5 second limit explained?

[Ghost Ryder]

The way they put it is for road track so you can keep driving it spirited without it melting. "By lowing peak power". That sounds very much like "Instead of it totally falling over on it's side instantly, you can keep chasing Miatas for the other 19 minutes and 55 seconds of track time."

You think the GTPE would last 20 mins even with reduced power under track conditions? It would be lucky to last 5 mins.

And by lowering power, it was just 5-10%, they took it all the way down to below premium 4x level. Essentially, they should of just called it Premium 4x mode. Would of made more sense.

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[HuntingPudel]

I would be interested in a few things...
1. How many Mustang GTPE's sold in 2022 and 2023
2. How many of them were returned, due to the 5 second limitation

Really wondering how many owners/past owners, are furious with what Ford has done here. Merely curious...

I knew about the limit before my 2021 was delivered and I blindly hoped that Ford’s implied promise of being able to track the car would come true. I took delivery of the car. I am still waiting for Ford to make good on the implied track-readiness, but I am for sure not holding my breath on it. Very few got rid of their GTs due to the limit, but many dumped theirs due to the HVBJB. ?‍?

 

[HuntingPudel]

In 2022, there was just a big shortage of cars especially EVs due to "supply chain/covid." People waited 6 months to get a car and many paid dealer markups. When I put in my order the power limit was not known yet. I could have canceled my order once I found out, but then I would have been back in line waiting for another EV like the BMW i4. Had I known, I would have reserved an i4 from the get-go.

On the forum, we knew about the limit shortly after the first world-wide delivery of a GT-PE happened in 2021. @0t60-3.5 reported his track runs within the first week. That was months before I took delivery of my 2021. The general automotive press even started to bust Ford’s chops about it before I got my car. Ford simply ignored everyone. ?‍?

 

[Mach1E]

Actually I think it was marketed as slightly faster 0-60, plus Magneride. I don’t think it was marketed as “highest performing EV in all conditions”.

The only thing I think Ford did that could be construed as maybe misleading is describing the drive mode above “unbridled” as for the track. Otherwise they were pretty clear in what this thing is.

I have had 10 Fords incl 3 gas Mustangs. I have taken one of them around laguna seca. MUSTANGS AREN’T TRACK CARS! They are not the highest performing things out there! They are good looking cost effective Everyman muscle cars that go fast in a straight line.

They did more than mislead…….

Every piece of marketing for the GT bragged about acceleration.

First video? A GTPE driving on a track with the tagline “so fast it made me sick.”

First press event? Yeah, it was at an auto cross course.

Pretty much everything was presented to make us think this car was a track monster.

And not 1 mention of any power limitations.

Only TWICE has Ford ever even acknowledged it.

1. Months and months later buried deep in the FAQs did they say power was limited after 5 seconds, and they have since removed that from Ford.com

2. in the recent interview saying “we will change that limit” via OTA.

 

[BigMach-E]

I was talking about my Honda Odyssey Minivan

I know, I am saying the GTPE ain’t it.

 

[67 Stang Convertible]

I'm a 21' owner (Premium) and have heard about the 5 sec. limit for years. And like a lot of us thought it was limited to those that wanted to go to the track. But to hear it affects them on the highway passing at high speeds; that really stinks.

Due to the HJVB; I doubt Ford will ever change the existing cars. Hopefully they can re-engineer the new GT's. But they are not going to risk a bunch of HJVB failures that will cost them money to replace. This is corporate America, shareholders and bottom lines prevail. The same reason I "snickered" when 1/2 the forum thought they were getting free "Tesla Adapters" just from the phrasing of Jim Farley's linguistics. That one still makes me laugh.......Anyway guys don't wait on an OTA (in my Opinion).

 

[Thor2j]

I'm a 21' owner (Premium) and have heard about the 5 sec. limit for years. And like a lot of us thought it was limited to those that wanted to go to the track. But to hear it affects them on the highway passing at high speeds; that really stinks.

Due to the HJVB; I doubt Ford will ever change the existing cars. Hopefully they can re-engineer the new GT's. But they are not going to risk a bunch of HJVB failures that will cost them money to replace. This is corporate America, shareholders and bottom lines prevail. The same reason I "snickered" when 1/2 the forum thought they were getting free "Tesla Adapters" just from the phrasing of Jim Farley's linguistics. That one still makes me laugh.......Anyway guys don't wait on an OTA (in my Opinion).

One has nothing to do with the other. You realize all models are effected by the hvjb . The base model only draws around 450amp, how could that ever fail when the GT is drawing 990amps. Not related.

 

[67 Stang Convertible]

One has nothing to do with the other. You realize all models are effected by the hvjb . The base model only draws around 450amp, how could that ever fail when the GT is drawing 990amps. Not related.

We will agree to disagree. I've got a pint of ale as they say on the other side of the pond, on the bet the 21-23's are never released on the 5 sec. limit. You in???

 

[Mach1E]

We will agree to disagree. I've got a pint of ale as they say on the other side of the pond, on the bet the 21-23's are never released on the 5 sec. limit. You in???

Seems like an easy bet. If they change it, Thor gets a beer. If they don’t, Thor just gets to say….. coming soon*. ?

The only way they don’t release it is if Ford somehow changes their minds. And the HVJB? Known issue, that’s not gonna be enough to change their minds.

Literally the only time Ford has openly acknowledged the limit is to say they’ll change it.

They’ve done years of “extensive testing” to be able to change it.

They’ve even held focus groups about how to best release the change.

That’s a whole lot of work to just kill that project. And you think they will kill it NOW because of a known issue? They’ve had the HVJB info for a long time now. And STILL say they’ll change the limit.

 

[67 Stang Convertible]

Seems like an easy bet. If they change it, Thor gets a beer. If they don’t, Thor just gets to say….. coming soon*. ?

The only way they don’t release it is if Ford somehow changes their minds. And the HVJB? Known issue, that’s not gonna be enough to change their minds.

Literally the only time Ford has openly acknowledged the limit is to say they’ll change it.

They’ve done years of “extensive testing” to be able to change it.

They’ve even held focus groups about how to best release the change.

That’s a whole lot of work to just kill that project. And you think they will kill it NOW because of a known issue? They’ve had the HVJB info for a long time now. And STILL say they’ll change the limit.

Yes, they know about it but have not had to pay to replace the ones that has NOT failed. My assumption is you will see a large increase of failures if they released the 5 sec limit and Ford does not want to pay to replace these.

 

[Mach1E]

Yes, they know about it but have not had to pay to replace the ones that has NOT failed. My assumption is you will see a large increase of failures if they released the 5 sec limit and Ford does not want to pay to replace these.

Maybe. But they already know that info (if failures will increase) and seem to be moving forward anyways.

They said they’ve done the testing. They have that info and we don’t.

So maybe 10 seconds vs 5 seconds…… doesn’t really change the failure rate.

We know (from the people who have TRIED to kill their HVJB) that you can’t just make it fail by DC charging and driving hard.

 

[HuntingPudel]

We will agree to disagree. I've got a pint of ale as they say on the other side of the pond, on the bet the 21-23's are never released on the 5 sec. limit. You in???

I will take Ford at their word that production cars will eventually get the easing of the limit. I am unsure as whether Ford will actually create and make software available for the ‘21-‘23 cars. I am willing to bet that an OTA will either take a stupidly long time or never be released (based on the lack of BCM/GFM OTA). ?‍?

 

[circatee]

People say, "The more you know...". However, sometimes that can actually be a disadvantage, and one can get anxiety over things like this and the high voltage battery junction box...

 

[Mirak]

One has nothing to do with the other. You realize all models are effected by the hvjb . The base model only draws around 450amp, how could that ever fail when the GT is drawing 990amps. Not related.

This doesn't make sense. Yes, any model can be effected by the HVBJB weakness, but the failures appear to be connected with putting stress on the box, which is why it appears that GT models are more impacted by the problem. You cannot blithely say "not connected" just because some non-GTs have been impacted.

Ford is highly unlikely to allow GTs to put the HVBJB under even more stress, unless they replace with a more robust part.

 

[Ghost Ryder]

This doesn't make sense. Yes, any model can be effected by the HVBJB weakness, but the failures appear to be connected with putting stress on the box, which is why it appears that GT models are more impacted by the problem. You cannot blithely say "not connected" just because some non-GTs have been impacted.

Ford is highly unlikely to allow GTs to put the HVBJB under even more stress, unless they replace with a more robust part.

What we do know is that the Rally MachE will have less restrictions. Does that mean that it has a different HVBJB? Don't know yet, but once it makes it market, we'll see if there's a different part #. If not, then the HVBJB is not a limiting factor. No point in speculating until then.

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