Anyone want to run my VIN after CSP 21P22?

[Murse-In-Airy]

You should be able to turn this into a "we owe you" event. Ok, humans make mistakes, but I'm taking my time for this mistake. How about _____?

I did this when DTCs weren't checked, and got the GSM (Gear Shift Module) updated, which took them under 2 minutes, which put me at 100% updated.

A few years back, my F-150 had a recall for reprogramming the transmission. Setup an appointment, drove across town, and they read the recall and discovered that it had changed, and they couldn't do my transmission (and they should have known because of the number of F-150s affected). Service Writer immediately apologized, and said "when it can be done, make sure to come in with an empty gas tank and we'll fill it". I did. Tank holds 36 gallons, I think it was down 30 - 32 at the time. That's service.

Agreed. But right now I’m trying foster the relationship a little. So I’m being accommodating and trying to teach here. Read the recall. Follow the steps.
An informed consumer can be your friend or your worst nightmare. I’d rather come out of this being his friend so when I inevitably show up for more work, it’s done correctly and collegially.
Maybe I’m soft. But I mess up too. I prefer to not only learn and get better but also use my mistakes as examples to others so they can see that it’s OK to learn too. The Service manager mentioned using this as an example for his people so if it helps them to get better, then I think the goal has been met.

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[Neil4Real]

Agreed. But right now I’m trying foster the relationship a little. So I’m being accommodating and trying to teach here. Read the recall. Follow the steps.
An informed consumer can be your friend or your worst nightmare. I’d rather come out of this being his friend so when I inevitably show up for more work, it’s done correctly and collegially.
Maybe I’m soft. But I mess up too. I prefer to not only learn and get better but also use my mistakes as examples to others so they can see that it’s OK to learn too. The Service manager mentioned using this as an example for his people so if it helps them to get better, then I think the goal has been met.

Most certainly, but you also can only be so lax. You’ve already said they tried to pull a fast one when you brought it in for a previous bulletin, so they keep showing they clearly aren’t listening nor improving from your feedback. Imagine if they did any other MMEs before yours and those people are still having problems but think nothing can be done because the dealer said their car is up to date? Especially when this group of updates also gives you the charging curve fix, possibly increased battery access, charging noise, etc.

 

[Murse-In-Airy]

Most certainly, but you also can only be so lax. You’ve already said they tried to pull a fast one when you brought it in for a previous bulletin, so they keep showing they clearly aren’t listening nor improving from your feedback. Imagine if they did any other MMEs before yours and those people are still having problems but think nothing can be done because the dealer said their car is up to date? Especially when this group of updates also gives you the charging curve fix, possibly increased battery access, charging noise, etc.

I’m more of a three strikes person. That’s why I no longer go to the other Ford dealership in the area, Caskinette Ford of Carthage, NY. Three times they refused to acknowledge a TSB for bad door wire harnesses when my door speakers would cut in and out. So I’ll call this strike two for Davidson Ford of Watertown.

 

[sockmeister]

@Murse-In-Airy I went through this same thing -- I had 21P22 applied, and when I got the car back, everything seemed *worse*. I don't know what they did, but @DevSecOps ran my VIN through FDRS and, like you, it turns out they didn't update much of anything.
So, I took the car back, complaining, with a printout of what needed to be installed, and asked them to update them. But they refused, with this statement:

I'm still missing them. I don't know what to do, but this is really confusing.
Here's what's still missing from my car. I'm considering getting the tool to do it myself.

 

[DevSecOps]

I'm considering getting the tool to do it myself.

Or you can tell the family you're gonna take them to Disneyland in California with the true intention to swing by and get your car updated ?

 

[louibluey]

I’m more of a three strikes person. That’s why I no longer go to the other Ford dealership in the area, Caskinette Ford of Carthage, NY. Three times they refused to acknowledge a TSB for bad door wire harnesses when my door speakers would cut in and out. So I’ll call this strike two for Davidson Ford of Watertown.

Hey, that 2 hour drive to the Utica area is looking better all the time

Just a couple of notes, for my FE AWD, the only recent updates after 21P22, were ABS and IPC, and both updated fine, but did not drop off the update list (well known FDRS bug). I held off on updates for a couple of weeks. There were some odd APIM updates that showed for a week, then went away as FDRS got back to normal.

Also, dealers may still be nervous after all the FDRS problems for a couple of weeks over the holiday (not an excuse for them), just be aware that we had a lot of FDRS problems over the holidays.

I missed your post, happy to check any time as well.

 

[sockmeister]

The most annoying thing is the way that software updates are handled in this car. I think it's a problem of heldover "legacy" mentality with carmakers like Ford:

• A software update should resolve bugs or add features (an improvement) without introducing new issues. These modules should all be designed in such a way that everyone can, and should, receive them, without "negative drivability concerns" and waiting for a problem to crop up before doing it. Wouldn't that save them money in the long run?
• Why can't these modules come as an OTA update?

As a consumer in 2022, where software, and regular software updates, permeate almost every aspect of our lives... these are frustrating problems to be dealing with.

 

[generaltso]

@Murse-In-Airy I went through this same thing -- I had 21P22 applied, and when I got the car back, everything seemed *worse*. I don't know what they did, but @DevSecOps ran my VIN through FDRS and, like you, it turns out they didn't update much of anything.
So, I took the car back, complaining, with a printout of what needed to be installed, and asked them to update them. But they refused, with this statement:

I'm still missing them. I don't know what to do, but this is really confusing.
Here's what's still missing from my car. I'm considering getting the tool to do it myself.

If there were no CSP, that would be true. But the CSP tells them to update specific modules for "Customer Satisfaction", not because of a reported problem. Do you have a different dealer you can try?

 

[sockmeister]

If there were no CSP, that would be true. But the CSP tells them to update specific modules for "Customer Satisfaction", not because of a reported problem. Do you have a different dealer you can try?

I do. But it's a PITA to arrange a drop off and pickup and a day of not having the car over and over again, with no guarantee that they'll actually do it.
I'll probably just ask again when it's time for the glass recall (scheduled for February).

 

[Murse-In-Airy]

If there were no CSP, that would be true. But the CSP tells them to update specific modules for "Customer Satisfaction", not because of a reported problem. Do you have a different dealer you can try?

@sockmeister
This right here.

is the part that tells the dealer to update the 12 modules.
I’d be all for taking your work order that says “we ain’t doin’ it” and emailing it to David Johnson @ Ford. His email probably isn’t that hard to find. It’s his letterhead the CSP is printed on.
I was about ready to go there with my Service Manager, but apparently he saw the light.

 

[DevSecOps]

but apparently he saw the light.

I'm not sure that's an appropriate comment from a murse-in-airy ?

 

[VegStang]

My service advisor told me after I picked the car up that sometimes they have “issues” with some of the updates failing. Now I’m totally curious to see if everything was done with mine- sending my vin to @DevSecOps- feel free to ignore or send along any info when you get the chance. Would be nice to know and request additional updates when the car goes in for recall work.

 

[breeves002]

So,
Email reply from the service manager this morning says he’s going to reach out to a Ford Engineer for guidance on whether the other modules were supposed to update.

From page 1 of the document:

I guess reading all the way to paragraph 2 is NOT in the job description of Service Manager.

What the hell? Call Ford corporate and complain. It's the only way these issues will get solved is if enough people complain. Ford dealers will keep doing things wrong and Ford has NO idea they are. The warranty claim comes through and says they did it so Ford assumes they did it and that's that! Of course they could see by VIN if it wasn't all completed if they really wanted to but if they don't suspect an issue why would they look at it?

This is insane.

Tell him to go read the technical info in the 21P22 notice to dealers. It LITERALLY tells you EXACTLY what to do. My 90 year old grandmother could figure it out if I gave her the computer and plugged it into the car. That's how simple the instructions are.

I'm starting to get really angry how dealers can't be bothered to read the simple guide Ford put together to make sure they do this correctly. Neither the service advisors nor the techs care at all and it shows just how bad Fords service is for modern vehicles.

 

[Neil4Real]

What the hell? Call Ford corporate and complain. It's the only way these issues will get solved is if enough people complain. Ford dealers will keep doing things wrong and Ford has NO idea they are. The warranty claim comes through and says they did it so Ford assumes they did it and that's that! Of course they could see by VIN if it wasn't all completed if they really wanted to but if they don't suspect an issue why would they look at it?

This is insane.

Tell him to go read the technical info in the 21P22 notice to dealers. It LITERALLY tells you EXACTLY what to do. My 90 year old grandmother could figure it out if I gave her the computer and plugged it into the car. That's how simple the instructions are.

I'm starting to get really angry how dealers can't be bothered to read the simple guide Ford put together to make sure they do this correctly. Neither the service advisors nor the techs care at all and it shows just how bad Fords service is for modern vehicles.

Plus, doesn’t it say they can bill for X hours to do the updates? So if they say they do them and then don’t but bill that it is completed, isn’t that some theft or fraud?

 

[SAM]

To be fair, not all dealers are so daft, or is it deceptive (it's tough knowing which).

When I had the car in for the 21P22 SW calibration about a month ago, the tech provided a list of all the modules updated. From the list, it looked like everything listed in 21P22 was successfully updated.

Yesterday when I took it back to get the TSB 21-2310 Various Snyc4 concerns update, I asked the service manager to show me the history of updates performed from my last visit. A little awkward, but you have to be assertive.

After a wait, the service manager found me and said the tech had it in the shop and I could go back and talk to him. The tech had the car hooked up for the update and showed me the FDRS page on his computer listing modules needing updating. ABS was the only module reported updated on my last visit that was still on the list. Apparently, all the other modules were updated on my last visit.

More dealers should be open like this. Builds a "trust but verify" relationship that may help avoid misunderstandings and maybe approach that 100% customer satisfaction that they all claim to desire.

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