Do you think it’s likely that the 5 second acceleration limit will change?

[Bueller]

Since the limit kicks in at 72 mph…….. it happens before you even start that experiment.

You can see it in terms of grey bars on the power meter. Cruising at 80 you’ll have 3-4 minimum even at full charge and warm weather.

I even tested the 72 mph on a tall bridge, was under that speed at the top, put the car in neutral, gravity accelerated to 72 mph and the first gray bar showed up. It’s definitely a programmed in hard limit.

Sorry, I don’t understand your reply. If I’m doing 70 and floor it, how fast will the car be moving when the limitation sets in?

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[Mach1E]

Sorry, I don’t understand your reply. If I’m doing 70 and floor it, how fast will the car be moving when the limitation sets in?

72 mph.

Power gets limited no matter what above 72 mph.

The limit is also a sliding scale, as shown by grey bars on the power meter. The faster you go, the more power gets pulled.

 

[buzznwood]

Yup.

Possibly the saddest part is it could be fixed by adding a few more temp sensors and have the power limited by actual thermal feedback rather than some arbitrary hard coded limits.

Literally every other performance aspect of this car is no short of amazing.

Handling, braking, low end acceleration…….. all among the fastest SUVs ever built!

For example, compare my 2021 GTPE to two of the best performing SUVs on the planet-

2021 Mercedes GLE63 S and 2021 BMW X5 M competition.

I beat both to 60 mph.
I pull more G on the skidpad (despite having worse tires)
And I stop in a shorter distance (60-0, also with worse tires)
They both cost around $115k.

Give me some top end acceleration and it’s game over.

But our Achilles heel is the only thing any review talks about.

And it doesn’t make sense. It’s done out of an over abundance of caution, that makes people who bought the GTPE furious that the spent this much on a car that is basically pointlessly neutered.

It makes folks like me who care about performance wonder why Ford would market a car like this, that doesn’t even come close to fulfilling the hype.

Don’t get me wrong, it’s a great daily driver, but so is the MME Select AWD, so is the Premium, so are a lot of EVs. The GTPE is supposed to be about performance, and it’s a disappointment in that regard. Ford could have done better, and if they can’t make the car do 8+ seconds of full power…well, you lost me for the next EV, and the next, and the next.

What makes the sub par performance more disappointing is that the party piece of a BEV really is the straight line acceleration so should have been the easy bit for the engineers to get right, not all manufactures jumped on the straight line performance band wagon, others have kept similar performance figures to existing ICE vehicles but Ford did and unfortunately the engineers appear to have jumped and missed by a long shot.

I have a soft spot for performance Fords having owned plenty, not all have been good with some being major disappointments (looking at you focus RS) but you would think for the first attempt at a performance BEV the would have made and effort rather than fail miserably. Ignore the performance and the GTPE is a fine daily but that is not what is was initially marketed as, still at least that has been dialed back now so better late than never.

It is a shame as the potential is still there, top speed and charging time aside appropriate fixes to the power limitations, improvements to the steering and suspension, some better brakes along with a more appropriate wheel and tire package, it could be top of the class rather than the bottom like it is now.

I am one of the few that got the GTPE due to it being the only trim to offer magnaride so the performance aspect was a bonus, but I still paid a premium for that added performance that just isn't there. Maybe Ford will get its act together in the future but based on the current progress so far it is hard to see it.

 

[Mach1E]

It is a shame as the potential is still there, top speed and charging time aside appropriate fixes to the power limitations, improvements to the steering and suspension, some better brakes along with a more appropriate wheel and tire package, it could be top of the class rather than the bottom like it is now.

This part of your comment I don’t understand.

In terms of braking and handling, it IS top of the class. Not just in terms of BEVs, but All SUVs (as of 2021 when it came out).

In fact in 2021, there was only 1 single SUV on the planet that beat our .99 G on the skidpad-

The Lamborghini URUS.

Source-
https://www.edmunds.com/amp/car-news/track-tested-2022-ford-mustang-mach-e-gt.html

And give us the same tires we might even beat it!
https://www.motortrend.com/features/best-handling-suvs-and-crossovers/amp/

“Sorting our database for model years 2018 to now, only 14 out of 231 SUVs we've tested are capable of cornering at 0.90 g's or more (0.6 percent).”


Best-Handling SUVs By Maximum Grip

Vehicle	Lateral g
Lamborghini Urus	1.01
Porsche Cayenne Turbo	0.98
Mercedes-AMG GLC 63S 4Matic+ Coupe	0.96
BMW X3 M Competition	0.95
Porsche Cayenne	0.95
Porsche Macan S	0.94
BMW X2 xDrive28i	0.94
Mercedes-AMG GLE 63S 4Matic+	0.93
Alfa Romeo Stelvio Q4 (Quadrifoglio)	0.93
Bentley Bentayga Speed	0.93
Jaguar I-Pace EV400 First Edition	0.93
Volvo XC60 Polestar	0.92
BMW X2 xDrive 28i	0.92
Jeep Grand Cherokee Trackhawk	0.9

 

[Glen Boise]

The question is why there is a limit? Could it be that they are protecting the motor from tearing itself apart at the higher speeds? Centrifugal forces, of something spinning at very high speeds, like your motor experiences at very high speeds, are quite powerful, after all. Do not the more expensive, faster cars have a multi-speed transmissions for just that purpose?

 

[Mach1E]

The question is why there is a limit? Could it be that they are protecting the motor from tearing itself apart at the higher speeds? Centrifugal forces, of something spinning at very high speeds, like your motor experiences at very high speeds, are quite powerful, after all. Do not the more expensive, faster cars have a multi-speed transmissions for just that purpose?

It’s not that.

That would be a “why do we have a 124 mph top speed” question.

The 5 seconds is about acceleration, not top speed.

 

[Scooby24]

Given the fragility of the HVBJB and how quickly it can fail when not even at the limit, I suspect there should have been some active cooling of the relays....any and everything that could get hot enough to weld contactors shut with too much power draw over too much time should have active cooling, IMO.

I don't think there's anything that can be done to eliminate the restriction from their end without physical hardware changes.

 

[0t60-3.5]

72 mph.

Power gets limited no matter what above 72 mph.

The limit is also a sliding scale, as shown by grey bars on the power meter. The faster you go, the more power gets pulled.

Snapshot from video - doing 116mph with blurred view of the 4-5 grey bars on the power meter. I'm not sure I'd say a sliding scale, if lighten up on power, grey bars will reduce. I got up to this speed in just under 4/10ths of a mile.

 

[Mach1E]

Snapshot from video - doing 116mph with blurred view of the 4-5 grey bars on the power meter. I'm not sure I'd say a sliding scale, if lighten up on power, grey bars will reduce. I got up to this speed in just under 4/10ths of a mile.

It’s definitely a sliding scale.

The faster you go, the more you accelerate, the more the temp changes, the lower your state of charge……… the more grey bars you get.

Speed is just 1 of the variables that impact it.

Like you said, “if lighten up on power, grey bars will reduce.” That’s the sliding scale I’m referring to.

On a a related note, with no power reduction, we should hit that speed in 1/4 mile……. Not 4/10th.

 

[Thor2j]

Yup.

Possibly the saddest part is it could be fixed by adding a few more temp sensors and have the power limited by actual thermal feedback rather than some arbitrary hard coded limits.

Literally every other performance aspect of this car is no short of amazing.

Handling, braking, low end acceleration…….. all among the fastest SUVs ever built!

For example, compare my 2021 GTPE to two of the best performing SUVs on the planet-

2021 Mercedes GLE63 S and 2021 BMW X5 M competition.

I beat both to 60 mph.
I pull more G on the skidpad (despite having worse tires)
And I stop in a shorter distance (60-0, also with worse tires)
They both cost around $115k.

Give me some top end acceleration and it’s game over.

But our Achilles heel is the only thing any review talks about.

Actually MB is 3.4 sec and if you add the more performance oriented x3m it's 3.2. Beyond 0-60, these 2 will obliterate the mach e.

 

[Bueller]

72 mph.

Power gets limited no matter what above 72 mph.

The limit is also a sliding scale, as shown by grey bars on the power meter. The faster you go, the more power gets pulled.

I have never experienced what you’re describing in my GT and I’ve punched the car many, many times while driving over 75. The outcome is 100 mph plus is rapid succession.

 

[Kevin P]

I have never experienced what you’re describing in my GT and I’ve punched the car many, many times while driving over 75. The outcome is 100 mph plus is rapid succession.

Well, unless you have a magic 1 of 1 GT build, you have absolutely experienced it, you just haven't noticed for whatever reason or another. It takes something like 8-9 seconds for a GT to go from 60mph to 100mph. It should take ~5. If you have ever owned a high-horsepower car, its really obvious how the GT acceleration slows down rapidly as speed increases. Its not "sloooooow" but its much much slower than its competitors at highway speeds. In fact, from about 80mph on up, testing seems to indicate that it no faster than a Premium AWD Mach-E, and may be a bit slower...

At this point, I am not sure why those of us who know bother to keep trying to educate those who don't. Its the same argument and information over and over and over.....

 

[dtbaker61]

Yup.

Possibly the saddest part is it could be fixed by adding a few more temp sensors and have the power limited by actual thermal feedback rather than some arbitrary hard coded limits.

exactly.....
.... and offering a 'race mod package' designed to optimize cooling would take it a step further for people who would be willing to sacrifice cold-weather range

addl temp sensors, software changes to watch actual sensor temps, modified cooling lines with more 'chiller plates' under items prone to overheat, and battery tray internal thermal bridges to bottom pan with cooling fins..... you could WOT/regen to heart's delight without thermal problems or limits.

 

[Mach1E]

Actually MB is 3.4 sec and if you add the more performance oriented x3m it's 3.2. Beyond 0-60, these 2 will obliterate the mach e.

Ah, it seems real world testing did hit 3.4 (better than the 3.7 Mercedes claims).

But either way, my point stands…… we are in great company with certain performance metrics. (0-60, skidpad and braking).

But yes, many cars obliterate us beyond 60. Pretty much the whole point of this thread.

 

[Mach1E]

exactly.....
.... and offering a 'race mod package' designed to optimize cooling would take it a step further for people who would be willing to sacrifice cold-weather range

addl temp sensors, software changes to watch actual sensor temps, modified cooling lines with more 'chiller plates' under items prone to overheat, and battery tray internal thermal bridges to bottom pan with cooling fins..... you could WOT/regen to heart's delight without thermal problems or limits.

Sign me up!

People spend thousands of dollars on performance mods for ICE vehicles. And those same people are now buying BEVs.

The manufacturers and aftermarket are leaving $$ on the table not developing this stuff. Unless they’re just planning on closing down their businesses in the next decade, the aftermarket people need to get to development.

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