Tesla Supercharger Question

[Maquis]

A trip of 476 miles in an SR car will require (at least) two charging stops, not one.

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[Sikkun]

I think it would be useful to look up some videos on YouTube about DC fast charging and road trip planning for the Mach E.

You seem to have some incorrect assumptions about the speed (ie only Tesla offers fast). And how it works in general.

While road tripping in the EV is perfectly doable, it is different than a gas vehicle and I wouldn’t want you to get stranded because you don’t know where you can charge or how.

PlugShare and A Better Route Planner are also useful applications to check out.

 

[luckie]

Can I use a Tesla supercharger and if so what do I need to hook it up to my 2023 Mach E? I'm planning a trip from my home in Maryland to the Adirondacks (Schroon Lake) and its 476 miles. I have the standard battery (approx 230 miles), so I'll need to stop around half way. But I don't want to include an overnight stay. So was wondering if I could use one of the Tesla supercharging stations, which would minimize my charging time to a few hours. Suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

As was mentioned by others (e.g. Sikkun), I think you will need to get into "learning mode" to better understand how EVs range is altered by high vs low speed, and how fast charging works, and how to plan a trip with the help of route planners like ABRP (app or website) and Plugshare (app or website). You also should order an adapter from A2Z today, "stateofcharge" may be a discount code you can use to drop the price to $180 or similar. I think RickMachE has a bigger discount code in his sig on all his posts. That adapter will likely take 2.5 weeks shipping AND it opens up potentially 5 times more chargers for you on your route, and ones which will be working (not broken).

You likely already know this, but, since you are new...

It's understandable that owners of their very first EV are initially under the impression that the stated range of their vehicle, as advertised, is a fixed dependable number. And think of it more like a fixed length of a rope tied to the back bumper. That this particular car will go precisely the EPA miles before it runs out of electricity and it does NOT matter how fast you drive or any other conditions, it will go 230 miles no matter what. Thus if you are planning to travel 460 miles you will have to stop midway to charge once.

Yet, this is neither true for gasoline vehicles nor electric ones. You do not wait until your gas car is driving with only one drop of fuel and than look for a gas station. And if chargers are only every 70 miles along your route you have to stop early to charge rather than being able to wait until the ideal perfect time when you are at 1% battery left.

Also, if you drive slow and gently, like grandma, on sunny warm days, you will get greater range, even 100 miles more than the EPA range, while if you drive fast and aggressively, like a NASCAR driver, in cold temperatures you get less range. Even 100 miles less than the EPA range.

The range displayed by the car is nicknamed the GOM, Guess O Meter. New owners see the range listed and of course, think "that's how far I can drive before recharging", but don't realize the GOM has no idea where or how fast you will drive today. It's like trying to predict the future.

Thus the GOM is always wrong, it is just a guess based on past driving history as to where and what speed you might drive today. Time travel is not a thing.

If you want a much more accurate prediction you must use the built-in Navigation and tell it where you are going. If your car has the newest software the car will even display "updating range prediction" and show you the more accurate prediction.

 

[Fremont Kid]

All GREAT additional comments. Do not despair. You would have the same learning curve with all other EVs that use CCS.

 

[bbulkow]

Thanks. Late July. So it sounds like I cannot use that option. So how long would it take at a regular charging station

Sigh. There is no such thing as a "regular" charging station.

There are two types. Level 2 and Level 3, aka AC charging or home charging or destination charging (L2) vs DC charging, fast charging, super charging, CCS charging (L3). These are the many names. Around here we tend to say L2 for the the first kind, and DCFC (DC Fast Charging) for the second kind.

The first kind, L2, provides between 6kw and 10kw of power. Kilowatts. To make it simple, a full charge (10% to 90%) is a bunch of hours. Like 8. Think overnight.

The second kind, DCFC / Supercharging, supplies between 50kw and 100kw, and gets you a full charge in, let's say, around an hour (25 to 45 minutes depending on a bunch of factors). Usually, you'll want to not do *full* charges so the time is less - although fooling with payments and apps and maybe even waiting for a stall to open means maybe an hour all told isn't unreasonable (untill you get used to finding stations & paying & detecting bad chargers).

These are the two categories. Neither is "regular".

Obviously, on a road trip, you kinda need DCFC / Super charging during the day at least once, and if you're overnight try to get an L2 near where you're staying.

Providers of DCFC include EA (Electrify America), EVGo, Blink, Chargepoint, Flow, others. Your best way to find them is a phone app called "PlugShare" (there are a ton of other ways, I'm trying to simplify). While some stations will have a credit card reader, for some you might have to install an app and use it (either because that's how it works, or because the credit card thing is busted. They seem more fragile than the ones in gas pumps). No adapter is required, these support the same adapter as on your car (CCS). They will have cables long enough.

Alternately, since it's a Ford, you can use Tesla Supercharger stations. This is trickier because while some stations have something called a "magic dock" and don't require an adapter and have longer cables, most will require an adapter and the cables are short requiring some parking skill and possibly negotiation with other users if the station is full or nearly full. Some other Supercharger stations - even with an adapter - are unavailable to us, mostly because they're running older, incompatible hardware. You can read up on all this, and many apps now have good filters (PlugShare has a "don't display Tesla only" button in its filters so you can see just the ones you can use). No Tesla stations take credit cards, so you need an account & credit card on file with either Ford (Blue Oval Charging Network), or Tesla and use the Tesla app. On the other hand, all these chargers are 250kw chargers so you don't have to worry about avoiding 50kw chargers, and Tesla stations tend to have quite a few stalls (although there are also more Teslas on the road...), and no credit card readers means no *broken* credit card readers

You can get an adapter (NACS to CCS, not NACS to J1772) for approx $200 from A2Z by late July, very likely. The only two reputable makers are A2Z and Lectron, scammers are starting to show up on Amazon, don't trust their plugs. A2Z is shipping in two weeks, and ship from Ontario. You might want to splurge on rush shipping. Lectron has claimed they have adapters in stock, but there's less known about their shipping times. The A2Z adapters are very solid and well built, likely safer even than the Ford/Tesla made adapters, but have this finicky slide on the bottom that takes getting used to. Posts on that too - I'm a recent A2Z owner and was very frustrated myself till I figured it out.

Your easy button - and I think you want an easy button - is to stick with CCS rapid charge stations like EA and EVGo and Flow etc etc. Just look them up in either the Ford navigation map (filter by fast charge, there's a friendly button) in the car, or Google Maps in Android Auto, or Plug Share as mentioned - just tell it to only give you "CCS plug" when it asks you your plug type (or rapid charge in the nav apps). Plug Share will do a pretty good job steering you away from broken stations. It's common to monitor for stations that are charging slowly (would take two hours maybe) and switch chargers, and know the exact charging speeds of different chargers (some 50kw chargers will charge a MachE at 38kw which would take closer to two hours to get a charge - 350kw chargers will take more like 35 to 40 minutes, reliably). Each app to find chargers has strengths and weaknesses at the moment, you might try a few to see which one works best for you.

PLAN AHEAD. Everything you read about doing even a modest road trip in an EV right now says "PLAN AHEAD". While NY has a fair number of chargers, there's also some big dead spots upstate, and you don't want to be the guy calling for a tow (yes, you should look up how to get a tow if you're out of power, that's part of planning ahead ).

I would also advise, based on your post, that you don't want to arrive empty, unless you are 100% certain there is a L2 charger available where you are going. ( I didn't mention, Tesla "destination chargers" are L2 speed and require a *different* adapter - Tesla to J1772 - which is easily available on Amazon etc but are needed! They can't be used for DCFC, and DCFC chargers can't be used for L2). Speed of this is overnight like any L2 charger. My experience attempting to use a Tesla Destination charger is it was all full all the time, and I had to go to my backup plan on a road trip.

Charging off a regular home 110v outlet takes *days* (supplies approx 1.5kw so closer to 48 to 72 hours to fill). This is called "Level 1". And make sure you're carrying the right charging equipment (your model might or might not have a ford-supplied charger included) and the 110v plug and possibly a good extension cord (not one of those skinny lamp ones - and if you're in a pinch, try it but touch it frequently - if it's hot (beyond warm) to the touch unplug immediately!) If you are going to a cabin somewhere for a week, it might be an option, but again, you don't want to get stranded. I could imagine a cabin with dodgy electric service and plugging in the car to charge burns out a fuse (yes, there are fuses in some places) and not having a spare fuse, or being at a rental and not having access to the breaker box. So make a plan to get away from wherever you are going to a DCFC charge with good "PlugShare" score and arrive with some buffer. Remember PLAN AHEAD? PLAN ahead.

Good luck, it's not as bad as it seems. Come back in 2 years when all this about plugs and adapters and apps is sorted out, this wacky world of formats will seem like a distant (bad) dream....

 

[garyd9]

Good luck, it's not as bad as it seems. Come back in 2 years when all this about plugs and adapters and apps is sorted out, this wacky world of formats will seem like a distant (bad) dream....

Wow, that message made me realize how convoluted charging is.

IMO, the most annoying part about L3 charging is the multiple different mechanisms used to pay. Some companies have tried to simplify (such as Ford's Plug and Charge and "blue oval" network), but all they really accomplish is to create yet another way to pay.

Eventually, you'll have too many different apps on your phone to handle charging. On mine, I have apps for EVgo, Electrify America, ChargePoint and Blink Charging. There's also the Tesla app (but I don't have an adapter yet, so haven't installed that.)

Of all of them, the most useful app is "PlugShare." You can't pay for charging with PlugShare, but it's useful for determining if a charger works - BEFORE you drive to it. The data is crowdsourced, so when you charge at a DCFC, you contribute back to Plugshare by adding a comment mentioning that the charger worked for you and any other info you care to provide.

 

[HuntingPudel]

OK where do I get an adapter from and how do I enroll in the Plug and Charge. Assuming I can do all this, do I just pull up to a Tesla charging station and hook it up. At 250kW how long would it take to charge?

The standard battery charges somewhere around 85KW (peak rate around 115). The reason 250KW Tesla chargers was pointed out is that Tesla SuperChargers with a lower rating are older hardware and are incompatible with non-Tesla cars. The higher-output chargers are also known as V3 units. Tesla began rolling out V4 units in North America last year. Note that some of the V3 units are also incompatible with non-Tesla cars. The only way to be positive that a SuperCharger is compatible is to verify using Tesla’s web site (or the Tesla app for your phone) if you do not have the Public Charging app in your car. ??

Definitely acquaint yourself with A Better Route Planner (ABRP) and PlugShare. They are great resources for finding chargers. ABRP can also plan out your stops for charging. I also use the ChargeHub app (not as useful as the other two, but it’s a good third app to use as a backstop). Once you have figured out where you will be charging, download the apps for each of the brands of charging stations you will be using and set up accounts with them. Don’t trust that their credit card readers will be functioning. ??

 

[bshaw]

The A2Z adapters are very solid and well built, likely safer even than the Ford/Tesla made adapters

Do you have any evidence to support this claim?

If anything, I would suggest the A2Z ones are *lower quality* because people have reported the adapter is tight fitting and very difficult to get fully seated. Probably a manufacturing / quality control issue, and A2Z is no doubt trying to crank out as many units as possible right now.

 

[VaporTrails]

Thanks. Late July. So it sounds like I cannot use that option. So how long would it take at a regular charging station

I strongly encourage you to try fast charging at least once before your trip. Your first charge could involve some calls to work through account issues. It works great when it works. It is not always simple like plugging into your EVSE at home because there is money involved.

 

[RickMachE]

Do you have any evidence to support this claim?

If anything, I would suggest the A2Z ones are *lower quality* because people have reported the adapter is tight fitting and very difficult to get fully seated. Probably a manufacturing / quality control issue, and A2Z is no doubt trying to crank out as many units as possible right now.

So you question his statement about quality, and then you go and make an unsubstantiated statement about quality?

 

[bshaw]

So you question his statement about quality, and then you go and make an unsubstantiated statement about quality?

No. People have *definitely* reported issues getting the A2Z adapter fully seated. I would say that is an issue with quality.

 

[uclavic]

No. People have *definitely* reported issues getting the A2Z adapter fully seated. I would say that is an issue with quality.

The only time I have an issue with the A2Z chaging adapter is when I don't have the lock fully engaged. If I get the orange ring I unplug and reseat and re-engage the locking mechanism. I've never had a charging session not go off without a hitch after that. It takes a little while to get the hang of it.

 

[Schmedlack]

Tesla Supercharger will get you charged in minutes not hours.
Are there no CCS chargers available on your route?

These are all the non-tesla chargers available that will charge your car to 80% in 30-40 minutes.

Tesla Supercharger will get you charged in minutes not hours.
Are there no CCS chargers available on your route?

These are all the non-tesla chargers available that will charge your car to 80% in 30-40 minutes.

I'm with you. Before the Tesla deal I have made trips from Maryland to Upstate NY, mainly Saratoga Springs. First, use I-81 for your main North-South travel (No I-95). I have never had a problem.

Tesla Supercharger will get you charged in minutes not hours.
Are there no CCS chargers available on your route?

These are all the non-tesla chargers available that will charge your car to 80% in 30-40 minutes.

You may not need an adapter. I have made a similar trip from Maryland to Saratoga Springs NY. No problems with charging CCS 150kW. Do not use I-95! Your charging stops could include some (not all) of the ones below:

1. Allentown, PA
2. Scranton, PA
3. Binghamton, NY
4. Oneonta, NY
5. Albany, NY
6. Saratoga Springs, NY
7. According to PlugShare, there should also be charging near your destination, too.

I planned my trip to charge before I could possibly run out of charge, and you can do it, too. One note - the locations with Evolve NY branded chargers are the same as EA.

So my friend, planning is everything. I kind of feel like a Trail Boss in the Old West. I need to know where everything is - in advence.

 

[sockmeister]

Can I use a Tesla supercharger and if so what do I need to hook it up to my 2023 Mach E? I'm planning a trip from my home in Maryland to the Adirondacks (Schroon Lake) and its 476 miles. I have the standard battery (approx 230 miles), so I'll need to stop around half way. But I don't want to include an overnight stay. So was wondering if I could use one of the Tesla supercharging stations, which would minimize my charging time to a few hours. Suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

OP, Try using A Better Route Planner. Here's your trip mapped out if you're avoiding Tesla Superchargers. Note that your car will natively charge at non-tesla "Superchargers", such as Electrify America, at the same speed, so I think there's a misunderstanding there.
https://abetterrouteplanner.com/?plan_uuid=bca2f676-197c-4e5a-a936-f171157aea96

 

[Herbknowsit]

Do you have any evidence to support this claim?

If anything, I would suggest the A2Z ones are *lower quality* because people have reported the adapter is tight fitting and very difficult to get fully seated. Probably a manufacturing / quality control issue, and A2Z is no doubt trying to crank out as many units as possible right now.

The last thing you want is to have an adapter begin to be sloppy and eventually not work for you. Yeah the A2Z is a bear to break in but after a few efforts seating it, and after reading some of the tips on this forum, you'll find it flat out works. The best advice as per other posters is to practice at a fast charger station locally before you head out on a trip.

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