Stop Safely Now (HVBJB): Mach-E Owners Biggest Fear - Facts and Info Thread

[FordMachEGo]

Happened to me as well. Had to get it towed from my driveway. It's been at the dealership since May 6th. '21 Premium, ER, AWD. Took Delivery of it in February 2022 and it had roughly 3,400 miles on it.

Took them 1 week to even get a qualified person to look at it. Ordered a new 12V battery which took 2 weeks to arrive. They replaced that and then had more errors tracing back to the high voltage battery. More parts are needed there as well which are also on backorder. The service manager at the dealership doesn't even really seem to understand what's going on with it.

Ford CS has been incredibly unhelpful (bouncing me to different service members, transferring me to dead-end lines, unclear communication on reimbursement for monthly payments). It's a shame because I love the vehicle (First EV, first Ford), but this whole experience has left a pretty bad impression on me.

Also happened to my co-worker (2021 GT Performance edition, ~4,000 miles) but he was able to get his back in ~1 week. Not sure if it was a different component that failed but he did take it to a different dealership.

Does anyone know if it’s possible to tow the Mach e from the rear, as in the picture above, and attach to the proper winch point in the front? Would that even work?

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[ElectrifyCLT]

Does anyone know if it’s possible to tow the Mach e from the rear, as in the picture above, and attach to the proper winch point in the front? Would that even work?

There is no approved rear tow point. Some have had success hooking onto the rear control arms, but even that isn't truly approved by Ford.

 

[FordMachEGo]

Edit: Now that I think about it, that might be a good way to damage the battery pack just from the stress from the straps. I don’t know. Anyone care to comment?

 

[AllenXS]

I just have a sneaking suspicion that this problem is in all the part(s) that are currently out there and it is only a matter of time before this happens to every last one of them. This is based on zero information or solid evidence, really just fear. I am not an owner yet, nor do I have one on order. Until Ford officially explains the issue and that they have a fix I will not purchase one. I wish that was a threat to Ford, but since I am on a waiting list Ford won't care about this type of threat. Hearing good things about the Ionic 5... Just saying. Would MUCH rather get the mme though.

Hope you're checking out the Ionic forums too.

I've been through this, and I am now aware my dealer took longer to ensure the car is as awesome as it can be, same thing they did to help with the 1.71 holdup.
Ford have been working hard behind the scenes on a number of issues and it seems they are being cleared up quickly, especially now the Lightening is out.

There were lots of issues a year ago that seemed like they were going to be a big issue, one was a screaming small display yet in the end it was only the few owners who needed replacements.
This issue is still small and potentially isolated but because it requires a tow and a bit of time in a garage for mechanics who have never had to service this before, its appears to be a major.

At this point it isn't. I believe it won't happen to mine again and even if it does, its still a small issue not affecting many at all. Just a few of us who had nothing better to do during the wait to be repaired and raise the issue loudly so Ford would be more aware of it.

So glad Ford is so involved in making the Mach-E better.

 

[RMoore]

Hope you're checking out the Ionic forums too.

Agree, it's crazy on those forums. The way the Na+ ion folks talk about the Cl- ion folks is nuts. I don't know why the anion fans and cation fans can't seem to get along...

Or did you mean the Greek column forums? The Ionic and Doric ones seem tame but boy the Corinthean crowd can get rowdy.

 

[Gimme_my_MME]

Agree, it's crazy on those forums. The way the Na+ ion folks talk about the Cl- ion folks is nuts. I don't know why the anion fans and cation fans can't seem to get along...

Or did you mean the Greek column forums? The Ionic and Doric ones seem tame but boy the Corinthean crowd can get rowdy.

 

[BigMach-E]

There were lots of issues a year ago that seemed like they were going to be a big issue, one was a screaming small display yet in the end it was only the few owners who needed replacements.
This issue is still small and potentially isolated but because it requires a tow and a bit of time in a garage for mechanics who have never had to service this before, its appears to be a major.

At this point it isn't. I believe it won't happen to mine again and even if it does, its still a small issue not affecting many at all. Just a few of us who had nothing better to do during the wait to be repaired and raise the issue loudly so Ford would be more aware of it.

Hmmm, that's a super hot take on this. It's an odd assumption that "it happened to me, and they put the exact same type of part that is known to fail back into my car, and didn't do anything else, but it won't happen to me again.". News flash, likely to happen again. No parameters have changed, and as @DevSecOps stated, there isn't much programmable about the module, so firmware will be unlikely to prevent it from occuring again. Everyone has a different level of what they find acceptable in a car. I don't find the looming threat of my car getting bricked and needing a tow that no one wants to perform as acceptable.

 

[Addos]

Hmmm, that's a super hot take on this. It's an odd assumption that "it happened to me, and they put the exact same type of part that is known to fail back into my car, and didn't do anything else, but it won't happen to me again.". News flash, likely to happen again. No parameters have changed, and as @DevSecOps stated, there isn't much programmable about the module, so firmware will be unlikely to prevent it from occuring again. Everyone has a different level of what they find acceptable in a car. I don't find the looming threat of my car getting bricked and needing a tow that no one wants to perform as acceptable.

Well, and it doesn't even sound like it necessarily has a quick turnaround time too. So you are not only talking potentially the car bricking, but perhaps weeks at a dealer, depending on how quickly parts can be sourced, and how soon they can study up on how to properly do the maintenance. It might be a slightly different story if you knew for certain the car would get precedence and you knew for sure they already had the parts and could get it done the same day.

 

[mme gt]

Mine has been in the shop for at least 30days for this issue. Has anyone got reimbursed from Ford for their monthly car payment?

 

[generaltso]

Has anyone got reimbursed from Ford for their monthly car payment?

Yes, people have.

 

[heisnuts]

Mine has been in the shop for at least 30days for this issue. Has anyone got reimbursed from Ford for their monthly car payment?

Do you have an open case with Ford? When this happened to me the Ford rep on this board reached out and opened a case before my dealer even wrote up the car. That sped things up a lot in my case.

Since you car has been out of service for more than 30 days now, I would say it would not be unreasonable at all to ask them for a month's payment.

 

[rcechinel]

I can now report that the HVBJB has been superseded by a new version because it's available on parts websites throughout the internet.

The old part number was: LJ9Z10C666A
The new part number is: NK4Z10C666B

I can't say much more at this point, but since that's public I can point that out.

@DevSecOps, any speculation allowed around the new part number already being used at the factory for current builds? Asking for a friend. ?

 

[DevSecOps]

@DevSecOps, any speculation allowed around the new part number already being used at the factory for current builds? Asking for a friend. ?

I mean Ford isn't gonna install an old, problematic, piece of hardware in a car now that a new version is released. Just like if you order the old number, you should automatically get the new one.

When that exactly happened on the factory line, I don't know. I have 0 insight into factory operations.

PS - Someone please react to this. I don't like having a reaction score of 3666.

 

[heisnuts]

PS - Someone please react to this. I don't like having a reaction score of 3666.

kind of like the part number....

 

[Danimal]

Preface:

The purpose of this post is to bring information together so that people can reference what is known about the HVBJB issue. While some of us might know more than we are publicly talking about, for confidentiality reasons, we cannot disclose everything. I'll do my best to help calm nerves, be honest and not violate agreements in the process. All of the information below has been discussed on this forum, extracted from posted DTC's and service repair orders or gathered via non-confidential communication.

I am an MME GTPE owner myself. My vehicle is just as susceptible as any other owner. Obviously, we all have our own way of mentally dealing with things. I, personally, do not worry about this happening to me and I don't think people should worry. We don't worry about flat tires, alternators, getting in an accident etc. Being prepared and having the necessary knowledge is not only relieving to the mind, but the best and only course of action in this case, as of now.

Finally, "Stop Safely Now" is a generic message and is used for many different critical faults. This post is specifically about the failure of the High Voltage Battery Junction Box.

Other commonly referred to names:

• Cold weather issues
• LVB Battery Failure
• HVJB Failure
• BECM Failure
• High Voltage Battery Issue

The problem:

Late last year we had a few members starting to report that their cars would say "stop safely now". It was attributed by the forum members as something related to the cold as it was mostly happening to people in colder climates. Many people also attributed the issue to faulty LVB's most likely due to the fact that the MME previously had LVB issues. As time went on, a few of us attempted to reassure people that it wasn't LVBs at all. Obviously, those with repair orders, whom this affected had insight into what was happening. They received repair orders for the BECM and HVBJB. It came to light through this process and those of us with insight that it wasn't the LVB.

The LVB was often blamed early on because of the aforementioned previous issue and also because when the HVBJB fails it no longer charges the LVB. Thus, leaving the LVB to die. This is like an alternator going out in an ICE vehicle. The battery is dead, but only as a result of a bad alternator.

Many months ago, it was disclosed that temperature does play a part in the failure of the HVBJB, and that will be discussed further down.

When this happens, the driver will receive a "stop safely now" indicator followed by the car being bricked essentially. The car must be towed in and diagnostic codes will reveal that the contactors in the HVBJB are stuck, either open or closed.

The resolution:

When this happens, the only thing you can do is have the car towed and the HVBJB replaced along with the BECM (the BECM was originally replaced at the onset of this issue, but has since been determined to not need replacing). Some people report that it took 2 days while other dealers took months. This however is NOT a resolution. It's only a fix for the immediate issue to get the car on the road again. Because the replacement of the HVBJB is not a resolution (as of 05/27/22) it can happen to the same vehicle multiple times.

Update 06/03/22: Ford has a new version of the HVBJB that's now being installed into problematic cars. See this post.

Prevalence:

I have no numerical statistics on the prevalence. My guess is that it's less than 1%. Based on the forum self-reporting done this would coincide with my guesstimate.

Is my car immune to this:

Simple answer, no. This can happen to any MME, of any MY, in any climate, anywhere in the world.

Is my car more prone to this:

Possibly, but for the purposes of this thread I can't elaborate.

Is temperature to blame:

As it was confirmed months ago on this forum by a Ford Engineer, temperature does play a role in this. It's not however, just cold and I cannot elaborate further.

What is Ford doing:

Ford is obviously aware of the issue. They've seen it on this forum and their dealer network has been given instructions on how to get cars back on the road. There are Ford employees here that look at almost all the threads. As any car manufacturer would, we can assume that they are actively working on a solution. I cannot confirm, deny or elaborate on what the permanent solution would be.

Update: 06/03/22 - Ford is now fitting cars that have a defective HVBJB with a revised HVBJB. Further details will likely follow. See this post.

Will this be a recall:

A recall, before it's disclosed publicly, is obviously confidential. Therefore, recall speculation is only hearsay at this point.

What to do to prevent this from happening:

Unfortunately, there's nothing you can do, or not do, that we are 100% confident in being resolute.

What to do in the meantime:

My personal recommendations -

• Back in to all parking spots
• Back in to the garage
• Install tow stickers (see here) (purchase here)
• Keep a tow card in the car (see here)
• Know the procedure for a dead LVB jump (refer to the manual here) - Page 267
• Know how to emergency tow the vehicle. Don't rely on the tow company. (refer to the manual here) - Page 271

If you experience "stop safely now" I would recommend -

• DO NOT attempt to start the car over and over! Save the LVB as much as possible and keep the car off
• As long as it's safe to do so, unlatch the hood but leave it shut, not latched, to keep the light off
• Roll down a window and close the door to keep the cabin lights off
• If you are at home, connect the LVB to a battery maintainer or charger
• If it were me, I would call my insurance roadside over Ford since they are much quicker, but that's up to you.
• Look to have it towed to an EV specialty dealer. They have the tools and battery lift to fix this. Ensure the dealer will accept the car before having it towed there.
• Get a case logged with Ford Immediately. Ford can put pressure on the dealer and expedite the replacement parts.

Important Ford Numbers:

Ford Roadside (to get towed):

(800) 241-3673

Ford customer support (to get a case started):

(800) 392-3673

Links to other beneficial resources:

How to tow an MME
Failure Survey
List of members with HVBJB failure
File a NHTSA complaint

Initialism used in this post:

EV = Electric Vechile
MY = Model Year
HVB = High Voltage Battery
LVB = Low Voltage Battery
MME = Mustang Mach E
SSN = Stop Safely Now
BECM = Battery Energy Control Module
GTPE = GT Performance Edition
HVBJB = High Voltage Battery Junction Box

Other resources:

The HVBJB in the MME is not a unique component to Ford. It's an essential part of EVs. Contactors getting stuck also isn't new or unique to Ford. Using Google you might be able to find other instances in other makes (like this) with little nuggets of information that might just be very similar to the MME issues. Like the above link mentions, we have also seen members get similar errors when there's an electrical short, and it's not a HVBJB failure but presents its self similarly.

In closing:

If you think I should add information to this post, let me know and I'll be more than happy to consider it and maintain this post. As more information is made public or authorized for public consumption I'll update it as well. I'm not active much more on this forum due to all the negativity and hyperbole here, but felt this post was necessary because of all the outside communication I receive from other members.

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