the last places I'd choose to do it. What an awful place to charge. What am I gonna do, go buy a new car every week? Buy parts every week? No thanks. If I were stuck DCFCing regularly, I'd pick an EA at a Walmart with a Chili's and Taco Bell in the parking lot. At least there I can have lunch or do my shopping.

 

[silverelan]

Ford should put some of their annual budget of $1.5 billion for US marketing/advertising into becoming a partner in the IONNA consortium.

 

[Sikkun]

Many dealerships are easy on/off from the interstate and have decent waiting rooms with free drinks/snacks and clean bathrooms.

It’s really not a terrible place to charge.

 

[SonicBlue]

If I read the details right, it's still capped at $80k, meaning no "flip side". So yes, it only covers part of the overall costs. Although I presume the dealership gets whatever (scant) revenue is generated to help cover some of that cost.

Oh. I think you’re right. So basically almost all risk and almost zero reward.

My suburban dealership put them in under the original mandate. Never seen anyone using them (although I'm rarely there). And I don't expect I'll ever use them. Zero reason to. I charge at home. And even if I didn't have home charging and needed to scrounge for DCFC every week, the dealership would be one of the last places I'd choose to do it. What an awful place to charge. What am I gonna do, go buy a new car every week? Buy parts every week? No thanks. If I were stuck DCFCing regularly, I'd pick an EA at a Walmart with a Chili's and Taco Bell in the parking lot. At least there I can have lunch or do my shopping.

Agree. This is the point I was making above.

 

[Billyk24]

"... must be equipped with two CCS connectors ... NACS (Tesla) ... are not permitted."

So rumors of Ford switching to NACS are false?

Or is it pushback against Tesla for not providing those adaptors?

 

[Space_Pony]

Just looked up the closest dealer to me this weekend out of curiosity (car just got preconditioning update, one of the 2021 Mach-Es left behind in the updates). 0.60/kwh. The EA station is 0.44. I know it costs money to install and run but Georgia Power is not that expensive a utility (even with their large increases this year). For the dealer to charge that much more for power is just going to upset customers or they won't have customers and can complain that they installed the chargers and nobody is using them.

The closest Ford dealer has 2 120 kw chargers @$.30. It'sthe only dcfc in town. The closest ea, about 50 miles away is $.56.

 

[bbulkow]

from the beginning I haven't understood the push for dealers to have public access level 3 chargers. Talked it over with the general manager at my dealer. He mentioned how they'd have to redesign a lot of aspects of the dealership to accomodate that public access. IN the end they never did.

my experience looking for and using DCFC chargers, like many of you I bet, is to avoid dealer chargers. There are usually only a few chargers, they are often ICEd, there are often few amenities, and the location might not really be 24 hours.

If Ford is interested in EV adoption, and sees the charging network as key to increasing adoption, they would have contract terms like bathroom access, 24/7 space access, 150kw chargers. I don't know how they would measure dealers who ICE chargers, but they would need to find a way.

 

[rwillitt]

Great for dealers to have these chargers. Worthless when the deanship is closed on Sunday and you need a charge.

 

[Guss-E 2021]

At my dealership though they (two cabinets) don't seem to be running yet. Not showing up on Plugshare either.

These are right off the highway and across the road from a big grocery store.

McFarland Ford (for anyone around coastal NH).

 

[Jimrpa]

If you want to fast charge in Lubbock, which is required to bridge a hole in Electrify America's network, the only options are dealerships. My parents charged their ID.4 at a Hyundai dealership in Lubbock last month on the way back from the West Coast.

Lubbock is not a small city but it's pretty isolated. I think if a few other dealerships in isolated areas did this, it will fill it a lot of holes in the national charging network.

Texas allows electric cars? ?

 

[dbsb3233]

Just looked up the closest dealer to me this weekend out of curiosity (car just got preconditioning update, one of the 2021 Mach-Es left behind in the updates). 0.60/kwh. The EA station is 0.44. I know it costs money to install and run but Georgia Power is not that expensive a utility (even with their large increases this year). For the dealer to charge that much more for power is just going to upset customers or they won't have customers and can complain that they installed the chargers and nobody is using them.

The cost of electricity is not the main cost component. Especially for what's likely to be low usage chargers.

The DCFC chargers at my dealership are priced 10c/kWh higher than the (faster) chargers 100 feet away at the gas station across the street. Made zero sense to install chargers at the dealership, but they did it when Ford was mandating it.

 

[dbsb3233]

Texas allows electric cars? ?

Of course they allow them. They just don't try to jam them down people's throats. Personal choice.

TX is #3 in the country in EV ownership, behind CA and FL.

 

[Brons2]

Texas allows electric cars? ?

har har har

Yes, the charging infrastructure here is growing rapidly. Public DCFC is plentiful along the Interstates, and ubiquitous in the big cities i.e., Houston, DFW, Austin, San Antonio. There are charging deserts when you get off the Interstates but I think that's true of many states at this point in time. More chargers are starting to pop up in commonly used non-interstate travel corridors, Lubbock being one example, as it is a commonly used travel corridor between Austin, San Antonio and Houston if you are going to New Mexico and other points more north and west.

Even the famous country store Buc-ees is putting in dozens of Tesla and non-Tesla fast chargers at many of their locations. When I came back from Dallas a couple of weeks ago I stopped at a Mercedes branded ChargePoint charger at a Buc-ees location in Temple, Texas.

I can drive a few miles down the road where I live in the exurbs of the Austin area and see dozens of EVs, mostly Tesla, but I'm seeing more Mach-Es and Bolts also.

 

[dbsb3233]

har har har

Yes, the charging infrastructure here is growing rapidly. Public DCFC is plentiful along the Interstates, and ubiquitous in the big cities i.e., Houston, DFW, Austin, San Antonio. There are charging deserts when you get off the Interstates but I think that's true of many states at this point in time. More chargers are starting to pop up in commonly used non-interstate travel corridors, Lubbock being one example, as it is a commonly used travel corridor between Austin, San Antonio and Houston if you are going to New Mexico and other points more north and west.

Even the famous country store Buc-ees is putting in dozens of Tesla and non-Tesla fast chargers at many of their locations. When I came back from Dallas a couple of weeks ago I stopped at a Mercedes branded ChargePoint charger at a Buc-ees location in Temple, Texas.

I can drive a few miles down the road where I live in the exurbs of the Austin area and see dozens of EVs, mostly Tesla, but I'm seeing more Mach-Es and Bolts also.

And it's much harder for states with tons of unpopulated prairie or mountains (TX, AK, WY, etc) to provide DCFC coverage. It not only takes way more stations in remote areas that aren't well covered with enough electrical infrastructure, usage to pay back those high costs is also low. It's not like the Northeast where there's a megacity every 100 miles.

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