Brake and Accelerator Confusion

[Rocketman]

Not sure why the conversation pivoted towards 1PD. But coming back to topic, the 2nd tow guy was innovative. He lifted the back wheel and rolled it forward and then put it on a dolly. The front tire was busted so couldn’t tow it.

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[Motomax]

It was 1 PD. The first tow truck came and wanted to pull it back and on insisting they called for another. Hopefully they find a way to pull it forward without damaging the battery.

Pulling from the A arms is perfectly fine, especially if it’s in neutral. No need to freak out about it, most cars get pulled this way.

 

[Rocketman]

Pulling from the A arms is perfectly fine, especially if it’s in neutral. No need to freak out about it, most cars get pulled this way.

The problem with pulling it back was thay the battery would scrap against the curb and damage it beyond repair. Lifting the rear wheels and rolling it forward was the best option available to us.

 

[Cm12]

As the title goes, driver confused the brake and accelerator in the parking lot and car ended up bouncing in two different curbs. Hoping that the battery isn’t damaged. Waiting for the tow truck. 1600 miles and 4 weeks in.
Both Passengers were safe.

Better than expected off-road capabilities for RWD if you ask me.

 

[mmap]

Not sure I can agree. When we switched away from manual to automatic did we blame automatics for "confusion"? I agree with @jwhamlin244 that the actual pedals are the same as any other automatic transmission. 1PD just slows you more.

It seems obvious to me.... When learning 1PD you're actively trying to train yourself to *stop* using the brake pedal. Combine that with an "oh sh**" moment which triggers your "push foot hard!" reflex, and this is what you get.

Sure, not everyone is going to have that problem. But it seems easily possible for anyone (not just the elderly) to make that kind of reflexive mistake.

 

[AKgrampy]

It seems obvious to me.... When learning 1PD you're actively trying to train yourself to *stop* using the brake pedal. Combine that with an "oh sh**" moment which triggers your "push foot hard!" reflex, and this is what you get.

Sure, not everyone is going to have that problem. But it seems easily possible for anyone (not just the elderly) to make that kind of reflexive mistake.

There was someone who posted that they were having this exact issue. I know they rear ended one vehicle and can’t remember if their second event caused an accident. I can see how learning to always use one pedal may cause someone to react in this manner. I drive my Mach as much as possible but still drive an ICE so I choose to stick with 2PD. May give 1PD a try in the future though.

 

[jlauro]

Do we need a flat bed or can a regular one lift the front and get it done?

You are past this, but for future reference by anyone... Flat bed is recommended, but emergency towing up to 35mph for 50mi is possible with all 4 wheels on the ground if you can get it into emergency tow mode. Check the manual for details.

 

[ARK]

Not sure I can agree. When we switched away from manual to automatic did we blame automatics for "confusion"? I agree with @jwhamlin244 that the actual pedals are the same as any other automatic transmission. 1PD just slows you more.

In this case the accelerator HAD to be depressed, there's no car on earth where pushing an accelerator = braking. Even with 1PD, pushing it never = braking.

When I was a paramedic we would see this happen all the time with elderly people. It's just a sign that it's time to stop driving in many of those cases, but not all. I think there's a higher likelihood of someone thinking they are in reverse because of the stupid gear shit twisty thing and actually being in drive.

I think your hunch that the gear selector was involved is correct. But I do think OPD could be implicated as well because, normally, with two pedal driving, people often back up by just modulating the brake pedal and don't touch the accelerator at all. If you're backing out in say a grocery store parking lot and suddenly a person appears, you just press down on the pedal you were on, i.e., your brake pedal.

If I were to guess, the following happened:

Driver accidentally shifts to Drive instead of Reverse;

Driver, being in OPD, starts to press the accelerator thinking they are in Reverse and expecting to move backwards;

Driver freaks out that they, in fact, have started to move forward;

Driver relies on their long established two pedal driving muscle memory to slam the pedal they are on, thinking they are on the brake pedal;

Mach-E goes airborne.

Agree that being a new driver or a very seasoned driver make all this a bit more likely.

 

[Engelbert]

Love the NHTSA article. NHTSA has documented "pedal error"/"pedal misapplication" for years. Sudden acceleration cases are so often attributed (by drivers) to something being wrong with the car, when in fact it is nearly always the driver simply pushing the accelerator when they think their foot is on the brake.

When the car takes off, instinct says "I need to stop NOW. Press brake harder." So they press harder, on the wrong pedal of course, worsening the situation. There typically isn't enough time to reset that mental error and move to the actual brake pedal before hitting something or someone.

The advent of cars that electronically document the last handful of seconds before a crash finally provided empirical evidence: overwhelmingly the gas pedal was all the way down, and the brake pedal was (typically) untouched or (less commonly) partially applied while the gas pedal remained on the floor, right up to the moment of impact.

There have been some really interesting corner cases where the car's design was a contributor to the issue, but they are incredibly rare and typically bizarre.

 

[jlauro]

Not sure I can agree. When we switched away from manual to automatic did we blame automatics for "confusion"?

Yes, that was a common thing. More so 50 years ago than now, but yes that's a thing.

In this case the accelerator HAD to be depressed, there's no car on earth where pushing an accelerator = braking. Even with 1PD, pushing it never = braking.

Pushing the brake still does = braking, even in 1PD. It's a matter of meaning to push the brake and hitting the accelerator by mistake in the emergency moment. No one pushes the accelerator thinking it will = braking.

 

[Woeo]

No scientific evidence, just my belief.

At the root of a lot of the world's problems for centuries.

 

[RickMachE]

Yes, that was a common thing. More so 50 years ago than now, but yes that's a thing.


Pushing the break still does = braking, even in 1PD. It's a matter of meaning to push the break and hitting the accelerator by mistake in the emergency moment. No one pushes the accelerator thinking it will = breaking.

Besides that the words are brake and braking, you have zero idea what's in someone's head at that point of panic. Zero.

 

[Rocketman]

You are past this, but for future reference by anyone... Flat bed is recommended, but emergency towing up to 35mph for 50mi is possible with all 4 wheels on the ground if you can get it into emergency tow mode. Check the manual for details.

emergency tow mode was not possible as the front driver side tire blew out.

 

[jlauro]

Besides that the words are brake and braking, you have zero idea what's in someone's head at that point of panic. Zero.

My bad on the spell. That said, talk about hyperbole... as the study previously mentioned by someone earlier in this thread, that appears to be the case for about 16,000 crashes a year, so a fair amount more than Zero.

 

[frontrunner]

thanks for sharing. some people want to cover up their mistakes, but it helps everyone when we just admit our mistakes so others can avoid making the same ones.

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