POST Recall Software HVBJB Failure

[heisnuts]

Well, it was finally my turn it seems. I completed the recall software updates via FDRS last week and noticed nothing adverse after the updates and then today I got the dreaded “Service Vehicle Soon” message.

For background, I never DCFC and never have with my GTPE. I purely level 2 charge to 90% every night.

I have a very short commute to work of about 15 miles that is 90% highway and slightly hilly, but nothing really crazy like @scoopman experienced. If anyone is curious, it is the 73 toll road in Orange County.

The failure occurred on my way home from work after my car sat all day in my office’s parking structure that kept it pretty cool. Ambient temps were in the low to mid 70’s on my way home. I had used BlueCruise the whole way set to 75 and had only “gassed it” slightly at the toll booth when BC disengages.

I then exited the freeway and “gassed it” one more time, from roughly 30 mph to 40 to pass someone. Shortly after the pass I received the SVS message and my power was severely limited to the same as @scoopman

Please note, neither of the power events were in anyway pedal to the metal or anywhere close to maxing my power meter.

I ended up going home as it was after 5pm. I turned it off and on a few times and was able to drive with the same messages and power limits in place. I just tried it again and am getting the same. Hopefully it works tomorrow.

I called a few dealers and got nowhere. They all said they’re booked out for weeks. I tried explaining but the appointment people wouldn’t budge. I emailed and left a voicemail for the GM of my preferred dealer, Tuttle Click Ford in Irvine,

Well, it was finally my turn it seems. I completed the recall software updates via FDRS last week and noticed nothing adverse after the updates and then today I got the dreaded “Service Vehicle Soon” message.

For background, I never DCFC and never have with my GTPE. I purely level 2 charge to 90% every night.

I have a very short commute to work of about 15 miles that is 90% highway and slightly hilly, but nothing really crazy like @scoopman experienced. If anyone is curious, it is the 73 toll road in Orange County.

The failure occurred on my way home from work after my car sat all day in my office’s parking structure that kept it pretty cool. Ambient temps were in the low to mid 70’s on my way home. I had used BlueCruise the whole way set to 75 and had only “gassed it” slightly at the toll booth when BC disengages.

I then exited the freeway and “gassed it” one more time, from roughly 30 mph to 40 to pass someone. Shortly after the pass I received the SVS message and my power was severely limited to the same as @scoopman

Please note, neither of the power events were in anyway pedal to the metal or anywhere close to maxing my power meter.

I ended up going home as it was after 5pm. I turned it off and on a few times and was able to drive with the same messages and power limits in place. I just tried it again and am getting the same. Hopefully it works tomorrow.

I called a few dealers and got nowhere. They all said they’re booked out for weeks. I tried explaining but the appointment people wouldn’t budge. I emailed and left a voicemail for the GM of my preferred dealer, Tuttle Click Ford in Irvine, and hope I’ll hear from him or else I guess I just call Ford corporate and see what they can do?

Pretty bummed it finally happened to me but am also happy I’ll get the beefier part. The only concern is if I can get service! Pretty crazy this is gong on and Ford hasn’t told dealers to get people with issues like this in pronto.

I‘m sorry to hear of your failure, but am a little encouraged to hear the update allows you to limp the car to your local dealer rather than being stuck somewhere waiting hours for a tow who may or may not know how to tow an EV.

As someone who had this failure a couple months ago, I agree with the advise given in this thread. My car was towed in after hours and I was told it would. E over a week before they could look at the car. Once Ford got involved they had a field engineer out in a few days and i had my car back in a total of 10 days.

Since mine failed on the weekend I never called for an appointment. I had the car towed in after hours and used the night drop option. As it turns out that may have been a blessing hearing all of the hardships people are running into tori g to call and get an appointment just to drop off the car. Another option would be to reach out to the service manager at the dealership and explain the situation. You might see better results from the service manager, especially if it is at the dealer where you purchased the car. If all else fails, there is always the night drop option at almost all dealers.

I hope you are able to get the car in soon and that Ford gets involved to get you back on the road soon. Please keep us updated.

I’m sorry to hear of another failure, but encouraged to hear that the update at least allows you to limp the car to the dealer rather than being stuck waiting on a tow who may or may not know how to properly tow an EV.

As someone who had the same failure recently, I found opening a case with Ford sped things up considerably. Once Ford got involved they had a field engineer out in a couple days and the car repaired in a total of 10 days.

If you keep getting resistance getting an appointment, you might try reaching out directly to the service manager at the dealer to explain the situation. If this is the dealer where you purchased the car, I would also bring that up as it may help. If all else fails, most dealers have a night drop where you can leave it after hours. That’s what I did in my case since it failed on the weekend and the dealer was closed when it was towed in.

I hope you are able to get the car in soon and that Ford comes through for you to get the car repaired soon. Please keep us updated as it progresses.

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[metalpro2021]

Seems like the 'fix' is to prevent the completely wrecking of the vehicle and have Ford engineers assess the situation before this moment (at the owner's time/expense...) and provide a case based cost friendly solution.

Thank you for sharing this. It seems now that 'structural' (daily) driving in 'demanding' (hilly, outside temp etc.) conditions with a vulnerable car (might be all of us, might be some trim levels, might be faulty parts) causes this. It seems that Ford simply does not know.

 

[MachTee]

I drive these 3 routes every week. I can almost guarantee that if I flash this software I'll get failure if it's based on elevation changes:

OTOH perhaps these are not false positives from the software.

Only one way to find out. Take one for the team

There's a thread that track that cars with the failure somewhere. Does it track the typical power consumption of the cars with the failure? I'm curious if cars that are driven more "gingerly" may be less susceptible.

 

[Kevin P]

I believe Scoopman said that clearing the DTCs restored the car to "normal." Is that correct? Assume the failure code/condition came back rather quickly?

I am not sure I would do it if it was my car, but clearing the DTCs and seeing how long you could drive it before it happened again would be interesting...

 

[markboris]

I drive these 3 routes every week. I can almost guarantee that if I flash this software I'll get failure if it's based on elevation changes:

Altamont Pass:

Pachecho Pass:

Echo Summit:

This is my route up Tioga Pass Road to Tuolumne Meadows. I hike out to upper Yosemite falls starting at the Yosemite Creek Campground. Tioga Pass is only open during the summer and I have been up here twice so far this year (both last month). I just had the software update done last week and will be driving out there again at the end of next week. I will certainly report back if I have any issues.

 

[ElectrifyME]

With what they wound up doing and not doing, none of the dealers are basically prepared for the stream of our cars that will continue to fail over the in-service life of the unfixed cars.

Yes but is Ford prepared for a class action suit? Hmm ?
On another note, would you think cars being built now have the “new” part in addition to updated sw? I don’t even have one of these cars I had my heart set on… now I am faced with cancelling or postponing for a 23. Just seriously unsettling to see this happening. Anyway, thanks for everyone here sharing and educating people.

 

[phil]

...the software is possibly shooting out false positives.

This is what, three failures, all within DAYS of installing Ford's software "fix"? Three is not a big number just yet, but these failures all came awfully fast after the software update. That probably means something.

It may not be "false" positives, it could be conservative predictions of failure, or just buggy software. But most likely DevSecOps is right, and this software fix should be avoided until you want to start dealing with a big service job on your Mach-E.

I plan to wait until the dealers gain some experience, and service department capacity opens up some. Maybe I'll even wait to see how the 'robust' part performs in early installations, and see if Ford perhaps replaces it with something even better.

Three almost-immediate failure messages MIGHT just be random chance, but I doubt it. No software fix for me. Not yet.

 

[ElectrifyME]

Well, it was finally my turn it seems. I completed the recall software updates via FDRS last week and noticed nothing adverse after the updates and then today I got the dreaded “Service Vehicle Soon” message.

For background, I never DCFC and never have with my GTPE. I purely level 2 charge to 90% every night.

I have a very short commute to work of about 15 miles that is 90% highway and slightly hilly, but nothing really crazy like @scoopman experienced. If anyone is curious, it is the 73 toll road in Orange County.

The failure occurred on my way home from work after my car sat all day in my office’s parking structure that kept it pretty cool. Ambient temps were in the low to mid 70’s on my way home. I had used BlueCruise the whole way set to 75 and had only “gassed it” slightly at the toll booth when BC disengages.

I then exited the freeway and “gassed it” one more time, from roughly 30 mph to 40 to pass someone. Shortly after the pass I received the SVS message and my power was severely limited to the same as @scoopman

Please note, neither of the power events were in anyway pedal to the metal or anywhere close to maxing my power meter.

I ended up going home as it was after 5pm. I turned it off and on a few times and was able to drive with the same messages and power limits in place. I just tried it again and am getting the same. Hopefully it works tomorrow.

I called a few dealers and got nowhere. They all said they’re booked out for weeks. I tried explaining but the appointment people wouldn’t budge. I emailed and left a voicemail for the GM of my preferred dealer, Tuttle Click Ford in Irvine, and hope I’ll hear from him or else I guess I just call Ford corporate and see what they can do?

Pretty bummed it finally happened to me but am also happy I’ll get the beefier part. The only concern is if I can get service! Pretty crazy this is gong on and Ford hasn’t told dealers to get people with issues like this in pronto.

Not ok… to state the obvious, sorry for your experience And, going 30-40 mph? on a SoCal fwy is is nothing exceptional given the driving here so that’s nuts! That’s less than what u need to do on a fwy merging from 0-full speed of traffic? So disappointed… but this is not acceptable. Maybe I’ll just go get a tried and true ice or a at least a hybrid.

 

[scoopman]

I believe Scoopman said that clearing the DTCs restored the car to "normal." Is that correct? Assume the failure code/condition came back rather quickly?

I am not sure I would do it if it was my car, but clearing the DTCs and seeing how long you could drive it before it happened again would be interesting...

I didn't test it, I cleared the code but drove the car carefully and slowly to the hotel and then to the nearest dealer. All without turning it off.

 

[Scooby24]

I'm betting the software fix does a better job of identifying a failing HVBJB before it fully welds. like maybe there's more internal resistance, or the actuation time is longer. Either way...in the end I bet a lot of us will be getting new HVBJBs.

 

[kennethjk]

This is what, three failures, all within DAYS of installing Ford's software "fix"? Three is not a big number just yet, but these failures all came awfully fast after the software update. That probably means something.

It may not be "false" positives, it could be conservative predictions of failure, or just buggy software. But most likely DevSecOps is right, and this software fix should be avoided until you want to start dealing with a big service job on your Mach-E.

I plan to wait until the dealers gain some experience, and service department capacity opens up some. Maybe I'll even wait to see how the 'robust' part performs in early installations, and see if Ford perhaps replaces it with something even better.

Three almost-immediate failure messages MIGHT just be random chance, but I doubt it. No software fix for me. Not yet.

I undertsand what you guys are saying, software may be buggy but I would still want to have it installed.

if it is a false positive I will get the upgraded (hopefully) part early and deal with the installation issues. To me it’s still better to limp along to a dealer than to have to be towed while on vacation somewhere. I planned on driving up to Niagara on the lake but that trip is off the table with the MME until I get the new part installed.


this is no fix by any means , just a bit better than doing nothing. Ford should just issue a full recall on the part and be done with it .

Maybe they haven’t issued a recall yet because they don’t know if the new part really solves their problems?

 

[phil]

...software may be buggy but I would still want to have it installed. if it is a false positive I will get the upgraded (hopefully) part early and deal with the installation issues.

I think your attitude is perfectly reasonable. But I prefer to wait, and hope for a better experience later, when things settle down some.

When I am ready to trigger my part failure, I'll install the software fix.

 

[Fixbear]

This is what, three failures, all within DAYS of installing Ford's software "fix"? Three is not a big number just yet, but these failures all came awfully fast after the software update. That probably means something.

It may not be "false" positives, it could be conservative predictions of failure, or just buggy software. But most likely DevSecOps is right, and this software fix should be avoided until you want to start dealing with a big service job on your Mach-E.

I plan to wait until the dealers gain some experience, and service department capacity opens up some. Maybe I'll even wait to see how the 'robust' part performs in early installations, and see if Ford perhaps replaces it with something even better.

Three almost-immediate failure messages MIGHT just be random chance, but I doubt it. No software fix for me. Not yet.

It appears that the "Fix" is more to save dollars and prevent "Bricking" the car. IF they can hold off for time to develop and source the parts, Avoid paying tow charges, and enable you to safely get off the highway. It's a small win. It gets the NTSB off their back and makes it so they have a short amount of time. i.e.: dealer delays. I believe that the software removes the lock setting but monitors the voltage across the contactors closer. Sounds reasonable. No machine is perfect. The closest tolerances are in NASA and Medical. You don't hear about the NASA failures unless we lose something major. But we see Med equipment recalls weekly. Car makers are not exempt from this.

 

[Bullitt]

OP, thank you for letting us know that it still works after turning it off and on again. This is great comfort for those that may have this happen far from home. Even if it's reduced power, you could potentially carry on with a vacation and possibly even make the trip home, then schedule the service locally so it's not a giant logistical headache.

 

[sotek2345]

It appears that the "Fix" is more to save dollars and prevent "Bricking" the car. IF they can hold off for time to develop and source the parts, Avoid paying tow charges, and enable you to safely get off the highway. It's a small win. It gets the NTSB off their back and makes it so they have a short amount of time. i.e.: dealer delays. I believe that the software removes the lock setting but monitors the voltage across the contactors closer. Sounds reasonable. No machine is perfect. The closest tolerances are in NASA and Medical. You don't hear about the NASA failures unless we lose something major. But we see Med equipment recalls weekly. Car makers are not exempt from this.

Nuclear joins the chat on tolerances.

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