Dan G

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I have always wondered if you are driving for a bit do the motors and batteries get warm? Can they provide engine heat?
The motors and battery can get warm as you drive. But you really have to push them hard. (Drive fast and regen hard.)

And there is no engine to get heat from! Meaning you have to replace that with another form of heater. Either a resistance heater to stand in place of an engine or a heat pump to scavenge heat from the motors/battery.

Transport Evolved did a great video on how heating in electric cars is done.
Sponsored

 

generaltso

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And there is no engine to get heat from! Meaning you have to replace that with another form of heater. Either a resistance heater to stand in place of an engine or a heat pump to scavenge heat from the motors/battery.
The MME does have the ability to scavenge heat from the motors and battery, even without a heat pump, by sharing heating loops. It won't be enough on very cold days, but will probably be good during the shoulder seasons to get a bit of warming into the cabin. We really don't know if it will be at all effective yet, but I plan to try it by leaving the E-Heat turned off until I need it.
 

methorian

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The MME does have the ability to scavenge heat from the motors and battery, even without a heat pump, by sharing heating loops. It won't be enough on very cold days, but will probably be good during the shoulder seasons to get a bit of warming into the cabin. We really don't know if it will be at all effective yet, but I plan to try it by leaving the E-Heat turned off until I need it.
This is my plan as well. Luckily I'm pretty hot-natured, so heating is no where near as important as cooling to me.

Heated seats/steering wheel will most likely be all I need. Lucky enough to garage all my vehicles at home, though it isn't at work so we'll have to see how that goes. (Longer commute, 45 miles each way, so I'm interested to see winter range. I could probably get my company to give me a 50A outlet if I deem necessary.)

On real cold days I may actually wear my jacket while driving, but I'm not too concerned about it.
 

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I have always wondered if you are driving for a bit do the motors and batteries get warm? Can they provide engine heat?
I've wondered about that too. I had assumed so, but maybe draining the battery doesn't create anywhere near the heat that charging it does?

Someone previously said it should help *some*. No idea how much though.

That was a little disappointing because that's where it's usually gonna matter. Most DCFC charging should be between road trip legs where we just rolled off the highway into a charger. I had hoped the car/battery would be sufficiently warm from that. If not, then that "10-80% in 45 minutes" might be 50-60 in cold temps. :confused:
 

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I've wondered about that too. I had assumed so, but maybe draining the battery doesn't create anywhere near the heat that charging it does?

Someone previously said it should help *some*. No idea how much though.

That was a little disappointing because that's where it's usually gonna matter. Most DCFC charging should be between road trip legs where we just rolled off the highway into a charger. I had hoped the car/battery would be sufficiently warm from that. If not, then that "10-80% in 45 minutes" might be 50-60 in cold temps. :confused:
Good question: A little googling reveals that EV motors regularly stay below boiling (100C, 212F). "Spirited" driving may increase that but under normal conditions about 80C.

Which is far cooler than an ICE.
 


dbsb3233

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Good question: A little googling reveals that EV motors regularly stay below boiling (100C, 212F). "Spirited" driving may increase that but under normal conditions about 80C.

Which is far cooler than an ICE.
I wonder where steady 75 MPH fits in there? Maybe between "spirited" and "normal"?

2 hours on cruise control on the interstate should be the typical norm before most DCFC charges. I wonder what temperature "warm enough to charge at full power" takes?

I guess we'll find out the first time we take a road trip in the MME.
 

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I'm always cold and will have the heating on as much as I like. I will have to charge the car more. What's the point suffering for a few percent battery.
 

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I'm always cold and will have the heating on as much as I like. I will have to charge the car more. What's the point suffering for a few percent battery.
Same here. If it means having to make 4 charging stops instead of 3 in a day, so be it. No way I'm spending the day in a cold (or cold-ish) car in the winter because it won't go far enough.

And if a route doesn't work for that, or that many stops becomes a PITA, I'll just drive ICE.
 

GoGoGadgetMachE

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They had me until:

“Ford gives two years of free supercharging with purchase.”

and

“Owners will undoubtedly want to call in an electrician to get superchargers installed at home but that’s true of almost every EV on the market.”

:rolleyes:
well that sucks because I just read Maxim for the articles. ?
 

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Glowing preview by Consumer Reports:

https://www.consumerreports.org/suvs/2021-ford-mustang-mach-e-review/


"We are thoroughly impressed with the Mach-E. It is quick, agile, quiet, and fun to drive. Like all EVs, its power comes on smoothly and without delay. With a robust range of more than 250 miles, it’s an EV that many people can use every day. "

This article is CRs 'initial assessment' based on a rental as they waiting for their car. Overall it's very positive. They especially liked Power, Handling, Quietness, Interior, Seat comfort, Displays.

They did not like opening rear hatch 'opening' (but missed that they could open with a foot swipe so they are in error on this point)
Break pedal feel
Standard version range of 230
Charging over 240 plug (but did say all EVs are slow charging over 240).

Pretty glowing for CR and unpexpected after their takedown of Tesla recently.

I would post the entire article but don't know what the legal ramifications are. I assume posting highlights is ok?
 
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First Drive: 2021 Ford Mustang Mach-E Is a Thrilling New Breed
Ford’s first purpose-built electric vehicle impresses drivers and onlookers
By Gabe Shenhar
Last updated: January 25, 2021
CR-Cars-InlineHero-2021-Ford-Mustang-Mach-E-f-1-21.jpg


The Mustang Mach-E is Ford’s first electric vehicle designed to be an EV from the outset, rather than spun off from an existing model. It wears the Mustang name and adapts a few styling cues from the iconic muscle car, but this is really an all-new animal.
For starters, it’s an SUV with room for five rather than a low-slung coupe. Based on our initial experience and the enthusiastic reactions from onlookers, we think Ford’s heritage-inspired approach to this expanding EV segment might pay off.

Ford first dipped its toes into the EV world in 2011 with the Focus Electric, a conversion of its compact hatchback. Now the Blue Oval re-enters the EV arena with a much more credible model that has a robust range and high-tech galore all wrapped up in a popular SUV-ish body style.
Adorned with one of Ford’s most valuable possessions, the Mustang sub-brand, the cool factor is built-in. These opening credentials should help the Mach-E battle the Tesla Model Y and a host of other upcoming EVs priced between $40,000 and $60,000. Needless to say, we have an order for our very own Mach-E, but until we get ours, we rented one from Ford to get some initial impressions.
The Mach-E comes either as a rear- or all-wheel drive and with a choice between two battery sizes, a standard 68 kWh or an optional 88 kWh. The EPA rates the standard range at 230 miles and the extended range at 300 miles for rear-drive versions. Our example, an extended range, premium AWD is rated at 270 miles; AWD versions have slightly less range than their RWD counterparts. Charge times from empty on a 240-volt connector are about 10.5 hours, according to the Environmental Protection Agency.
If you’re a Consumer Reports member, our initial assessment of the Mustang Mach-E is available to you here. We will buy our own Mach-E soon for a road test.
If you haven’t signed up yet, click below and become a member to access this full article and all our exclusive ratings and reviews for each vehicle we buy and test. Joining also gives you full access to exclusive ratings for the other products our experts evaluate in several categories, including electronics, home appliances, and more.

What we rented: 2021 Ford Mustang Mach-E Premium AWD
Powertrain: 346 hp combined from two electric motors; 1-speed direct drive; all-wheel drive; 88 kWh battery
MSRP: $49,700
Options: 88 kWh extended range battery $5,000, Rapid Red metallic paint $400.
Destination: $1,100
Total cost: $56,200 (before $7,500 federal tax credit)

CR-Cars-Inline-2021-Ford-Mustang-Mach-E-r-1-21.jpg


CR's Take
We are thoroughly impressed with the Mach-E. It is quick, agile, quiet, and fun to drive. Like all EVs, its power comes on smoothly and without delay. With a robust range of more than 250 miles, it’s an EV that many people can use every day. Unlike the original Mustang, this tall hatchback has four doors, room for five, and a rear hatch that maximizes versatility. Optional all-wheel drive broadens its appeal in the snow belt.
The car is brimming with high tech with a large touch screen, wireless connectivity, and standard active safety features. As with other EVs, long trips require extra planning to determine when and where to charge; Quick charging on the go isn’t as convenient as it is with Teslas. Ford says owners can benefit from DC-fast charging on the Electrify America and Greenlots networks and bring the battery from a 10 percent to 80 percent level in 40 minutes, but these venues are still few and far between. The Mach-E utilizes a 12 kW onboard charger, and that means owners who charge at home can benefit from having a 50 ampere home charger installed.
CR-Cars-Inline-2021-Ford-Mustang-Mach-E-int-1-21.jpg


What We Like
Power delivery: The Mach-E takes off decisively and continues to gallop in a smooth, linear manner. Three driving modes can fine-tune the driving experience, with Whisper being the quietest and most efficient. Engage presents a nice balance of efficiency and responsiveness. Unbridled unleashes a quicker throttle response, adds heft to the steering, and brings a soft growl that ramps up the harder you accelerate. There is never any shortage of power in any mode. Ford claims that this particular version can sprint from 0-60 mph in 4.8 seconds.
Handling: Taut and agile, this new breed of a Mustang tackles corners with exuberance. The tied-down body stays even-keeled, and turn-in response is quick yet not darty. The car’s rear-wheel-drive bias and low center of gravity contribute to the sporty feel. We can attest that this electric Mustang is fun to pilot on a winding road, and it’s an emissions-free pleasure to boot.
Quietness: We found the Mach-E to be very quiet. With the absence of engine noise, some EVs tend to end up having more pronounced wind and road noise. That’s not the case here.
Interior room and versatility: Having an SUV body lends itself to inherent versatility. This is the first Mustang that has four doors and seats five. Rear-seat room is ample even for passengers who are 6 feet tall or more. There’s generous room for luggage, and the built-in versatility of a hatchback is very handy for loading large items. We also appreciated the flexible, yet sturdy cargo shade.
Front trunk: Like Tesla and other electric cars, the absence of an engine in the front means there's room for additional onboard storage.
Seat comfort and driving position: We’re pleased with the faux leather seats on our rental so far. They're comfortable and supportive, but the power lumbar adjusts only in two ways, rather than the preferred four. The driving position is well sorted out, thanks to a range of seat adjustments and ample room around the driver.
Wireless connectivity: Android Auto and Apple CarPlay pair wirelessly and work seamlessly. There is also wireless charging. The FordPass app lets owners precondition the cabin before setting off and monitor the vehicle status remotely.
Viewing miles and battery state-of-charge: Unlike a Tesla, where drivers have to choose between viewing the range in terms of miles or state of charge, the Mach-E displays both clearly and conveniently.
CR-Cars-Inline-2021-Ford-Mustang-Mach-E-cargo-1-21.jpg


What We Don’t Like
Rear hatch remote opening and closing: Instead of a clear button on the driver’s door trim for opening and closing the rear hatch, the Mach-E requires you to dive into the screen and go through a three-step sequence to open the hatch from the driver’s seat. That’s not very conducive to curbside pickups, which became essential for some during the coronavirus pandemic.
Brake pedal feel: We found it rather tricky to stop smoothly in some situations. The pedal is either too touchy at low speeds or requires a hefty foot on the pedal for scrubbing off speed quickly. Most of us liked the one-pedal driving mode that takes advantage of the regenerative braking.
Standard version’s range: Depending on the version, Mach-Es come with ranges that span 230 to 300 miles. The one we tried is pegged at 270 miles by the EPA. That’s a robust range for an EV. But the standard range, at 230 miles, is about half that of a typical gas car and may not be reassuring enough to convince potential buyers to jump on the EV bandwagon.
Charging time: As is still endemic of EVs, charging time is slow. It would take more than 10 hours to fully charge the extended range version from empty. Granted, that won’t happen very often. But even bringing the battery from a 40 to 70 percent level takes 4 hours on a 240-volt connector, and that equates to 70 miles' worth of range. That said, most owners who charge overnight at home won’t have a problem.
CR-Cars-Inline-2021-Ford-Mustang-Mach-E-plug-1-21.jpg


What We’ll Keep Our Eyes On
Controls: Ford calls the Mach-E’s infotainment system Sync 4A. It includes a dazzling 15.5-inch portrait-oriented infotainment screen that looks like a giant iPad. This is your gateway to all audio, phone, climate, navigation, and EV info functions. There is a learning curve, but we found it manageable. The system responds quickly, but some functions take more than one step to perform and some require swiping to get at deeper levels of information. We applaud the physical volume and on/off knob. That said, we’ll need more experience with it for a final verdict.
Door handles: Opening the doors requires a press of a button, which in turn releases the door and pops it ajar. You then pull the door and enter the car. It sure allows for a sleek and aerodynamic effect, but we’ll have to see whether this two-step sequence retains its novelty and proves convenient even on a rainy day, when you just want to jump in.
Ride: The suspension is firm, keeping the Mach-E very steady and controlled, and contributing to its remarkable agility. But the trade-off is a ride that might be overly stiff for some. It’s still better than that of the Tesla Model Y, but we’ll wait to spend more time with our own Mach-E to get the full picture.
Advanced driving aids: Every Mach-E comes standard with Ford’s CoPilot360 Active 2.0, which includes auto emergency braking, lane departure warning and lane keep assist, blind spot warning, and rear cross traffic alert. It also includes adaptive cruise control. Ford promises an over-the-air update that will bring a limited self-driving ability helped by monitoring driver's eyes. We’re looking forward to evaluating these features as well.
R-Cars-Inline-2021-Ford-Mustang-Mach-E-frunk-11-19.jpg




CR-Cars-Author-Gabe-Shenhar-10-15.jpg

Gabe Shenhar
I'm an engineer, test driver, auto journalist, and consumer advocate rolled into one. My 25+ years of experience includes taking cars to their limits and sometimes beyond, writing thousands of road test reports, participating in grassroots motorsports, and instructing advanced driving courses. If I’m not doing laps on the test track, I’m doing laps in the pool. Follow me on Twitter. (@CRCarsGabe)
 
 




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