Power Cap in The Real World

[Mach1E]

Hey folks. I had the pleasure of test driving a Cyber Orange (lovely color) GT at a nearby Ford this past weekend. I was really hoping to fall in love with the GT because I have been thinking about upgrading from my X4 Premium if I could find a deal and leverage my equity/this crazy used car market. However, I gotta say, I wasn't overly blown away by the difference in performance between my car and the GT.... part of that was due to experiencing the power cap as soon as I powered on the car.

I have only just learned about the power cap recently and how it occurs when certain electrical conditions have been meant, but I am wondering how often GT/GTPE owners have been experiencing the cap in the real world. It was very disconcerting to me that the power cap was enabled as soon as I fired up the car. I confirmed that the car had not even been driven that day, so its not like I stepped inside to test drive right after someone was flogging it. It was about 18 degrees out when I tested it, so I am not sure if the lower temps had something to do with it.

I love the way the GT looks, and I love my current X4 Premium, but I feel like for a lot of people, the lack of consistency in peak performance makes spending $7k+ a tough sell.

GT owners, how often do you see the grey bars of doom? Does it truly take away from the ownership experience?

In Florida today was the first time I’ve had bars upon startup (one bar and it was in the low 40s this morning, no preconditioning).

Without the bars, the GT is so much faster it’s silly. Check out the video posted today. The GT pulls like 6 car lengths by 80 mph.

https://www.macheforum.com/site/thr...o-head-drag-raced-why-because-race-car.14013/

See that little orange car in the distance? Yeah it was racing a 1st edition from a dig (4X ER).

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[Matt Bagne]

I'm in SoCal (50s @ nite) and have never seen these bars in daily driving. Same for hwy speeds @ 80mph or jack rabbit starts on city streets. I'm VERY happy with the performance of my GT (not PE) in daily driving.

Yes, I too live in SoCal and very happy about it . . . so many threads with MME owners decrying cold weather that saps their batteries, not only for power but for range. Warmer weather seems to make a huge difference!

 

[DevSecOps]

Sounds like the GT is a no brainer for folks out in the warmer climates! No power cap bars at all is pretty impressive.

That guy must need glasses or drives his GT like my 92 yo grandmother. There's grey bars/power caps no matter the temp. There's additional grey bars for it being extra cold.

Here's a summary of grey bars regardless of temp:

• Hard acceleration for 5 seconds immediately pulls 5-7 bars
• > 70 mph = 2 bars
• > 80 mph = 3 bars
• After DCFC ~ 7 bars for for 5-10 minutes
• < 60 SOC = 1 bar
• < 50 SOC = 2 bars etc etc

In cold climates it's worse, but I believe it's mostly under 40 degrees as I rarely see any in the morning at 35-45 degrees.

 

[Mathington]

That guy must need glasses or drives his GT like my 92 yo grandmother. There's grey bars/power caps no matter the temp. There's additional grey bars for it being extra cold.

Here's a summary of grey bars regardless of temp:

• Hard acceleration for 5 seconds immediately pulls 5-7 bars
• > 70 mph = 2 bars
• > 80 mph = 3 bars
• After DCFC ~ 7 bars for for 5-10 minutes
• < 60 SOC = 1 bar
• < 50 SOC = 2 bars etc etc

In cold climates it's worse, but I believe it's mostly under 40 degrees as I rarely see any in the morning at 35-45 degrees.

Wow, so you basically always have the grey bars and limited power under most situations? This is a really bad problem for managing thermals and other components. I really would like to have the little meter on the my premium AWD as I’m curious how much I am being limited.

 

[DevSecOps]

Wow, so you basically always have the grey bars and limited power under most situations? This is a really bad problem for managing thermals and other components. I really would like to have the little meter on the my premium AWD as I’m curious how much I am being limited.

On this forum you'll generally see two complaints regarding power limiting aside from the cold climate posts.

If you drive mostly in the city at higher SOC then you'll only notice power limiting during hard acceleration. In general however you wouldn't get any limiting because of the lower speed and higher SOC.

If you drive a lot of highway at higher speeds, and eventually lower SOC, then you'll be frustrated by the accompanying power limitations for speed, SOC and possibly post DCFC.

 

[Frankie]

Hey folks. I had the pleasure of test driving a Cyber Orange (lovely color) GT at a nearby Ford this past weekend. I was really hoping to fall in love with the GT because I have been thinking about upgrading from my X4 Premium if I could find a deal and leverage my equity/this crazy used car market. However, I gotta say, I wasn't overly blown away by the difference in performance between my car and the GT.... part of that was due to experiencing the power cap as soon as I powered on the car.

I have only just learned about the power cap recently and how it occurs when certain electrical conditions have been meant, but I am wondering how often GT/GTPE owners have been experiencing the cap in the real world. It was very disconcerting to me that the power cap was enabled as soon as I fired up the car. I confirmed that the car had not even been driven that day, so its not like I stepped inside to test drive right after someone was flogging it. It was about 18 degrees out when I tested it, so I am not sure if the lower temps had something to do with it.

I love the way the GT looks, and I love my current X4 Premium, but I feel like for a lot of people, the lack of consistency in peak performance makes spending $7k+ a tough sell.

GT owners, how often do you see the grey bars of doom? Does it truly take away from the ownership experience?

You'll feel the power cap every single time you floor it past 50 or so. The GT is a great car if you're never going to go past 50 mph.

 

[breeves002]

Here's the worst I've seen. 26 bars. Was about 20ºF I think and very low SoC. I made it home right when I took that pic. The car was SOOOO slow.

 

[dtbaker61]

Here's the worst I've seen. 26 bars. Was about 20ºF I think and very low SoC. I made it home right when I took that pic. The car was SOOOO slow.

so..... what do you expect when the HV is at 7% ? The MME is just trying to get you to the next charger as efficiently as possible... which is SLLLLOOOOOOWLY

 

[shoopla]

Personally, the caps only bothered me maybe twice. Both times on the highway over 75, and could have used a little more passing power to get around traffic before an exit. My old 6.2L Charger would have given me the power, but I was also getting 12 mpg with that car and $100 in oil and filter costs even when I changed it myself plus all the other joys of a large ICE.
As for the bars, as everyone said, it's situationally dependent on temperature, charge state, and speed. I've seen none at 90 percent when it's 50 degrees, and as many as 7 on the highway at 70mph, or without preconditioning when it's 30 degrees. Too many scenarios to list. Would I prefer no bars and with the same battery warranty? Absolutely, who wouldn't? The technology isn't there yet at this price point.
But that said, still love the GTPE and glad I bought it for what I wanted... Fun commute, no gas, build quality, the performance I required, and looks. For some, the 5 seconds is a deal breaker based on their usage. I'd say if it is, don't get a GT or GTPE, save some money and buy a used GT350 and some extra tires and lots of gas. Or spend more money and get a Tesla that may be missing some parts. Or spend even more and get a lucid. For me this was the best of everything

 

[breeves002]

so..... what do you expect when the HV is at 7% ? The MME is just trying to get you to the next charger as efficiently as possible... which is SLLLLOOOOOOWLY

I didn't expect anything more. Just showing what I saw. I don't think it is about efficiency though I think it is HVB temp being low making it limit current to keep the voltages from dropping too low.

 

[dtbaker61]

I didn't expect anything more. Just showing what I saw. I don't think it is about efficiency though I think it is HVB temp being low making it limit current to keep the voltages from dropping too low.

yup, the combination of low SOC and low temp is a killer since the battery loop heater cuts out when HV SOC falls below.... 15% I think? as battery core temp drops, voltage drop under load would get worse, combined with the voltage drop that naturally occurs below about 15% SOC with lithium batteries.

 

[Kevin P]

Here's the worst I've seen. 26 bars. Was about 20ºF I think and very low SoC. I made it home right when I took that pic. The car was SOOOO slow.

I think it is important to note that the "regular" non-GT models are doing something similar in those circumstances. There is just no gauge to show you.

 

[Thor2j]

You'll feel the power cap every single time you floor it past 50 or so. The GT is a great car if you're never going to go past 50 mph.

It's not 50, more like 70 plus before it pulls power.

 

[Neil4Real]

I think it is important to note that the "regular" non-GT models are doing something similar in those circumstances. There is just no gauge to show you.

I would be curious what kind of limits they really do put on non-GT models. It seems that the GT/GTPE gets outstripped by other MME models after you hit your 5 second limit... that's the weird part.

 

[Frankie]

Would I prefer no bars and with the same battery warranty? Absolutely, who wouldn't? The technology isn't there yet at this price point.

Tesla MYPs start at 64k.

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