Wrong Battery Pack?

[SpacePony]

So, I’ve been frustrated by the low range estimate on my Mach-E4X. It’s been way off since I bought it, but because everyone says that it adjusts over time and takes a while, I’ve been patient. But I’m growing weary. Here’s where I am at:

I bought it with 17 miles and reset the driving history and trip meters at around 50. That reset the GOM to about 210 miles. I’ve now put over 1,000 miles on it, and my trip meter says I’ve averaged 3.5 mi/kWhr over those 1000 miles. BUT the highest extrapolated range I’ve ever seen is 245 miles.

if I believe Ford’s EPA estimate on the AWD with 68kWhr standard pack, you’d need to get about 3.1 mi/kWhr to hit 210 miles, and an average of 3.5 mi/kWhr is 238 miles, which is suspiciously close to the figure my car has been reporting all along, and nowhere near the 308 it should be getting if I really did use 88 kWhr at an average of 3.5.

I know everyone says it takes a while to “learn,” but over how long? If 1,000 miles isn’t enough, what is?

So is it possible my car either has the wrong battery pack installed, or is misconfigured to believe it does? Is there any way to check what the vehicle reports it has for the pack or total capacity?

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[benk016]

Your range will be completely dependent on how YOU drive, weather, the route you're on, and all kinds of factors.

Mine shows 197 at 90% charge. I've not hit over 225miles on 100% charge yet and i'm at 5,000 miles.

But, I drive fast. All the "highway" driving around here happens between 70-80mph so range is going to be way lower than the EPA states.

 

[theo1000]

Its been kinda cool in Kansas city over the past few weeks. So the GOM will always factor that into being conservative. No matter your 'mileage' which shows careful driving, the GOM will throw it all out the window over tempreture. I have the same issue on my Etron. The moment the temperature hits 60 f even for a moment the next week it is super conservative. Wait till the temperature is ~ to 70f esp. at night before thinking something is wrong.

 

[louibluey]

How does your charge power and time and % change compare?

You might have to run it way down to get numbers different enough to notice. A 10% change (charge) would probably be ambiguous (68 kW hr vs. 88 kW hr).

But, I agree with others, cool weather, fun driving with gusto, and those numbers are fine.

 

[pt19713]

So is it possible my car either has the wrong battery pack installed, or is misconfigured to believe it does? Is there any way to check what the vehicle reports it has for the pack or total capacity?

There also appears to be a reserve of about 4 kWh when you run it to zero, plus a small amount of battery degradation. Let's say you run it to"0%" and you're getting 3.5 miles/kWh, that's around 83 kWh or 290 miles. If you want to run completely dead you might be able to break 300 miles.

 

[timbop]

196 miles at 80% comes out to 245mi at 100%. The range estimate is low, wrong, and completely underestimated. It means NOTHING. It is a guess.

They did not put the wrong battery in. If you take an hour or so drive and note the start %, end %, mileage, and mi/kwh number you can confirm that the battery is 88kwh

 

[Murse-In-Airy]

you must have the wrong battery. This is my ER AWD with almost 2000 miles on it. It has certainly learned my driving by now. It has also learned that we had a freeze warning last night.

I, however, have learned that the range guesser is just a guess. And that if Imultiply my 2.8 miles/kWh by my 88 kWh battery. Then I can go 246 miles. Which is only 52 miles further than my range guesser would say at 100%.
So what I’ve really learned is that math isn’t useless when you’re an EV owner.

 

[SpacePony]

This is my 4th EV, I’m aware that that the GOM is a guess and not an absolute, but what I’m really trying to say is that it’s only affirming what I’ve seemed to experience: that this pack doesn’t seem to report having 88 usable kWhrs.

I’m pretty damn good with math (I have an accidental math minor), which is why this has been so frustrating. The only long trip I’ve made (≈100 miles), at 2.9kWhr, I did the calculations and it worked out to be about a 70 kWhr pack, which is an acceptable deviation when you have no decimals and single decimals to work with. I intend to make a longer trip soon, butI don’t want to miscalculate if I believe I have 33% more pack than I really do.

60 degrees is not that cool (and is the temp where my Volt was most comfortable), and the LOWEST figure I’ve ever seen on a trip is 2.9 after a highway trip of about 100 miles at 70+ MPH, most of the time I’m at 3.5 or 4.1. And the fact that it’s NEVER shown more than 245 extrapolated miles while still getting a lifetime average of 3.5 makes me suspicious.

I drive slow and smoothly and accelerate moderately, I know how to get dang good range, and at which temps the range suffers, I almost never drive “fun.” And it parks all day and every night in an attached garage where it’s never below 50°F even in winter, so it’s not using a lot of energy for the HVAC (typically 4% or less). Does it check the temperature outsideof its own sensors?

Again, though, I ask…is there a way to check what the vehicle reports as it’s pack size or capacity?

 

[DaMeatMan]

So, I’ve been frustrated by the low range estimate on my Mach-E4X. It’s been way off since I bought it, but because everyone says that it adjusts over time and takes a while, I’ve been patient. But I’m growing weary. Here’s where I am at:

I bought it with 17 miles and reset the driving history and trip meters at around 50. That reset the GOM to about 210 miles. I’ve now put over 1,000 miles on it, and my trip meter says I’ve averaged 3.5 mi/kWhr over those 1000 miles. BUT the highest extrapolated range I’ve ever seen is 245 miles.

if I believe Ford’s EPA estimate on the AWD with 68kWhr standard pack, you’d need to get about 3.1 mi/kWhr to hit 210 miles, and an average of 3.5 mi/kWhr is 238 miles, which is suspiciously close to the figure my car has been reporting all along, and nowhere near the 308 it should be getting if I really did use 88 kWhr at an average of 3.5.

I know everyone says it takes a while to “learn,” but over how long? If 1,000 miles isn’t enough, what is?

So is it possible my car either has the wrong battery pack installed, or is misconfigured to believe it does? Is there any way to check what the vehicle reports it has for the pack or total capacity?

If you've put this much range on your vehicle, I'm actually quite surprised that you haven't taken the time to measure how many Kwh your putting into the battery to answer this question for yourself.

Take your battery down to 50% and charge it up to 100% on a charger that gives you a measure of Kwh dispensed, and you should be able to get your answer fairly easily. Keep in mind there will be losses of about 10% or so.

But essentially if you are at 50% you should see about 34Kwh - 38Kwh delivered from the charger if you have a 68Kwh battery.

If you have an 88Kwh battery pack then you should see about 44Kwh - 48Kwh delivered from the charger when charging from 50% to 100%.

If the numbers match up, then you need to start looking at the way your driving, and maybe spend some time looking at the "where did my energy go" to see how much of that energy is actually going into moving you forward, versus climate etc.. I would also pay close attention to your acceleration and speed.

 

[louibluey]

If you've put this much range on your vehicle, I'm actually quite surprised that you haven't taken the time to measure how many Kwh your putting into the battery to answer this question for yourself.

Take your battery down to 50% and charge it up to 100% on a charger that gives you a measure of Kwh dispensed, and you should be able to get your answer fairly easily. Keep in mind there will be losses of about 10% or so.

But essentially if you are at 50% you should see about 34Kwh - 38Kwh delivered from the charger if you have a 68Kwh battery.

If you have an 88Kwh battery pack then you should see about 44Kwh - 48Kwh delivered from the charger when charging from 50% to 100%.

If the numbers match up, then you need to start looking at the way your driving, and maybe spend some time looking at the "where did my energy go" to see how much of that energy is actually going into moving you forward, versus climate etc.. I would also pay close attention to your acceleration and speed.

exactly, said better than I did, but same idea. You don't even need an EVSE that reports kWhr, if you know what your EVSE is rated at, just use that power, and time, and some loss. If you charge from 20% or a bit more to 80% or 90% the answer should be clear.

OTOH, if your question is, Is there some where in the set up pages to see the battery size, maybe someone like Sam knows. Even then, what if someone just entered it wrong (as opposed to a computer "electronic read" of a type of module).

At some point, there must be some Ford dealer diagnostic report / test routine for the traction battery. Highly unlikely that you got the wrong battery. A battery that does not meet spec for whatever reason, also unlikely, but certainly not impossible. (Also a former Volt driver, both gen 1 and gen 2, fine EVs!)

 

[SpacePony]

If you've put this much range on your vehicle, I'm actually quite surprised that you haven't taken the time to measure how many Kwh your putting into the battery to answer this question for yourself.

You’re right that I haven’t charged and measured the input (pre-charging loss) numbers, and so far I’ve only charged at home, and I have an ancient 1st Gen “Voltec” charger from 2010 That doesn’t give me those numbers (and frustrating the Ford app charging log only goes by “miles added”, and doesn’t give the starting and ending percentages. I do plan to do that soon, first time I take a road trip.

If the numbers match up, then you need to start looking at the way your driving, and maybe spend some time looking at the "where did my energy go" to see how much of that energy is actually going into moving you forward, versus climate etc.. I would also pay close attention to your acceleration and speed.

Yeah, I can send you screenshots of that; I get good marks. Again, I’m a sad slow 4th Gen EV driver. I’m averaging 3.5 mi/kWhr despite the non-California Kansas City temperatures.

 

[SpacePony]

At some point, there must be some Ford dealer diagnostic report / test routine for the traction battery. Highly unlikely that you got the wrong battery. A battery that does not meet spec for whatever reason, also unlikely, but certainly not impossible. (Also a former Volt driver, both gen 1 and gen 2, fine EVs!)

At my charger’s slow speeds, the good news is there is no charge curve! Volts are fantastic vehicles, I had a Gen1, then and i3, and then back to the Gen2.

But honestly, other than my suspicion of the battery pack, the Mach-E is easily my favorite vehicle I’ve ever owned, and I’m pleased as punch with it. I’ve not had any of the issues anyone many others have, and it drives like a dream, but is also a great kid hauler.

 

[ChasingCoral]

Very simple answer: don't rely on the guess-o-meter! It doesn't know where you plan to go or the conditions it needs to calculate the actual range it can go. It will always be highly conservative.

Get in the car, turn on navigation, and pick a spot 200 miles away. See if it will navigate you there without charging. How much range will it have when you get there? If it can't get there without charging try shorter distances like 175 miles and 150 miles.

Now try with someplace 225 miles away, then 250, then 275, then 300. This will tell you the range the car predicts when it knows the distance, likely speed, altitude changes, and weather conditions of your drive.

You can do the same thing with your normal driving. Charge up and drive it for a while. How far do you go before charging and how much range does it think is left?

Don't trust the GOM for anything other than a low-ball estimate. Then be glad Ford chose to do it this way. I've hopped in my Leaf trusting the GOM would get me somewhere, only to learn the GOM was based on slow around town driving and my battery won't get me where I need to go on my planned 70 mph interstate drive. I'd rather start out with a conservative GOM than a wildly optimistic one!

 

[CivilJeep]

I think it's worth your time to verify the battery pack size. Yes, the range is an estimate, but my estimate is nearly 100 miles more than yours, and we have the same vehicle. It doesn't sound that far fetched for a brand new model vehicle to have a mixup in the options on the assembly line, especially one that cannot be easily verified by visual inspection. If it were me, for my own peace of mind, I would verify the 88kwh battery pack.

 

[SpacePony]

exactly, said better than I did, but same idea. You don't even need an EVSE that reports kWhr, if you know what your EVSE is rated at, just use that power, and time, and some loss. If you charge from 20% or a bit more to 80% or 90% the answer should be clear.

Oh, which brings up a secondary question. In the FordPass charging log, does anyone know if the “energy” it reports is kWh from the wall, or kWh into the pack?

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