This bothers me...

jhalkias

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That's why one of the selling points of BEVs (for people that can charge at home) is that "You don't have to go to the gas stations anymore!". That's a nice extra perk. And that's talking about a 2-minute gas refuel. If it's considered a negative to have to go do a 2-minute refuel, it's certainly a way bigger negative to have to do 30-minute ones.
Exactly.
I have to fill up at least twice a week now. When I do, it is not just the "fill up" part. While I do it on the way home, it averages taking me about 10 minutes longer to get home after work. So . . . 20 minutes a week times the 48 weeks I have to do it . . . that's 16 hours I get back - and that for now I don't have to sanitize my hands after touching the pump, and worry if anyone skimmed my credit card. I can just go home and plug in. I will gladly spend some of that 16 hours to have lunch on a road trip and relax before getting on the road again. Of course I will also have to find a place to juice up once I am where I am going too.
 

SJ_Okay

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We all know the US average is around 30 miles a day... even less in the UK, around 20 miles. For anyone driving 30 miles or less a day, which is most people, it's a once a week charge stop, or less. With a charging routine, it really doesn't need to be an inconvenience. It's a small lifestyle change which offers way more positives than negatives and in my opinion that is enough for the slow charge times to not be an issue for majority of drivers (30 miles or less).
 

EVer

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We all know the US average is around 30 miles a day... even less in the UK, around 20 miles. For anyone driving 30 miles or less a day, which is most people, it's a once a week charge stop, or less. With a charging routine, it really doesn't need to be an inconvenience. It's a small lifestyle change which offers way more positives than negatives and in my opinion that is enough for the slow charge times to not be an issue for majority of drivers (30 miles or less).

I agree. I commute 37 miles round trip and charge using L1.
 

dbsb3233

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I agree. I commute 37 miles round trip and charge using L1.
I think we're talking different things here. I completely agree about L1/L2 charging. Meaning you're plugging in at home (or work) for 8+ hours while the car is parked, and you don't have to check on it or go move it after 30-40 minutes. Park it and forget it. That's perfect.

What we were discussing is L3 charging at retail stations, where you have to babysit the car by either sitting in it for 30-40 minutes every week or half-week, or finding something to do nearby (like eating at the same McDonalds 50 times/yr, or whatever happens to be next to the charging station).
 

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What we were discussing is L3 charging at retail stations, where you have to babysit the car by either sitting in it for 30-40 minutes every week or half-week, or finding something to do nearby (like eating at the same McDonalds 50 times/yr, or whatever happens to be next to the charging station).
Got it.

If public charging were my only option, I'd probably not buy an EV.
 

SJ_Okay

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Got it.

If public charging were my only option, I'd probably not buy an EV.
Hypothetically, and purely for my curiosity, what if your commute was a 25 mile round trip and yearly you did 2000 miles less than you currently do... let’s say this put you in the position of only needing a public charger once a week? Would you feel the same?
 

dbsb3233

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Hypothetically, and purely for my curiosity, what if your commute was a 25 mile round trip and yearly you did 2000 miles less than you currently do... let’s say this put you in the position of only needing a public charger once a week? Would you feel the same?
That's a great question. It basically gets down to this... How many lengthy retail charging sessions (say, 30+ minutes) is one willing to put up with to choose a BEV over an ICE or PHEV? (If they can't charge at home/work/school.)

For me the answer is probably "a few each year". That puts it about on par with taking my current car into a Grease Monkey or Jiffy Lube for an oil change a few times each year.

But if I had to take a car in for a 30-minute Jiffy Lube every week, there's no way I'd choose that car.
 

dbsb3233

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I'll throw another wrench in that works too -- cost. Retail L3 charging (non-Tesla) tends to be at least 3x the price of residential home charging. It can completely wipe out the long-term savings that helped offset the extra cost of a BEV in the first place.

Those figures vary from country-to-country and state-to-state, but that's the general trend. In my case, my Escape gets about 25 MPG and gas around here averages about $2.50/gal. That works out to $0.10/mile, or about $10k per 100k miles. Meanwhile my incremental home electricity rate is $0.105 per kWh. Figure around 3.3 miles/kWh (est) mileage for the Mach-e. That's about $0.03/mile, or $3000 per 100k miles. A $7000 savings over 100k miles by charging at home rather than L3 retail..

Even after tax credits, the Mach-e is roughly $10k more expensive to buy than a comparable ICE vehicle.
 
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Hypothetically, and purely for my curiosity, what if your commute was a 25 mile round trip and yearly you did 2000 miles less than you currently do... let’s say this put you in the position of only needing a public charger once a week? Would you feel the same?
I haven't parsed it down to the go/no-go line. I'd possibly be willing to do once-a-week charging depending on duration, but to me "fueling" at home is among the biggest draws of EV.
 

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No way in hell I would buy a BEV if I didn't have VERY convenient access to an L2 charger (like, my garage.) Not with the current infrastructure and charging times, at least.
 
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  • Thread starter
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Wonder why Ford decided not to do the heat pump thing to help with winter usage efficiency. Any ideas?
 

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