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Is the Mach-E really 7 years behind Tesla?

Woeo

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Switch the ball?
Gee, you can't even remember what you wrote. You probably should get that checked out. You are the one that insulted another member for being "Ill Informed" and You are the one that used residential heat pumps as an example. I responded to that example. Let me refresh your memory about what you wrote:


Where in your post did you write an air to air heat pump? You didn't. You're post included all heat pumps. BTW, tens of thousands of dollars??? Where did you pick up that number since you didn't even know about Geothermal? Do a little more googling after you read this thread. Perhaps some contractors charge that much, my buddy just paid about $12k.

As far as your statements being accurate, no they are not and you clearly don't understand heat pumps nor have you actually read this thread. If you understood heat pumps or read this thread you'd understand that a heat pump is just one component of a HVAC system. The mere fact that you talk about a heat pump drawing heat from the air proves you either haven't read the information here, or you can't comprehend it. There are other places to draw heat from when the air is too cold.

If you want to discuss HVAC intelligently, read the information here, watch the videos. If you simply want to make an uninformed rant, please continue as you are. Let me help you a little bit. A heat pump isn't an entire HVAC system. It is one part of that system. How the entire system is designed determines how effective and efficient it will be. Like a heat pump in a geothermal system is effective far below freezing, a properly designed HVAC system that includes a heat pump can be effective far below freezing. Read the thread, perhaps you'll learn something. Or do you think you know more about automotive manufacturing than one of the preeminent authorities in the field? You with what, zero knowledge and zero experience? Yeah, you're probably a lot more informed than Sandy Munro. Duh.
I feel sad for you.
 

Jolteon

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Not true. Most BEV customers will dirve in local areaas, and very few need to travel for from their homes and need a hotel. And if they do travel, renting a hybrid for just one trip is easier and less bothersome than searching and waiting for a charger.
Only if you assume "BEV customers" are a special subset of vehicle customers willing to pay more for a more restrictive use experience. That's simply not true. Nobody is going to rent a car for a trip, they're going to use the car they've already paid for. I've never heard of any Tesla owner who doesn't take their own car on a trip. I mean maybe a i-MiEV ownr would rent for a trip, but no Mach-E owner is going to do this. Why would you ever buy a car you didn't want to trip with?

BEV customers span all ranges of people. There's nobody for whom a BEV isn't the right choice, and that includes road trippers.
 

RonTCat

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Interesting article on Tesla problems.

Demand Hell: Tesla Cuts Prices In China For The Seventh Time This Year

https://www.zerohedge.com/markets/demand-hell-tesla-cuts-prices-china-seventh-time-year
This is just normal competitive forces. Musk is smart, and sees the writing on the wall. He is running out of customer base at his current price point. If he doesn't get to a vehicle cost that is affordable to the other 95% of the market, he knows he's in trouble. It's not a knock on Tesla, they are a great company, it's the harsh financial reality.

What are his options, in the mean time, to survive?
Sell to the upper income folks around the world, not just North America... check.
Sell emission credits.. check.
Leverage the stock price... check.
Sell his competitive advantage, i.e. who wants to buy some batteries! ... check.

Also, saying Tesla is 7 years ahead in vehicles is like saying they are 7 years behind in manufacturing... both are untrue.
 

silverelan

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Not true. Most BEV customers will dirve in local areaas, and very few need to travel for from their homes and need a hotel. And if they do travel, renting a hybrid for just one trip is easier and less bothersome than searching and waiting for a charger.
I have no intention of renting a gas car for road trips. I'm buying the Mach-E specifically because it has the minimum combination of range and recharging speeds needed to be a viable replacement for a gas car.
 

Jolteon

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I have no intention of renting a gas car for road trips. I'm buying the Mach-E specifically because it has the minimum combination of range and recharging speeds needed to be a viable replacement for a gas car.
Exactly. The idea of a $50,000 "city car" and then renting for trips is ludicrous, IMO. Just buy a Leaf then.

My Mach-E will take me across the country whenever I feel like it, without a moment's hesitation.
 

Thevanin

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I just saw that video. Not having a manual release for all the doors seems like a bad choice.
 

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Tesla taking many hits with so many problems still. People are so in love with the blind fandom they are accepting so many problems.

Right now in China, tesla sales are so bad they are getting ready to idle the plant for another two weeks after being idle for 1 week. Supply at the tesla dealer in china is so high they are sending them to the European market and other places.

We have all been there as a kid. become a fan of a toy or item and then when you get it, well it's really not that great.
 

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Cnote

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Only if you assume "BEV customers" are a special subset of vehicle customers willing to pay more for a more restrictive use experience. That's simply not true. Nobody is going to rent a car for a trip, they're going to use the car they've already paid for. I've never heard of any Tesla owner who doesn't take their own car on a trip. I mean maybe a i-MiEV ownr would rent for a trip, but no Mach-E owner is going to do this. Why would you ever buy a car you didn't want to trip with?

BEV customers span all ranges of people. There's nobody for whom a BEV isn't the right choice, and that includes road trippers.
I'm not planning on going road tripping with the mache e because that's not why I'm buying it. Just to go to Dallas for example would take an extra couple of hours, so I will be using my remaining ice vehicle (which I'm fortunate to be able to keep). Even if I didn't have a backup ice vehicle I wouldn't mind renting as I don't road trip a ton. Not everyone is buying a bev as their all purpose car, especially because for some of us the range is just not there yet. It will be perfect for commuting and getting around town.
 

jhalkias

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I really hate knocking Tesla because of all that they have done for the EV market and acceptance. I really do not think we have the Mach E anytime soon without Tesla there. But now the real game is beginning for them. They had a niche, that is now about to burst into the mainstream. With Ford, VW, and other OEM's now entering the market with strong products, Tesla is going to have to also focus on their quality, their customers, and the strength of their product.

If they don't get over their own arrogance, pretty soon they will be putting CCS cables on all of those Superchargers to survive. And don't get me wrong, I do hope they get over their own arrogance and are a strong competitor - if they do, we all win.

I really enjoy Sandy Munro's videos, but for the life of me, (and I am NOT an engineer) cannot figure out why he has become so enamored with them and with Elon. I get the innovation part, but innovating alone without a strong product does not get you sales.
 

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Only if you assume "BEV customers" are a special subset of vehicle customers willing to pay more for a more restrictive use experience. That's simply not true. Nobody is going to rent a car for a trip, they're going to use the car they've already paid for. I've never heard of any Tesla owner who doesn't take their own car on a trip. I mean maybe a i-MiEV ownr would rent for a trip, but no Mach-E owner is going to do this. Why would you ever buy a car you didn't want to trip with?

BEV customers span all ranges of people. There's nobody for whom a BEV isn't the right choice, and that includes road trippers.
Well that's just wrong on a lot of counts.

There's already some BEV owners renting cars for long trips. (Although more common is simply taking a different car they already own, as BEV owners tend to be on the well-off side due to their higher prices.)

There's already people not buying a BEV because it's not a good fit for them (particularly if they don't have an easy way to charge at home, which is the primary advantage of owning a BEV).

Doesn't mean many people don't use them on road trips. But saying "nobody is going to rent a car" is just wrong.
 
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TheLight75

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The heat pump is only included on Kona’s shipped to Canada. I would have liked one seeing as how I’m in New England. 🥶
 

bluestarct

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Exactly. The idea of a $50,000 "city car" and then renting for trips is ludicrous, IMO. Just buy a Leaf then.

My Mach-E will take me across the country whenever I feel like it, without a moment's hesitation.
I'll rent a car for certain trips that are business related. Many times the rental is less expensive than the depreciation factor on the cars I own. For example, if I have to drive to Oklahoma City to visit our operations there, I am renting. Cost for three days plus gas (about $100-120) is so much less than the 900 miles roundtrip on my car (soon to be a MACH E) at $0.575 per mile or $517.

I also travel a lot (well I did before COVID) and so I have over 20 free days with National now. Using those free days for family trips is awesome. We have rented Expeditions or Tahoes on ski trips to Colorado and New Mexico. It us much easier for four people and their ski stuff to spread out in a big SUV. Sometimes I use the free days, sometimes I pay for the rentals. It just depends on cost.

Just because I'll own a BEV, doesn't mean that I won't rent a car.
 



 









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