Tesla Supercharger Network vs. the World

[Billyk24]

There were Rosie the Riveter in many locations thru the country including the greater Pittsburgh, Pa. region! These women worked at the Dravo shipyard on Neville Island. Women worked in many industrial plants such as Ford and where the Jeep was created in Bantam.

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[dbsb3233]

Agree that a lot more chargers will be coming. And increased revenue from more sales will help some. I just suspect that still won't be enough to make them self-supporting, and thus will continue to rely on taxpayer support (or VW fines).

As much as I hope for more and more highway coverage for my personal use, what I really think would advance BEV market share more is focusing on getting L2 into apartment complexes. I just don't think many people will put up with full-time 30 minute charges. A few times on a road trip, sure, but not all the time. Overnight "park it and forget it" charging is crucial for BEV adoption IMO.

 

[dbsb3233]

Absolutely. $15k more isn't going to cut it for most apartment renters, who trend toward being younger and poorer.

 

[efisher]

While tesla currently loses money with the network (it was once a necessity and is now a loss leader), one they stop expanding it can be self-sustaining. I have no reason to suspect it will go away, quickly or slowly.

Given Tesla’s willingness to operate it at a loss, and their presence in generation and storage, they can be very competitive if they so choose to attract more people to their brand. Independent charging networks have to be profitable on their own (electrify America may not if VW underwrites it after the settlement phase ends).

I suspect that once charging stations are everywhere, Tesla will sell its charging network to some third party.

 

[dbsb3233]

Virtually all public info agrees that Tesla loses money on their Supercharger network, not makes money.

It's a loss-leader that helps them sell more cars though.

 

[EVer]

Virtually all public info agrees that Tesla loses money on their Supercharger network, not makes money.

It's a loss-leader that helps them sell more cars though.

Virtually everyone, including Tesla spokespeople. The only person I've seen claim otherwise doesn't base it on anything but unsupported assumptions.

 

[RonTCat]

VW funded EA because they were forced to as part of the diesel emission cheating settlement. EA is a huge cost sink for VW. There is no profit in charging services at this point.

 

[EVer]

VW funded EA because they were forced to as part of the diesel emission cheating settlement. EA is a huge cost sink for VW. There is no profit in charging services at this point.

EVgo is also not profitable.

https://www.climateandcapitalmedia.com/catching-up-with-evgo-ceo-catherine-zoi/

 

[DBC]

VW funded EA because they were forced to as part of the diesel emission cheating settlement. EA is a huge cost sink for VW.

Think of it as community service and a fine! I don't know if charging is profitable but I wouldn't think it would be. I knew a few people who tried to come up with a business model for it -- mostly selling services other than charging to a captive audience -- and couldn't.

The only entities which could make the economics work would be electrical utilities and the PUCs won't let them into the charging space.

Hard to see how this would work. Gas stations make money selling everything but gas. This works but requires people to stop to refuel fairly often. This type of volume seems elusive for charging because (1) there aren't that many BEVs to start with; and (2) charging at home will be more convenient and less expensive. How many gas stations would there be if you could fill-up at home for $1/gallon?

My cost at home is $.09/kWh. I'd be happy to pay $.50/kWh on a trip but that wouldn't happen that frequently. (And again you have regulatory issues reselling electricity).

 

[EVer]

How many gas stations would there be if you could fill-up at home for $1/gallon?

Fueling at home is just the best. As you mentioned, profits on end-user fuel sales at gas stations are thin (though for stations owned by the oil companies they're better than for private owners), often a few pennies per gallon. They make it up with overpriced junk food.

Tesla still advocates for home charging as the preferred solution: "The best place to charge your Tesla is at home, overnight. Plug in when you get home and wake up to a full charge every morning. Charge your car from the sun and drive on sunshine by adding solar panels to power your home."

Ford used to, but it seems to have changed the FAQ language. From the wayback machine circa Febrary 2020: "8. How can I charge my Mustang Mach-E at home? Most charging is done at home."

The sentiments now expressed are the same, but they've promoted flexibility by referring to the capability rather than the location. "8. Does the vehicle come with a charge cord? All Ford Mustang Mach-Es come standard with the Ford Mobile Charger. This allows for the flexibility of charging your vehicle with a standard home outlet (120V), or charging faster using a 240V outlet that large appliances use."

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