Can One-Pedal Driving induce hydroplaning?

Mr. Toejam

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I was driving through Los Angeles on Feb 24 during one of our largest and longest rain storms in a long time. Before everyone that isn't from So Cal starts saying "stop crying about your little weather problems" or "LA people can't handle a little bad weather"...keep in mind, we average 2-3 inches of rain per month is our "wet" areas during Jan-March. Jan saw 8 inches and the last 3 days in Feb will probably come in around 9 inches. Our infrastructure to handle that much rain in such a short period just isn't there and the highways simply do not drain the water off fast enough. LA freeways are notorious for puddling and because we don't get much rain, we end up with dirty-oily roads. And....people in LA don't know how to slow down.

Anyway, I was on the freeway and there was enough rain that speeds were down to around 50-55 mph. Limit is 65 and that means the normal speed is around 75. I was in the carpool lane and I a pickup truck about 200 yards ahead of me spin out and hit the center divider and stop in the carpool lane. I lift off of the accelerator (1-pedal and Engaged mode). Doing so, the car starts to slow and immediately the car starts vibrating. The car is hydroplaning and since it did not slow down, the Anti-lock breaks kicked in. Fortunately, I was on a straight section and the car stayed straight. I applied a little throttle, the vibration stopped, and I was able to pull out of the lane and get around the truck by about 50-75 feet still doing around 40-50mph. I don't remember if the collision alert kick-in...it all happened pretty quick. Forturnately the lane next too me was open but unfortunately, I could not stop because there was enough traffic that me stopping would have been a disaster. I don't remember hearing or feeling like I just ran into puddling water. This one was a 2 out of 5 on the sphincter-pucker scale. (20+ years ago, I had a 5 out of 5 with one of my old Mustang GTs in the rain, but I earned that one...young and dumb.)

In our ICE vehicle, I would lift off the accelerator, let the car slowly decelerate and slowly pull the the right. Just like snow, the last thing you want to do is something sudden and upset the balance of the vehicle.

1) Maybe I hit the same puddle the truck hit, though it didn't feel like it. And I hit other puddles of standing water and did not lose control and the care never felt loose. The truck that spun out was probably doing 65-70 when he passed me. I remember thinking, "...you're going to lose it...." and then he did.
2) Maybe I hit a transition from asphalt to concrete and that upset the car. Our freeways are a mess.
3) Maybe I did hit the brake pedal. Just unlikely. Stabbing the brakes is not my method of driving. I consider myself pretty a smooth driver, especially when it comes to braking.
4) ...maybe 50-55PHM was still too fast. 2 inches of rain in an hour is a lot.

After that, I shut off 1-pedal. On the remainder of my drive, I hit large(r) and longer puddles of standing water and varying surface conditions and was still driving 50-55 mph. I never hydroplaned and when I lifted on the accelerator, no drama. A 5500 lbs car and the bicycle tires it comes with, you would think this thing would slice through puddles with ease, but that was not the case earlier in the day.

Has anyone else run into this and do people who normally get a lot of rain or snow turn off 1-pedal in bad weather?
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The tires can't tell if the braking is from regen vs mechanical nor do they care what pedal induced the braking action.
If you would have induced the same braking force via the brake pedal, the result would be the same.
 

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The tires can't tell if the braking is from regen vs mechanical nor do they care what pedal induced the braking action.
If you would have induced the same braking force via the brake pedal, the result would be the same.
Agreed, but it’s an interesting point about 1PD that many (myself included) probably wouldn’t think of. Knowing this now, I’ll turn off 1PD during freeway driving in the rain… (Bay Area roads are about the same shitshow as LA roads.?)
 
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In theory, it shouldn’t make a difference whether you are using 1PD driving or normal driving.

In practice, you just have to be more careful to not completely lift off the accelerator in these type of situations if you are in 1PD if you do not intend to abruptly apply that much braking force.

I prefer 2PD driving because that’s what I am used to. Beyond that, I do think it is easier to get the exact amount of braking force you intend with 2PD driving, particularly in an emergency situation.

While some drivers can handle it no problem, I do think a lot of people would have an issue urgently going from say 20% depressed accelerator to 5% to hit mild deceleration instead of moderate deceleration when you are in a situation where this difference matters.
 

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I've hydroplaned with engine braking in a pickup truck before. As has been said, sudden changes of wheel rotation rate can induce weird behaviors regardless of the power source.
 


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I was driving through Los Angeles on Feb 24 during one of our largest and longest rain storms in a long time. Before everyone that isn't from So Cal starts saying "stop crying about your little weather problems" or "LA people can't handle a little bad weather"...keep in mind, we average 2-3 inches of rain per month is our "wet" areas during Jan-March. Jan saw 8 inches and the last 3 days in Feb will probably come in around 9 inches. Our infrastructure to handle that much rain in such a short period just isn't there and the highways simply do not drain the water off fast enough. LA freeways are notorious for puddling and because we don't get much rain, we end up with dirty-oily roads. And....people in LA don't know how to slow down.

Anyway, I was on the freeway and there was enough rain that speeds were down to around 50-55 mph. Limit is 65 and that means the normal speed is around 75. I was in the carpool lane and I a pickup truck about 200 yards ahead of me spin out and hit the center divider and stop in the carpool lane. I lift off of the accelerator (1-pedal and Engaged mode). Doing so, the car starts to slow and immediately the car starts vibrating. The car is hydroplaning and since it did not slow down, the Anti-lock breaks kicked in. Fortunately, I was on a straight section and the car stayed straight. I applied a little throttle, the vibration stopped, and I was able to pull out of the lane and get around the truck by about 50-75 feet still doing around 40-50mph. I don't remember if the collision alert kick-in...it all happened pretty quick. Forturnately the lane next too me was open but unfortunately, I could not stop because there was enough traffic that me stopping would have been a disaster. I don't remember hearing or feeling like I just ran into puddling water. This one was a 2 out of 5 on the sphincter-pucker scale. (20+ years ago, I had a 5 out of 5 with one of my old Mustang GTs in the rain, but I earned that one...young and dumb.)

In our ICE vehicle, I would lift off the accelerator, let the car slowly decelerate and slowly pull the the right. Just like snow, the last thing you want to do is something sudden and upset the balance of the vehicle.

1) Maybe I hit the same puddle the truck hit, though it didn't feel like it. And I hit other puddles of standing water and did not lose control and the care never felt loose. The truck that spun out was probably doing 65-70 when he passed me. I remember thinking, "...you're going to lose it...." and then he did.
2) Maybe I hit a transition from asphalt to concrete and that upset the car. Our freeways are a mess.
3) Maybe I did hit the brake pedal. Just unlikely. Stabbing the brakes is not my method of driving. I consider myself pretty a smooth driver, especially when it comes to braking.
4) ...maybe 50-55PHM was still too fast. 2 inches of rain in an hour is a lot.

After that, I shut off 1-pedal. On the remainder of my drive, I hit large(r) and longer puddles of standing water and varying surface conditions and was still driving 50-55 mph. I never hydroplaned and when I lifted on the accelerator, no drama. A 5500 lbs car and the bicycle tires it comes with, you would think this thing would slice through puddles with ease, but that was not the case earlier in the day.

Has anyone else run into this and do people who normally get a lot of rain or snow turn off 1-pedal in bad weather?
The main cause of hydroplaning is to fast for road conditions.
 

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In theory, it shouldn’t make a difference whether you are using 1PD driving or normal driving.

In practice, you just have to be more careful to not completely lift off the accelerator in these type of situations if you are in 1PD if you do not intend to abruptly apply that much braking force.

I prefer 2PD driving because that’s what I am used to. Beyond that, I do think it is easier to get the exact amount of braking force you intend with 2PD driving, particularly in an emergency situation.

While some drivers can handle it no problem, I do think a lot of people would have an issue urgently going from say 20% depressed accelerator to 5% to hit mild deceleration instead of moderate deceleration when you are in a situation where this difference matters.
I think in an emergency many will take their foot off the pedal, which is why I think it's better to offer choices for this function. If there's heavy rain and slower traffic up ahead I take my foot off the accelerator and coast with light brake pedal application.
 
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The tires can't tell if the braking is from regen vs mechanical nor do they care what pedal induced the braking action.
If you would have induced the same braking force via the brake pedal, the result would be the same.

I use unbridled 1-p all the time..... max regen (0% throttle) is about 100 kw of braking.... which is substantial, and could quite likely break traction on a slick road or deep puddle.

If you are in 1-pd and lose traction, you do NOT want to lift foot off throttle completely, you should lift *slightly* to create zero or light braking... It's a big difference from ICE training, and takes a while to change habits.

Once you get used to it.... 1-p is great on snow, ice and wet because you don't lose the time to move your foot from throtle to brake pedal. When I am in snow, ice, or monsoon rain, I usually have my phone displaying CarScanner dashboard display to I can SEE my output/regen power in kw and find zero/gentle braking as needed. this is one of the primary reasons I wanted to be able to see output/regen power (in kw for accuracy) on the dashboard. Since Ford didn't put it on the instrument panel, I put it up on CarScanner Display when I'm driving in bad conditions especially.

Ford Mustang Mach-E Can One-Pedal Driving induce hydroplaning? dashboard_4 power-chg temps-lv DC curr-kwhr
 

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Ford recommends Whisper Mode with 1PD off in bad conditions for this very reason.
 

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I use unbridled 1-p all the time..... max regen (0% throttle) is about 100 kw of braking.... which is substantial, and could quite likely break traction on a slick road or deep puddle.

If you are in 1-pd and lose traction, you do NOT want to lift foot off throttle completely, you should lift *slightly* to create zero or light braking... It's a big difference from ICE training, and takes a while to change habits.

Once you get used to it.... 1-p is great on snow, ice and wet because you don't lose the time to move your foot from throtle to brake pedal. When I am in snow, ice, or monsoon rain, I usually have my phone displaying CarScanner dashboard display to I can SEE my output/regen power in kw and find zero/gentle braking as needed. this is one of the primary reasons I wanted to be able to see output/regen power (in kw for accuracy) on the dashboard. Since Ford didn't put it on the instrument panel, I put it up on CarScanner Display when I'm driving in bad conditions especially.
I don’t think there’s any doubt that 1PD changes the dynamic between the driver and brake application. Everyone should use the drive mode that provides them the best control, especially in challenging road conditions.
 

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Traction control will cut regen quite quickly if it detects tire slippage on decelerating. It really feels like you're slipping, but it's not. Dollars to donuts that's what you experienced.
 
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Mr. Toejam

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Ford recommends Whisper Mode with 1PD off in bad conditions for this very reason.
Is that in the manual. I must have missed it. Can you say where?
 
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Mr. Toejam

Mr. Toejam

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Traction control will cut regen quite quickly if it detects tire slippage on decelerating. It really feels like you're slipping, but it's not. Dollars to donuts that's what you experienced.
Car was trying to stop and a slight input in the steering wheel acted like hydroplaning. But still possible.
 

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Is that in the manual. I must have missed it. Can you say where?
Page 242

WHISPER
Whisper mode is for relaxed driving and
adverse weather conditions. This is the
best mode for driving in slippery conditions.
This mode decreases accelerator response
at partial inputs. Steering tunes for
comfort. When you release the accelerator
pedal, your vehicle slowly decelerates
allowing for a more comfortable ride. The
interior sound turns off and the ambient
lights and cluster graphics are set to blue
with a graphic that starts to illuminate blue
as you drive efficiently at consistent
speeds.
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